Handing back of medals
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Handing back of medals
It's very sad when a soldier hands back his medals
Ex-Windsor-based soldier hands back medals / Royal Borough Observer / News / Roundup
Looks like there will be a debate on HM Forces justice though.
Ex-Windsor-based soldier hands back medals / Royal Borough Observer / News / Roundup
Looks like there will be a debate on HM Forces justice though.
What is sad is that we have a Border and Immigration Agency that equates summary disciplinary action by a soldier's CO with a Civil Criminal Conviction. But there again Tul Bahadur Pun, VC was told by them that he had not demonstrated close enough ties with the UK! If only they would expel themselves instead of our soldiers.
Expell some of the UKBF employees. Maybe not such a bad idea... ...or perhaps people that just come here because our benefit system is so generous. Am I allowed to say that? Doing this to a soldier with a good record of service is inexcusable. But not the first time we've seen this.
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The government needs a good shoeing... These pricks are letting in any Achmed, Poitr or Tariq willy nilly while putting up any, tiny, objection to men and women who have served what seems to be exemplary terms in the military.
A new law is needed. The jobsworth who let's in someone undeserving is to be "repatriated" along with the undeserving. The jobsworth that objects to people who gave good service should be sent to the worst place the victim of their stupidity served.
A new law is needed. The jobsworth who let's in someone undeserving is to be "repatriated" along with the undeserving. The jobsworth that objects to people who gave good service should be sent to the worst place the victim of their stupidity served.
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"while putting up any, tiny, objection to men and women who have served what seems to be exemplary terms in the military."
And I bet the jobsworth's don't all have perfect spic and span records.
As well as the fact that the military is held to a higher standard
than the jobsworths / civilians.
Why hasn't someone brought in a law that says if you serve in the UK
forces for XX years you can get citizenship and residency, plus, if you are wounded or earn any gallantry medal from MID upwards, this allows automatic citizenship and residency ?
Compare that to the article I saw in the UK papers the other day
about the lady and two sons who came over to the UK and she is
on 250+ a week benefits - plus her son is on the dole.
Can't find it in the DM.
And I bet the jobsworth's don't all have perfect spic and span records.
As well as the fact that the military is held to a higher standard
than the jobsworths / civilians.
Why hasn't someone brought in a law that says if you serve in the UK
forces for XX years you can get citizenship and residency, plus, if you are wounded or earn any gallantry medal from MID upwards, this allows automatic citizenship and residency ?
Compare that to the article I saw in the UK papers the other day
about the lady and two sons who came over to the UK and she is
on 250+ a week benefits - plus her son is on the dole.
Can't find it in the DM.
'Iraqi benefit cheat refused to declare £36,000 in savings from father claiming it would have broken Sharia Law' | Mail Online
EXCLUSIVE: IMMIGRANT sponger living off handouts REFUSES full-time job | The Sun |News
Rotherham semi was
Ten-year passport deception of illegal immigrant family - Top Stories - Yorkshire Evening Post
EXCLUSIVE: IMMIGRANT sponger living off handouts REFUSES full-time job | The Sun |News
Rotherham semi was
Ten-year passport deception of illegal immigrant family - Top Stories - Yorkshire Evening Post
Last edited by Lima Juliet; 21st Jan 2013 at 22:17.
500N
That's just the thin edge of the wedge. All of these are from the past MONTH!
Here is another:
Jail for bigamist caught in Northern Ireland sting operation by border officials - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk
I'm sorry but I think my liberal streak has just about been erased - enough is enough, we are being fleeced! Fair play and politeness is a great British attribute, but we need to ensure we are fair to those that DESERVE (like the soldier) and deport/lock up those that don't to DETER.
LJ
PS. I'm all for multiculturalism, but then there is just criminalism. Benefit cheating, honour-killing and child-sex grooming might be a part of other's cultures but they're not welcome here.
That's just the thin edge of the wedge. All of these are from the past MONTH!
Here is another:
Jail for bigamist caught in Northern Ireland sting operation by border officials - Northern Ireland, Local & National - Belfasttelegraph.co.uk
I'm sorry but I think my liberal streak has just about been erased - enough is enough, we are being fleeced! Fair play and politeness is a great British attribute, but we need to ensure we are fair to those that DESERVE (like the soldier) and deport/lock up those that don't to DETER.
LJ
PS. I'm all for multiculturalism, but then there is just criminalism. Benefit cheating, honour-killing and child-sex grooming might be a part of other's cultures but they're not welcome here.
Last edited by Lima Juliet; 21st Jan 2013 at 23:01.
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We get them here in Aus as well.
But I do agree with you, they (the UK Gov't) fight like tooth and nail
to stop the Gurkha's getting residency and this soldier because of one
fight yet SEEM to let in a whole range of people, give them benefits
without actually having done anything yet for the UK.
At least the soldier and / or the Gurkha's have or had already
served the country.
The fact it took Joanne Lumley IMHO really did put egg on
the UK Gov't's face.
But I do agree with you, they (the UK Gov't) fight like tooth and nail
to stop the Gurkha's getting residency and this soldier because of one
fight yet SEEM to let in a whole range of people, give them benefits
without actually having done anything yet for the UK.
At least the soldier and / or the Gurkha's have or had already
served the country.
The fact it took Joanne Lumley IMHO really did put egg on
the UK Gov't's face.
Yeah, but at least your PM has the guts to speak out...
Australia's Prime Minister Julia Gillard attended the first Australian Multicultural Council lecture in Canberra on Wednesday 19th September 2012 and gave a speech in which she said that immigrants to Australia have a duty to abide by the law and to learn English. Ms Gillard spoke before the main speaker, Frank Lowy, the founder and chairman of the Westfield shopping mall group.
Ms Gillard spoke days after violent demonstrations in Sydney involving Muslims protesting against the creation of a Youtube film in the USA which is said to insult the Islamic prophet Mohammed. The demonstrations became violent and 400 demonstrators were involved in violence with the police outside the US consulate in the Sydney district of Hyde Park.
Eight protestors were arrested and charged with public order offences and two policemen were taken to hospital. Police Superintendent Mark Walton said that more arrests were likely once video footage of the riots have been examined.
Since the unrest, Muslim community leaders have condemned the violence as did politicians from all major political parties. However, fundamentalist pressure groups such as Hisb-ut-Tahrir condemned those who condemned the violence as 'anti-Islamic'.
The group issued a statement which said "the major issue with events in Sydney is not the violence, but the anti-Islamic agenda peddled by media and politicians, We encourage Muslims to continue in their noble work of resisting Western attacks, accounting the political establishment and media, and redoubling efforts to establish Islam and the Caliphate in the Muslim World."
Speaking at the inaugural Australian Multicultural Council Lecture event, Ms Gillard, who migrated to Australia from Wales as a child, said 'Multiculturalism is not just the ability to maintain our diverse backgrounds and cultures. It is the meeting-place of rights and responsibilities where the right to maintain one's customs, language and religion is balanced by an equal responsibility to learn English, find work, respect our culture and heritage and accept women as full equals.'
She added 'What we saw in Sydney at the weekend was not multiculturalism but extremism'.
Ms Gillard spoke days after violent demonstrations in Sydney involving Muslims protesting against the creation of a Youtube film in the USA which is said to insult the Islamic prophet Mohammed. The demonstrations became violent and 400 demonstrators were involved in violence with the police outside the US consulate in the Sydney district of Hyde Park.
Eight protestors were arrested and charged with public order offences and two policemen were taken to hospital. Police Superintendent Mark Walton said that more arrests were likely once video footage of the riots have been examined.
Since the unrest, Muslim community leaders have condemned the violence as did politicians from all major political parties. However, fundamentalist pressure groups such as Hisb-ut-Tahrir condemned those who condemned the violence as 'anti-Islamic'.
The group issued a statement which said "the major issue with events in Sydney is not the violence, but the anti-Islamic agenda peddled by media and politicians, We encourage Muslims to continue in their noble work of resisting Western attacks, accounting the political establishment and media, and redoubling efforts to establish Islam and the Caliphate in the Muslim World."
Speaking at the inaugural Australian Multicultural Council Lecture event, Ms Gillard, who migrated to Australia from Wales as a child, said 'Multiculturalism is not just the ability to maintain our diverse backgrounds and cultures. It is the meeting-place of rights and responsibilities where the right to maintain one's customs, language and religion is balanced by an equal responsibility to learn English, find work, respect our culture and heritage and accept women as full equals.'
She added 'What we saw in Sydney at the weekend was not multiculturalism but extremism'.
Last edited by Lima Juliet; 21st Jan 2013 at 22:58.
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That is not a bad saying.
The first few waves of immigrants to Aus after the war were top notch,
they might have had their enclaves where they live but by god they
worked hard - and built some monumental things here - like the
Snowy Mountain River Hydro Electric scheme which was huge.
So it can work.
It seems to be SOME of the Lebbos, Muslim's and a few others who
don't seem to want to fit in.
The first few waves of immigrants to Aus after the war were top notch,
they might have had their enclaves where they live but by god they
worked hard - and built some monumental things here - like the
Snowy Mountain River Hydro Electric scheme which was huge.
So it can work.
It seems to be SOME of the Lebbos, Muslim's and a few others who
don't seem to want to fit in.
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Pardon my ignorance but how can someone serve for 13 years without being a citizen of the country they are fighting for? That someone is deemed worthy enough to serve in combat but not worthy enough for civilian life is nonsensical.
As an aside, how could someone be charged with treason if they aren't a citizen? Would a non citizen soldier have to be chaperoned throughout his/ her career re classified information, tactics, codes etc etc. Just doesn't make any sense to me.
I sincerely hope this person receives apologies and deserved recognition from the highest at the MoD so that he can resume his life with the dignity and respect he has so obviously earned. I'm sure the transition to civilian life is difficult enough as it is without having to deal with this nonsense.
Mr Balewai, I salute you. Good luck, I know you'll have many many people supporting you. Please keep your medals, you earned them and nobody can take that away from you....
Cheers
An angry Octane
As an aside, how could someone be charged with treason if they aren't a citizen? Would a non citizen soldier have to be chaperoned throughout his/ her career re classified information, tactics, codes etc etc. Just doesn't make any sense to me.
I sincerely hope this person receives apologies and deserved recognition from the highest at the MoD so that he can resume his life with the dignity and respect he has so obviously earned. I'm sure the transition to civilian life is difficult enough as it is without having to deal with this nonsense.
Mr Balewai, I salute you. Good luck, I know you'll have many many people supporting you. Please keep your medals, you earned them and nobody can take that away from you....
Cheers
An angry Octane
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There seems to be two distinct camps of opinion in this country. The opinion of most sensible people who simply ask that people who live here and benefit from our state and its support abide by our laws, respect our culture and communities and do someting to earn what they're given.
Then we get the opposing view that we should embrace everyone and everything, bending over backwards to provide for all whatever their backgrounds.
Personally, I think much of this is because the media is a natural haven for Liberal thought and is also hugely influential. It has formed what is accepted as mainstream opinion and stamped on those who may dare challenge this view.
In essence, we've been brow beaten into accepting a vast change in our national identity without even realising it because everything we see or read tells us it's how it must be.
But what do I know?
Then we get the opposing view that we should embrace everyone and everything, bending over backwards to provide for all whatever their backgrounds.
Personally, I think much of this is because the media is a natural haven for Liberal thought and is also hugely influential. It has formed what is accepted as mainstream opinion and stamped on those who may dare challenge this view.
In essence, we've been brow beaten into accepting a vast change in our national identity without even realising it because everything we see or read tells us it's how it must be.
But what do I know?
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Another reason why the "Great" is no longer used with "Britain"!
But this clown gets to stay....for now
Abu Qatada 'intends to sue for £10m': Hate preacher wants compensation for years spent behind bars | Mail Online
this stupid Government NEEDS to get a grip....It's amazing how many Guys & Gals are queuing up for the next round of redundancies.
Who can blame them?
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What is sad is that we have a Border and Immigration Agency that equates summary disciplinary action by a soldier's CO with a Civil Criminal Conviction.
Unfortunately AFA06 changed all that. CO's Summary hearings are criminal convictions. Armed Forces Act 2006
Unfortunately AFA06 changed all that. CO's Summary hearings are criminal convictions. Armed Forces Act 2006
AT:-
Which is yet another example of the rule of unexpected consequences. HM Forces are not a branch of the civilian population that just happen to wear uniform. They are, or should be, a disciplined body subject to the summary disposal of their subordinate commanders. Once that was tampered with, stuff like this happens. Or put it another way, be careful of what you wish for because it just might happen...
Of course it's the luck of the draw, and there are bad bosses and good bosses, but could it be that the seeming rise of the former over the latter is the result of having emasculated them (figuratively!) of any real discretionary powers, the consequences of having indifferent subordinate commanders is not seen as important as avoiding having mavericks? I had good bosses and all, to a certain extent, were mavericks forever trying the patience of their superiors on behalf of their subordinates. Doesn't happen much these days, I hear...
Unfortunately AFA06 changed all that. CO's Summary hearings are criminal convictions. Armed Forces Act 2006
Of course it's the luck of the draw, and there are bad bosses and good bosses, but could it be that the seeming rise of the former over the latter is the result of having emasculated them (figuratively!) of any real discretionary powers, the consequences of having indifferent subordinate commanders is not seen as important as avoiding having mavericks? I had good bosses and all, to a certain extent, were mavericks forever trying the patience of their superiors on behalf of their subordinates. Doesn't happen much these days, I hear...
Last edited by Chugalug2; 22nd Jan 2013 at 13:21.
Quote:
Unfortunately AFA06 changed all that. CO's Summary hearings are criminal convictions. Armed Forces Act 2006
Which is yet another example of the rule of unexpected consequences. HM Forces are not a branch of the civilian population that just happen to wear uniform. They are, or should be, a disciplined body subject to the summary disposal of their subordinate commanders. Once that was tampered with, stuff like this happens. Or put it another way, be careful of what you wish for because it just might happen...
Unfortunately AFA06 changed all that. CO's Summary hearings are criminal convictions. Armed Forces Act 2006
Which is yet another example of the rule of unexpected consequences. HM Forces are not a branch of the civilian population that just happen to wear uniform. They are, or should be, a disciplined body subject to the summary disposal of their subordinate commanders. Once that was tampered with, stuff like this happens. Or put it another way, be careful of what you wish for because it just might happen...
Unspent convictions under the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 always included, and still do include if not spent, specified service disciplinary offences under the Army and Air Forces Acts of 1955 and the Naval Discipline Act 1957.
The situations before and after the Armed Forces Act 2006 are not an exact match. Without being in a position to check immediately in detail, I think that some disciplinary offences are now regarded as convictions for the purposes of the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act when their equivalent might not have previously. If that is right, the significant change would have been in the Rehab of Offenders Act - and the Immigration Rules - not in service law itself.
Last edited by baffman; 22nd Jan 2013 at 15:58.
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Details of what offences under the Armed Forces Act 2006 are or are not Recordable Offences on the Police National Computer are detailed in Statutory Instrument 2009 No 1922 'The Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984 (Armed Forces) Order 2009'. Luckily a summary of what is included is in Hansard as a response to a question:
Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence whether criminal convictions of members of the armed forces are recorded on the Police National Computer. [41019]
Mr Robathan [holding answer 16 February 2011]: Yes. Recordable offences on the Police National Computer are those offences under section 42 of the Armed Forces Act 2006 for which the corresponding offences under the law of England and Wales are also offences that are recordable under regulation 3 of the National Police Records (Recordable Offences) Regulations 2000.
In addition, there are a number of service offences that are recordable. These are offences under the following sections of the Armed Forces Act 2006:
a. Section 11(1)—Misconduct towards a superior officer;
b. Section 14—Using force against a sentry, etc.;
c. Section 24(1)—Damage to or loss of public or service property;
d. Section 27—Obstructing or failing to assist a service policeman;
e. Section 28—Resistance to arrest, etc. (only in relation to a conviction under section 28(1)(b) or (c)—using violence or threatening behaviour);
f. Section 29—Offences in relation to service custody;
7 Mar 2011 : Column 805W
g. Section 30—Allowing escape, or unlawful release of prisoners, etc. (but only where the conviction is under section 30(4)(a));
h. Section 39—Attempts to commit any offences specified above; and
i. Section 40—Encouraging or assisting the commission of any offence above (apart from an attempt).
Mr Robathan [holding answer 16 February 2011]: Yes. Recordable offences on the Police National Computer are those offences under section 42 of the Armed Forces Act 2006 for which the corresponding offences under the law of England and Wales are also offences that are recordable under regulation 3 of the National Police Records (Recordable Offences) Regulations 2000.
In addition, there are a number of service offences that are recordable. These are offences under the following sections of the Armed Forces Act 2006:
a. Section 11(1)—Misconduct towards a superior officer;
b. Section 14—Using force against a sentry, etc.;
c. Section 24(1)—Damage to or loss of public or service property;
d. Section 27—Obstructing or failing to assist a service policeman;
e. Section 28—Resistance to arrest, etc. (only in relation to a conviction under section 28(1)(b) or (c)—using violence or threatening behaviour);
f. Section 29—Offences in relation to service custody;
7 Mar 2011 : Column 805W
g. Section 30—Allowing escape, or unlawful release of prisoners, etc. (but only where the conviction is under section 30(4)(a));
h. Section 39—Attempts to commit any offences specified above; and
i. Section 40—Encouraging or assisting the commission of any offence above (apart from an attempt).