A Cranwell education
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Over the hill (and far away)
Posts: 396
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
AA
Dartmouth January 1969 term had Malaysians as well as all the others you mentioned. Was the Singaporean you shared a cabin with of Indian ethnicity? I too shared a cabin (along with 5 other cadets) with a Singaporean (Indian) for the first 6 months of '69 - what a coincidence.
As for the Royal Air Force side, I attended OCTU Henlow from February 1972 for 3 or 4 months; there were several Nigerian cadets there at the time (Green/Brown squadron), some of whom gave the impression of being related to some form of royalty, or tribal chiefs (along with some who were not). The first bunch, tall indolent and arrogant fellows, needed a lot of motivation to become team players.
Mister B
Dartmouth January 1969 term had Malaysians as well as all the others you mentioned. Was the Singaporean you shared a cabin with of Indian ethnicity? I too shared a cabin (along with 5 other cadets) with a Singaporean (Indian) for the first 6 months of '69 - what a coincidence.
As for the Royal Air Force side, I attended OCTU Henlow from February 1972 for 3 or 4 months; there were several Nigerian cadets there at the time (Green/Brown squadron), some of whom gave the impression of being related to some form of royalty, or tribal chiefs (along with some who were not). The first bunch, tall indolent and arrogant fellows, needed a lot of motivation to become team players.
Mister B
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: 23, Railway Cuttings, East Cheam
Age: 68
Posts: 3,115
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
At Cosford I had Omanis, Malays Saudis and Nigerians on the techy courses. They may have been others that I can't remember. Omanis were great guys, all drank like fish; Malays were equally great and excellent at table football and badminton. Funnily enough when at Italian AF bases I always found the Italians excellent at table football as well.
Phil, didn't you know that all Saudis are related to some prince or other?...
Or so they like to tell you. They were OK but keen to try and er, offer financial incentives...The Nigerians on the whole always seemed to me like they didn't want to be there. They didn't smile a lot and kept very much to themeselves. As HTB says a bit of an arrogant bunch, although what they had to be arrogant about was a little bemusing.
Phil, didn't you know that all Saudis are related to some prince or other?...
Or so they like to tell you. They were OK but keen to try and er, offer financial incentives...The Nigerians on the whole always seemed to me like they didn't want to be there. They didn't smile a lot and kept very much to themeselves. As HTB says a bit of an arrogant bunch, although what they had to be arrogant about was a little bemusing.
To answer the question, The MOD, as part of a wider cross-government initiative, identifies countries that we want to be/need to be close to for strategic reasons. Through 'International defence Training' places at BRNC/RMAS/RAFC/ACSC/RCDS are offered to a number of countries. Some places are free - for poorer countries; some are charged at the full whack (ACSC is GBP60,000, I believe). RMAS also offer private places for the kids of wealthy despots but they still have to meet the entry criteria and to pass - apparently. Clearly, the Middle East is a big market, but so to is Afghanistan and parts of Africa. The students should meet UK entry standards, and there is particular emphasis on English Language competency - students are held back or sent home if they don't reach an appropriate functional standard.
25% of ACSC is allocated to foreign students; 75% of RCDS members are outwith the UK. Clearly, the IOT courses are a long-term investment from an influence perspective; RCDS returns are a bit closer.
Furthermore, there are exchange students and DS slots at ACSC level with the AUSCANZUK community, the wider Commonwealth and a number of other NATO partners, especially France.
25% of ACSC is allocated to foreign students; 75% of RCDS members are outwith the UK. Clearly, the IOT courses are a long-term investment from an influence perspective; RCDS returns are a bit closer.
Furthermore, there are exchange students and DS slots at ACSC level with the AUSCANZUK community, the wider Commonwealth and a number of other NATO partners, especially France.
Last edited by Whenurhappy; 28th May 2014 at 08:36.
Gentleman Aviator
One recalls some Singaporean ATC students at Shawbs. They were keen as mustard, very good and amazingly hardworking - spending as much spare time in the Sims as they could.
Turns out they had to lodge a bond with the Singers Government for the cost of the course - about £50k then IIRC - and if they failed the course, they paid for it!! Now that's what I call an incentive to succeed!
Turns out they had to lodge a bond with the Singers Government for the cost of the course - about £50k then IIRC - and if they failed the course, they paid for it!! Now that's what I call an incentive to succeed!
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 63
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Whilst tracking down pilots of our JP XS186 we found several Manby instructors that noted mainly Saudi trainees at RAF Manby in the 60's, training up on the Mk4 JP's before going onto Lightning courses, i assume back home?
We recorded one story for posterity that noted a trip out over the Humber and North Yorks coast, as was often the case. The student had a fairly limiting aptitude and was asked to turn back to Manby, only to head off north-east towards Norway......luckily the instructor was watching...........
Our intrepid instructor refused to progress the student, but by means unknown he went on to pass.
The instructor learned that a couple of years on from the guys departure he had been executed for treason........
We recorded one story for posterity that noted a trip out over the Humber and North Yorks coast, as was often the case. The student had a fairly limiting aptitude and was asked to turn back to Manby, only to head off north-east towards Norway......luckily the instructor was watching...........
Our intrepid instructor refused to progress the student, but by means unknown he went on to pass.
The instructor learned that a couple of years on from the guys departure he had been executed for treason........
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nigerian Air Force
1969 at Colerne we had 2 Nigerian officers, a Major and a Lieutenant. The Major wore a No 1 similar to our own but with a dazzling array of bling. The Lt wore a 'hairy mary' battle dress same as us erks! Word was that the Major belonged to a higher caste and regardless that they were the only Nigerians around for miles, they never walked alongside each other with the Lt trailing at a respectful distance behind
Whilst tracking down pilots of our JP XS186 we found several Manby instructors that noted mainly Saudi trainees at RAF Manby in the 60's, training up on the Mk4 JP's before going onto Lightning courses, i assume back home?
No, they did their conversions at 226 OCU 1968/9 at Coltishall. Never seen an Officers' Mess car park so full of Ferraris, Maseratis and Lamborghinis. And the parties when one went solo! Of course they were such devout followers of Islam that alcohol turned to water as it touched their lips.
At Yatesbury in '61 their was a Middle Eastern course, and during it there was a coup at home. They were confined to their hut and marched under guard to meals until a diplomat and Imam from the new regime arrived, had them paraded on the square and one by one had them swear loyalty to the new lot on the Q'ran; all resumed then to normality.
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Surrey
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Takes all sorts
I had a class of ‘Foreign Nationals’ at Halton which included several Malays.
Six of them cooked my wife and me a traditional Malay curry and insisted we ate it with our fingers, it was delicious, they were great people.
One of the other Malay seemed to have a rather large chip on his shoulder ignoring everything said to him and was often insolent. I asked him why he had such an attitude; he replied, “You British raped our country exploiting our rubber plantations for your own wealth”. I told him that without British involvement there would have been no rubber in Malaysia as the British had introduced it after stealing plants from South America; this did not appease him.
He was very arrogant with our Flt Lt (who had ex ranker small man syndrome); he complained to the embassy. Three large gentlemen took the airman to a classroom from which he reappeared looking a little worse for wear! He was eventually repatriated without completing the course.
Takes all sorts!
Six of them cooked my wife and me a traditional Malay curry and insisted we ate it with our fingers, it was delicious, they were great people.
One of the other Malay seemed to have a rather large chip on his shoulder ignoring everything said to him and was often insolent. I asked him why he had such an attitude; he replied, “You British raped our country exploiting our rubber plantations for your own wealth”. I told him that without British involvement there would have been no rubber in Malaysia as the British had introduced it after stealing plants from South America; this did not appease him.
He was very arrogant with our Flt Lt (who had ex ranker small man syndrome); he complained to the embassy. Three large gentlemen took the airman to a classroom from which he reappeared looking a little worse for wear! He was eventually repatriated without completing the course.
Takes all sorts!
Cranwell, early / mid 60’s there were several Pakistani Air Force cadets.
The Saudis were there during the mid 60’s where I recall supervising an arrival ceremony of ‘cutting grass with nail scissors’ – at least the two princes had a sense of humour, more than some from that part of world. Our paths crossed again at Coltishall where they flew their own Lightnings before taking them to Saudi.
I met one of the Princes again many years later at Farnbourough – I was trying to sell something, he was the minister of planes, military, buying, etc; somewhat surprised and concerned I was met with “I know you” greeting, but he declined my invitation to fly or buy.
The Saudis were there during the mid 60’s where I recall supervising an arrival ceremony of ‘cutting grass with nail scissors’ – at least the two princes had a sense of humour, more than some from that part of world. Our paths crossed again at Coltishall where they flew their own Lightnings before taking them to Saudi.
I met one of the Princes again many years later at Farnbourough – I was trying to sell something, he was the minister of planes, military, buying, etc; somewhat surprised and concerned I was met with “I know you” greeting, but he declined my invitation to fly or buy.
One of the Pakistanis on my Entry declined a yard of ale on his 21st on religious grounds, but offered to drink a yard of coca cola. What a mistake - stomach swelled like he was pregnant, and made it to the window just in time!
Red On, Green On
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Between the woods and the water
Age: 24
Posts: 6,487
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Dartmouth January 1969 term had Malaysians as well as all the others you mentioned. Was the Singaporean you shared a cabin with of Indian ethnicity? I too shared a cabin (along with 5 other cadets) with a Singaporean (Indian) for the first 6 months of '69 - what a coincidence.
ISTR there was also a Pakistani QFI on 1 Sqn in mid 60s - nipped off home for the Indo-Pakistan war and came back with a bigger grin on his face than ever. ?Rash Wamiq?
Thread Starter
Well, I hadn't intended to create such a long-runner.
Are these people there to do the same IOT course (or whatever it is you do at Halton) as local newbies, or some sort of specialised syllabus that their home nation specifically needs them to do? ACSC seems to be the RAF equivalent of what the Army would call staff college.
And - forgive me for noticing - but more than a few of the reminiscences here are what good-natured banter might describe as classic in nature. Are things still the same?
P
Are these people there to do the same IOT course (or whatever it is you do at Halton) as local newbies, or some sort of specialised syllabus that their home nation specifically needs them to do? ACSC seems to be the RAF equivalent of what the Army would call staff college.
And - forgive me for noticing - but more than a few of the reminiscences here are what good-natured banter might describe as classic in nature. Are things still the same?
P