Labour buying votes?
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: 23, Railway Cuttings, East Cheam
Age: 68
Posts: 3,115
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My premiss has always been if you are in this country, you should abide by the laws of this county, Sharia law etc is not the law of this country,
I've just found this thread and have to ask, does anyone else feel what a sad indictment of our country it is when politicians are using the promise of legislation, to protect our own armed forces, in our own country, to garner votes? Bugger religion or any other whimsy people may have. The simple offensive thought that "members" of our society would want to harm the very protectors of our so called democracy. The pollies have a lot to answer for.
Smudge
Smudge
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 33,047
Received 2,920 Likes
on
1,249 Posts
No prob SOSL.
Totally agree Smudge, I also think anything they promise should be made legally binding, fed up of them promising the earth but not following through with those pledges..
As for the latest fuel price freeze, another sounds good to get votes but will never happen, or if it does it will simply drive up the UK debt.
Then we have the threats of power outages because these Companies want to cream off the profits and not invest in new UK power stations, indeed, rather than convert existing coal power stations to gas, they would and did choose to the cheaper route of closing them hoping to force the UK to pay for it.
Not a great fan of it, but they should have the balls to stand up to them and say, either spend some of the profits you are earning to rectify the situation and build the infrastructure, ie power stations, or we will renationalise you.
The main problem is no party will invest in a project that will take longer than their term as it will probably lose them the election, and the likes of the railways require a sustained 15 year spend on it to bring it out of the Victorian era
Totally agree Smudge, I also think anything they promise should be made legally binding, fed up of them promising the earth but not following through with those pledges..
As for the latest fuel price freeze, another sounds good to get votes but will never happen, or if it does it will simply drive up the UK debt.
Then we have the threats of power outages because these Companies want to cream off the profits and not invest in new UK power stations, indeed, rather than convert existing coal power stations to gas, they would and did choose to the cheaper route of closing them hoping to force the UK to pay for it.
Not a great fan of it, but they should have the balls to stand up to them and say, either spend some of the profits you are earning to rectify the situation and build the infrastructure, ie power stations, or we will renationalise you.
The main problem is no party will invest in a project that will take longer than their term as it will probably lose them the election, and the likes of the railways require a sustained 15 year spend on it to bring it out of the Victorian era
Last edited by NutLoose; 25th Sep 2013 at 20:22.
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"we will renationalise you."
If you mean re-nationalise then your going to have to pay them for the assets - unless we go down the Argentinean route and just expropriate their assets
and then who will have to put up the money for the new power stations etc etc - the taxpayer again......................
I can remember when vast swathes of UK activity were nationalised and I'm damned if I can think of a single one that doesn't perform better and give better service after privitisation.................
If you mean re-nationalise then your going to have to pay them for the assets - unless we go down the Argentinean route and just expropriate their assets
and then who will have to put up the money for the new power stations etc etc - the taxpayer again......................
I can remember when vast swathes of UK activity were nationalised and I'm damned if I can think of a single one that doesn't perform better and give better service after privitisation.................
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 1,958
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To come back to the thread title, it's only a cheap soundbite which didnt cost anything so its not really "buying" votes. Buying votes is what they do for Unite and their giant welfare client state.
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: UK
Age: 56
Posts: 201
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Heathrow Harry:8067636
I can remember when vast swathes of UK activity were nationalised and I'm damned if I can think of a single one that doesn't perform better and give better service after privitisation.................
I'm not saying I agree with nationalisation, I don't. What is needed though, in many industries, is some form of regulation that ensures reinvestment and growth and that cannot be circumvented by any means.
I thought that one of the reasons that the water industry was privatized was that a massive amount of reinvestment was needed to replace leaking water systems - most of the sewer system was still Victorian - and the government couldn't afford to do it....
Successive governments hadn't invested in a long term programme of refurbishment, so much for reinvestment in nationalized industries!
Governments and private companies can both be as bad as each other in terms of what they do with "profits", but at least private companies expect to be around for more than 5 years, and don't try to bribe people with their own money!!
At least in my opinion...
Successive governments hadn't invested in a long term programme of refurbishment, so much for reinvestment in nationalized industries!
Governments and private companies can both be as bad as each other in terms of what they do with "profits", but at least private companies expect to be around for more than 5 years, and don't try to bribe people with their own money!!
At least in my opinion...
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In private industry the first thing that gets the chop in tough times is R&D, followed by training followed by recruitment
In Govt circles maintenance is always first for the chop - Ministers (and Councillors) love announcing & opening new projects and don't see any votes in the dull but essential job of maintenance
In Govt circles maintenance is always first for the chop - Ministers (and Councillors) love announcing & opening new projects and don't see any votes in the dull but essential job of maintenance
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: @exRAF_Al
Posts: 3,297
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Biggus,
Yes - and it was (at best) cheap and dishonest rabble rousing/playing to the gallery to suggest prices are where they are because of profiteering. The margins have stayed the same, return on capital has stayed the same and there have been umpteen investigations by Ofgem. Prices are rising as much as anything because of regulations brought in by previous governments – not least when Miliband was energy secretary; such as the carbon price floor and renewable policies. If Centrica etc cannot make any money supplying electricity to the retail market then they won’t supply it. The lights will go off, the economy will slow down. Miliband has torpedoed any chance of decent inward investment between now and 2015. And as for the share price - what about those millions of pensioners who depend on increasing returns from the utility companies?
Yes - and it was (at best) cheap and dishonest rabble rousing/playing to the gallery to suggest prices are where they are because of profiteering. The margins have stayed the same, return on capital has stayed the same and there have been umpteen investigations by Ofgem. Prices are rising as much as anything because of regulations brought in by previous governments – not least when Miliband was energy secretary; such as the carbon price floor and renewable policies. If Centrica etc cannot make any money supplying electricity to the retail market then they won’t supply it. The lights will go off, the economy will slow down. Miliband has torpedoed any chance of decent inward investment between now and 2015. And as for the share price - what about those millions of pensioners who depend on increasing returns from the utility companies?
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: London
Posts: 7,072
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
One thing you could argue is that the gas/oil producers shouldn't be allowed to supply - there is always the chance that profits are shunted around the system through internal pricing and maybe finish up in the Exploration & production arm rather than the retail sales group
But then why stop with Energy........
What IS a disgrace in that neither of the main parties will force the gas suppliers to keep a reasonable amount in storage - it's only about 7 days supply in the UK whereas Germany & France have more like a month in store
But then why stop with Energy........
What IS a disgrace in that neither of the main parties will force the gas suppliers to keep a reasonable amount in storage - it's only about 7 days supply in the UK whereas Germany & France have more like a month in store
and it was (at best) cheap and dishonest rabble rousing/playing to the gallery
From what I can see, this Milliband chap might have his Oxford PPE and Economics MSc, but he clearly wasn't at the front of the queue when common sense and tactical nouse was being handed out. He might very well have got the crowd on its feet at conference, but a large proportion of his party's funding could now theoretically drain away in the 20 months running up to the election - the time when you need funding the most.
I have to agree with both Al and Heathrow Harry. Energy prices are going up massively because of Govt meddling in so called 'Green' taxes that will supposedly put our energy supply on a sustainable footing (as well as a bit of profiteering - which I can't complain too much about as my Centrica dividends are always well received!). But as Heathrow Harry also points out, it's damned near impossible to generate a sustainable supply if you have no capacity to build up a reserve for the hard times and when you have allowed foreign companies to buy your supply system. So, we buy much of our gas in and don't have the capacity to store it. Funny old thing, when we get desperate, do you really think the foreign owners of our energy companies and the overseas suppliers are going to a. come to our rescue or b. put the prices up? Not a difficult one to work out.
It's interesting to note that the 2 areas of daily life where constant and inexorable price rises are guaranteed, namely domestic energy and petrol prices, both have high levels of Government interference and taxation. Or should that read the Government is the common factor in both problem sets.
Last edited by Melchett01; 27th Sep 2013 at 13:40.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 33,047
Received 2,920 Likes
on
1,249 Posts
I read an article somewhere that said due to the UK's lack of storage ability part of the gas produced was shipped to the continent for storage during the summer when it is cheap, and shipped back to the UK and sold back to us over the winter months
Last edited by NutLoose; 27th Sep 2013 at 13:57.
What IS a disgrace in that neither of the main parties will force the gas suppliers to keep a reasonable amount in storage - it's only about 7 days supply in the UK whereas Germany & France have more like a month in store
I have long felt that we have cocked up as a nation with our energy storage plans. Remember growing up where every reasonable sized town had a "gasometer" or 5? We obviously need a much bigger facility that the gas suppliers can fill up when when prices are low (every summer) and then sell to us, without massive seasonal price rises, when we need it - over winter. I can't help wondering whether £1.5B or maybe £3B or £4.5B of Govt money might be a better national investment than £50B to get from London to Birmingham 10 minutes faster!!
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 33,047
Received 2,920 Likes
on
1,249 Posts
Miliband promises to freeze prices for 20 months if he gets elected in March 2015. That is until November 2016.
FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!
You can go to Npower NOW and get a fixed price deal until March 2017.
FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!
You can go to Npower NOW and get a fixed price deal until March 2017.
Labour buying votes?
An the election is when in 2015? Why does the cynic in me see big rises either just before or just after to tide the companies over the period. Don't know who Milliband thinks he's kidding.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: @exRAF_Al
Posts: 3,297
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With currency volatility and much higher inflation forecast, that has to be worth looking into.
You can go to Npower NOW and get a fixed price deal until March 2017.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 33,047
Received 2,920 Likes
on
1,249 Posts
Indeed I went and had a look when I saw that.