Historic campaign medals reconsidered?

[November4]

The Prime Minister has announced an independent review of the rules and principles governing the awarding of military campaign medals.

David Cameron announced that Sir John Holmes will carry out a fresh, independent review taking account of the longstanding principles that have determined past decisions.

The existing guiding rules and principles for the awarding of military campaign medals are that:

• awards will not be considered after a period of five years has elapsed after a particular military action;

• individuals will not be rewarded twice for the same military campaign, i.e. no 'double medalling'; and

• awards are based upon significant 'risk and rigour' for the individual concerned.

The Coalition Government stated its intention in its Programme for Government, published in May 2010, to review the rules governing the awarding of general campaign medals as a part of its commitment to rebuilding the Armed Forces Covenant.

The review will not consider individual gallantry awards, nor will it cover medals for long service or good conduct, which are the responsibility of parent government departmets.

The review should draw on, but not necessarily be guided by, the work already undertaken as part of an initial Ministry of Defence medal review.

Sir John, who is currently Director at the Ditchley Foundation and formerly served as the UN's Under-Secretary-General for Humanitarian Affairs and Emergency and as Her Majesty's Ambassador in Paris and London, will be supported by a small team based in the Cabinet Office.

The review will ensure that all interested parties, including the veterans' organisations, are fully consulted, and aims to deliver a report with recommendations where appropriate for any change by the summer to the Government.

MOD

If this report says that medals should be issued for historic campaigns then the obvious ones are for Bomber Command and the Arctic Convoys.

But what other ones should be considered for a new medal?

and how far back should they go....Gallipoli?

[Pontius Navigator]

N4, I think it would be safe to exclude WW1. The only beneficiaries would be grandchildren and great-grandchildren who may have no understanding of the issues. I believe only 3 medals were issued with no recognition for actions in Africa or the Atlantic or Pacific.

In WW2 there were theatre stars but these were limited to a maximum of five. Those who served in Burma and the Pacific could be awared one, those who served in the Atlantic, France and Germany, and Aircrew Europe could be awarded only 2. On this rule of 5 some potential recipients of the Arctic or Bomber Comand awards (if created) would only be entitled to a rosette on one of the other medals.

My wife's father was awarded a defence medal probably on account of service at Hell Fire Corner. His father, OTOH, who served with the Patrol Service at Lowestoft was not awarded the defence medal.

There are plenty of post-war campaigns that had significant threat to life and limb that were not recognised with an individual medal. The 1962 General Service covered 18 campaigns and the 1918 GSM 17 campaigns with 10 of those post-WW2. That is an awful lot of medals not created and supplied.

[sisemen]

Cold War? The spivs are already cranking out a pseudo cornflakes medal for that lengthy campaign.

And how about giving all those who were serving at the time of the Silver Jubilee an issue rather than the blonde WRAF with big tits who got the one medal awarded to that particular unit?

[Old-Duffer]

I say SISEMAN, I didn't know you knew my sister - she's never mentioned your name!!

[BEagle]

Old-Duffer, your post means nothing without a photograph!

Personally I agree with the issue of the 1977 Queen's Jubilee medals to all those who met the criteria at the time. Also a Cold War medal - and the medals awarded by the Emir of Kuwait and King of Saudi Arabia for those who served in GW1, which other nations permit their personnel to wear, but the UK does not.

[November4]

There are plenty of post-war campaigns that had significant threat to life and limb that were not recognised with an individual medal. The 1962 General Service covered 18 campaigns and the 1918 GSM 17 campaigns with 10 of those post-WW2. That is an awful lot of medals not created and supplied.

Agree there but these campaigns have been recognised and awards made to cover them be it a bar to the GSMs. My reading of this is that it is to look at campaigns which have not been covered previously.

Also one of the things they are looking at is is the "double medalling" which IMO is to look at the Saudi and Kuwaiti medals for Gulf part 1

[skippedonce]

Double-Medalling

And more recently the NATO Non-Article V medal for Afghanistan, which the UK taxpayer has already shelled out for through our national contribution to the NATO budget.

[Widger]

So no more medals for guarding Cyprus, or working in Qatar or living in a hotel in Italy!!!!

[Pontius Navigator]

N4, true, I was really saying what cheapskates HMG had been releasing the purse strings slightly in 1948 and then not until the Falklands and the NuLabour medals.

Double medalling with the GSM has occured though with the ACSMs 199and 2011.

[Tankertrashnav]

How about introducing one for service beyond the call of duty down Bugis Street, with extra clasp for The Gut? My claim will be in like a shot if they do

[Pontius Navigator]

Originally Posted by Tankertrashnav

How about introducing one for service beyond the call of duty down Bugis Street, with extra clasp for The Gut? My claim will be in like a shot if they do

In which case I would qualify for Dirty Dick's in La Linea, the Hole in the Wall in Gibraltar, the Gut and bar, Hero's Square and accumulated service medal, Georgetown Penang, and of course Bugis Street.

Then there would there be the Brass Nut at Kef, the Mexican side at Goose Bay, and the O-club at Geilers.

In fact you might have opened a can of worms there.

[Cornerstone958]

With an aditional 'CLAPing' hands bar should you have visited the Clinic!!
CS

[Big Pistons Forever]

It is a slippery slope and then one day you are eating breakfast and the guy/gal sitting next to you has more medals than years of service . You only have to look at the Americans to see where that leads. Sadly Canada is going down the the same road. A friend of my has an Afghanistan medal.....he earned it by being OC parties for the US Commanding General in Doha. For his 6 month tour he lived in a 5 star hotel and the worst thing that happened to him was a wifi outage so he couldn't talk to his wife on skype

Don't go there !

[Lima Juliet]

My twopenneth

If there was a Cold War medal, when would the qualfication end?

- Fall of the Berlin Wall in 89?
- Collapse of Soviet Union early 91?
- Formation of CIS in late 91?

Similarly for the start date?

- VE Day?
- VJ Day?
- Berlin Blockade 1948?

There would be millions of medals that would need minting and awarding - equating to tens of millions of pounds. Anyone notice we're trying to cut back on spending?

I agree that the Silver Jubilee Medal was a farse, but I believe the milk is long spilt.

On to later campaigns, the Foreign awards could be instated (ISAF and GW1) at a minimal cost to the UK. But cost is an interesting thing; if we go for Cold War and Foreign medals then that will cost me £150+ for their mounting with ribbons for No 1s and miniatures for No 5s - the QDJ cost me £135 all in so far!

So I would say, be careful what you wish for!

LJ

[Mr-Burns]

So does this mean that our Truckie colleagues will actually have to get involved in a conflict if they want a medal now??

[BEagle]

Mr_Burns, that is a particularly tasteless comment.

Are you not aware of the loss of Hercules XV179 with its entire crew and passengers to hostile fire during OP TELIC?

You might care to amend your thoughtless post.

[ORAC]

I did 25 years from 1974-99 and left without a medal. I don't feel hard done by, I never got shot at or did anything beyond what I was paid to do. I dislike the idea of a Cold War medal or such, I'd be embarrassed to wear it.

Personal opinion of course.

[Tankertrashnav]

Agreed ORAC. I actually got one for six months on ops in an air-conditioned office at Khormaksar, and the only injury I suffered was sunburn caused by falling asleep on the beach at Steamer Point. I certainly dont want a Cold War Medal either.

P-N - you're going to need a very long length of ribbon to accommodate all those clasps - respect

[McGoonagall]

I agree that the Silver Jubilee Medal was a farse, but I believe the milk is long spilt.

Leander Class Frigate. 260ish ships company. On the way to Spithead review. Ship is gleaming. Skipper clears all hands aft.

'Morning men and stand easy. The Lord High Commissioners of the Admiralty have deemed that in honour of Her Majesty's 25 years on the throne we are to be awarded a Silver Jubilee medal (cheers). Three of them between all of us (groans). First of all, ones mine because I always wanted a second medal bar. The second one is awarded to Junior Seaman XXXXX as he is the youngest in the ship. The third will be decided by raffle, tickets at 50p each can be bought from Midshipman XXXXX proceeds to ships funds. Number One? Carry on.

[Old-Duffer]

BEagle, Your post 5, she's not blond anymore!

A medal for the troubles in Hong Kong during the Cultural Revolution of 1967ish. Several service and police were fatal casualties.

Can the services ever cope with a long service medal for their officers. It always fails on the 'good conduct' bit and how to deal with officers whose 'behaviour has left something to be desired'.

O-D