VG SpaceShipTwo Test Flight
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t43562,
It can. It's a question of managing that process.
No indeed, you'd want it just as far from a city as the launch site. Kerosene is not the most explosive material. I understand that hundreds of tons is often to be found traveling over major cities on a minute by minute basis.
The great thing about SpaceX is that they've spotted that the booster returns 20 times lighter than it departed, which makes it a rather less threatening object on the way down than on the way up.
The sales material might boast an impressive mass margin, but in reality, it's worrying. The structure to hold all that hydrogen is large, and needs to cope with quite some dynamic pressure on ascent.
Good luck to them, but as time marches on, I suspect they're going to need it.
whether the Hydrogen can absorb all the heat
Also not something you want to have within many many miles of a city
The great thing about SpaceX is that they've spotted that the booster returns 20 times lighter than it departed, which makes it a rather less threatening object on the way down than on the way up.
The sales material might boast an impressive mass margin, but in reality, it's worrying. The structure to hold all that hydrogen is large, and needs to cope with quite some dynamic pressure on ascent.
Good luck to them, but as time marches on, I suspect they're going to need it.
SABRE
@awblain
If you take the time to read the discussions that I pointed to you'd have most of your doubts addressed better than someone like me can. I'd just be repeating them badly. It depends on whether you want to give it a chance or are set on imagining a SpaceX-only future.
@dead_pan
As for millions of welds - I'm not 100% sure what that's in reference to but they have built full size head exchanger modules using brazing to let them perform many welds at once. The heat exchangers are the super-duper-technology-that-makes-it-all-possible and are indeed expensive and difficult to make and that's what they've spent many years developing and what they aim to build themselves while the airframe etc is taken on by a company big enough to do that.
'Flogging it to the Chinese' appears to not be on their agenda but this doesn't mean they will not look outside Britain for things they can't get done inside. e.g. the latest news item is that RE has signed a Cooperative Research and Development Agreement ('CRADA') with the Air Force Research Laboratory.
If you take the time to read the discussions that I pointed to you'd have most of your doubts addressed better than someone like me can. I'd just be repeating them badly. It depends on whether you want to give it a chance or are set on imagining a SpaceX-only future.
@dead_pan
As for millions of welds - I'm not 100% sure what that's in reference to but they have built full size head exchanger modules using brazing to let them perform many welds at once. The heat exchangers are the super-duper-technology-that-makes-it-all-possible and are indeed expensive and difficult to make and that's what they've spent many years developing and what they aim to build themselves while the airframe etc is taken on by a company big enough to do that.
'Flogging it to the Chinese' appears to not be on their agenda but this doesn't mean they will not look outside Britain for things they can't get done inside. e.g. the latest news item is that RE has signed a Cooperative Research and Development Agreement ('CRADA') with the Air Force Research Laboratory.
Re the number of welds, I read this somewhere recently (New Scientist?). Either way, RE have an enormous technical challenge ahead of them - by way of example, from Fine Tubes web-site, who are supplying tubes for the heat exchanger:
As for the US Air Force contract, presumably the people previously involved with the X-30 have all retired...
Each engine will use over 2,000km of tubing
Future of Skylon talk - 22 January - change of venue
There is a talk at the Wheatsheaf hall in Vauxhall by Mark Hempsell on Wed 22nd January. If you know about this already then the venue has changed to let more people attend.
You'll need to buy tickets. Mark Hempsell consults for Reaction Engines and was their Future Programmes Director until quite recently.
http://www.bis-space.com/2013/11/26/...ture-of-skylon
You'll need to buy tickets. Mark Hempsell consults for Reaction Engines and was their Future Programmes Director until quite recently.
http://www.bis-space.com/2013/11/26/...ture-of-skylon
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Space Tourism
I know this has appeared before so lay off me Beags!
Richard Branson - space tourism - hotel in orbit - luxurious accommodation - superb cuisine - but no atmosphere - boom boom!
Rgds SOS
P.S. How interesting that Alan Bond's team, in the 21st century, have developed a truly earth shattering concept, which owes so much to the ideas of Max Planck published in the 19th century. The science seems to fall into the Goldilocks porridge bowl but the engineering is seriously tough.
Richard Branson - space tourism - hotel in orbit - luxurious accommodation - superb cuisine - but no atmosphere - boom boom!
Rgds SOS
P.S. How interesting that Alan Bond's team, in the 21st century, have developed a truly earth shattering concept, which owes so much to the ideas of Max Planck published in the 19th century. The science seems to fall into the Goldilocks porridge bowl but the engineering is seriously tough.
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Originally Posted by Dragartist
According to my membership card we have Richard Varvill (Tech Director Reaction Engines) coming to Cambridge RAeS on 13th March. Do we expect a similar lecture? I do hope so.
Really good to meet you last Thursday ... great lecture from Richard Varvill ... with quite a few interesting questions coming from the floor post his presentation.
I really would recommend the Cambridge RAeS evening events to other PPRuNe members ... superb value and a great setting in the Engineering College.
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Coffman,
I'm really enviousness you got to enjoy the talk, I would have loved to have been there but just to far away. How are they doing for funding now, did they get backing from the UK government and EASA? Did you get any sense of how secure the project is both technically and financially? Be great if you could share anything.
I'm really enviousness you got to enjoy the talk, I would have loved to have been there but just to far away. How are they doing for funding now, did they get backing from the UK government and EASA? Did you get any sense of how secure the project is both technically and financially? Be great if you could share anything.
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Guys I am still buzzing after Thursday evening. What a fantastic lecture. Quite technical. I wish I had listened with more intent when we were doing hard sums on my Propulsion pre Employment Couse at Sleaford tech. All these equations presented may have made more sense. The venue was Cambridge University and well attended by a number of students and Air Cadets. Richard did say one of his aims was to inspire the next generation. He certainly did this.
Tom,
Yes the project is progressing and they have funding for phase 3. The production scale SABRE engine which they hope to run at Culham by October 2017. Target date for a launch to space is 2029. I hope I am still around.
Some really interesting technology in the fine tube heat exchanger which makes it all work. Also the airframe structure is more like an Airship (Neville Norway Shute design) with some exotic materials to withstand the temperatures. Gold plated titanium very thin foil blankets. Silicon carbide reinforced titanium for other bits. The aluminium tank sounded a bit thin and difficult to weld. (That said I think I may have seen a prototype when I went round the Welding Institute at Abington last year)
The ZFW is similar to that of the Nimrod but much longer. Needs a 5 km runway to take account of any aborted take off.
Interesting facts about the banana shaped engine nacelles and the jet thrusters to change direction and manoeuvre in space. We all laughed at the video showing the vehicle used to push the satellites out into Geostationary orbit returning to the payload bay.
I do hope it becomes a reality. If funding had been in US NASA proportions I feel certain we would have colonised Mars already.
No one asked about military applications.
I wish them well.
Tom,
Yes the project is progressing and they have funding for phase 3. The production scale SABRE engine which they hope to run at Culham by October 2017. Target date for a launch to space is 2029. I hope I am still around.
Some really interesting technology in the fine tube heat exchanger which makes it all work. Also the airframe structure is more like an Airship (Neville Norway Shute design) with some exotic materials to withstand the temperatures. Gold plated titanium very thin foil blankets. Silicon carbide reinforced titanium for other bits. The aluminium tank sounded a bit thin and difficult to weld. (That said I think I may have seen a prototype when I went round the Welding Institute at Abington last year)
The ZFW is similar to that of the Nimrod but much longer. Needs a 5 km runway to take account of any aborted take off.
Interesting facts about the banana shaped engine nacelles and the jet thrusters to change direction and manoeuvre in space. We all laughed at the video showing the vehicle used to push the satellites out into Geostationary orbit returning to the payload bay.
I do hope it becomes a reality. If funding had been in US NASA proportions I feel certain we would have colonised Mars already.
No one asked about military applications.
I wish them well.
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Hi Tom ...
I'm sure Drag will pitch-in ... but in a nutshell "steady as she goes". RE have secured c. £60M funding from UKG for the next stage of development. On the technical front two points of note ... (1) in test the pre-cooler is producing the thrust gains predicted and (2) they seem comfortable that they can achieve the desired quality and consistency of manufacture with the cooler micro tubing structure on the front end. It is also clear that they have cracked the Frost Clog in the cooler ... but clearly not in their commercial interest to discuss too much on how they cracked that particular challenge.
What I did find interesting is they way in which the fuselage is more like an "airship" structure rather than a true airframe
Still more work to be done in terms of vehicle control and automation ground/onboard (as there will be no aircrew) ... this was the basis of my question to Richard.
Hope this helps ...
Best ...
Coff.
I'm sure Drag will pitch-in ... but in a nutshell "steady as she goes". RE have secured c. £60M funding from UKG for the next stage of development. On the technical front two points of note ... (1) in test the pre-cooler is producing the thrust gains predicted and (2) they seem comfortable that they can achieve the desired quality and consistency of manufacture with the cooler micro tubing structure on the front end. It is also clear that they have cracked the Frost Clog in the cooler ... but clearly not in their commercial interest to discuss too much on how they cracked that particular challenge.
What I did find interesting is they way in which the fuselage is more like an "airship" structure rather than a true airframe
Still more work to be done in terms of vehicle control and automation ground/onboard (as there will be no aircrew) ... this was the basis of my question to Richard.
Hope this helps ...
Best ...
Coff.
https://www.adsgroup.org.uk/communit...ad.asp?a=11642
Northern Ireland Space Special Interest Group - Visit by Reaction Engines Ltd
Date: 11/03/2014
Reaction Engines Ltd are developing the technologies needed for an advanced rocket engine class called SABRE that will enable aircraft to operate at speeds of up to five times the speed of sound or fly directly into Earth orbit. Reaction Engines also have a development plan for a spaceplane called Skylon.
Through the UK Space Agency, the Government is investing £60 million in the development of the SABRE rocket engine which could revolutionise the fields of propulsion and launcher technology, and significantly reduce the costs of accessing space.
Richard Varvill, Technical Director and Chief Designer and Tom Scrope, Finance Director visited Belfast on the 5th March 2014 to attend a meeting of the Northern Ireland Space Special Interest Group (NISSIG). At the meeting Richard very kindly delivered a very informative, interesting and inspiring overview of the Skylon and SABRE programmes to ADS NI Members who were very impressed and motivated by future business opportunities in the Space Industry.
A PDF version of the presentation has been made available to download.
Date: 11/03/2014
Reaction Engines Ltd are developing the technologies needed for an advanced rocket engine class called SABRE that will enable aircraft to operate at speeds of up to five times the speed of sound or fly directly into Earth orbit. Reaction Engines also have a development plan for a spaceplane called Skylon.Through the UK Space Agency, the Government is investing £60 million in the development of the SABRE rocket engine which could revolutionise the fields of propulsion and launcher technology, and significantly reduce the costs of accessing space.
Richard Varvill, Technical Director and Chief Designer and Tom Scrope, Finance Director visited Belfast on the 5th March 2014 to attend a meeting of the Northern Ireland Space Special Interest Group (NISSIG). At the meeting Richard very kindly delivered a very informative, interesting and inspiring overview of the Skylon and SABRE programmes to ADS NI Members who were very impressed and motivated by future business opportunities in the Space Industry.
A PDF version of the presentation has been made available to download.
