Rafale wins Indian order

[backseatjock]

Interesting article from widely read Indian tabloid newspaper India Today / Mail Today.

I can't open the link to see the full piece but the summary below gives a flavour.

Not making any comment other than 'Hmm' - the content may or may not be accurate, of course. I will leave readers to estabish their own views.

India Today

MoD officials question Rafale deal

The country's biggest defence deal for the purchase of 126. Rafale fighter jets, estimated to be worth around Rs.62,000 crore, seems to be running into rough weather.

Top government sources said on Friday that two senior officials of the ministry of defence (MoD), who are members of the contract negotiation committee, have questioned the methods adopted by it to conclude that French company

Dassault's Rafale had the lowest bid for the medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA) deal.

The contract negotiation committee comprises senior officials from the MoD and the Indian Air Force.

The contract is yet to be vetted by the ministry of finance before it is finally approved by the Cabinet Committee on Security.

Rafale was declared as the lowest bid after the evaluation of the commercial bids made by the different companies to the MoD. Rafale had pipped British fighter jet Eurofighter Typhoon, while the other rivals from the US, Russia and Sweden were eliminated in different stages of competition.

MoD officials question Rafale deal : North News - India Today

[Two's in]

Genuine question. Where does the under current of loyalty to Typhoon come from?

From an industry viewpoint, thanks to decades of mismanagement and governmental myopia in the UK there is only one major aircraft manufacturer - Our chums at Big And Expensive (BAE) Systems. The aerospace sector of that business was building the following platforms;

Nimrod MRA4 - Gone
Harrier - Gone
Typhoon - Reducing order book as spending cuts take effect.
F-35 JSF - Please Sir Mr Lockheed, can I have my workshare back?

"Loyalty" is the wrong word, the last act of desperate business is more accurate. You don't need 10,000 engineers to build a slack handful of UAVs.

[Milo Minderbinder]

more about it on the Indian version of MSN (!)
Rafale deal flies into rough weather

"But highly placed sources said two senior officials of the defence ministry have questioned the methods adopted by the contract negotiation committee which concluded that Rafale was the lowest bidder.
The two officials - additional financial advisor and a joint secretary in the ministry Prem Kumar Kataria, and finance manager (air) R.K. Arora - are members of the negotiation committee that comprises senior ministry officials and Indian Air Force (IAF) officers.
The two officials noted that certain assumptions had been made about Rafale's bid to declare it as the lowest bidder, but no one had validated it. The officials initially refused to sign the minutes of the committee. They later signed after making their reservations known. They put written notes on the file on January 24, according to officials privy to the negotiations.
Sources say Defence Minister A.K. Antony wants to steer clear of any controversy and has instructed that the committee should settle the issue internally."

So the fat Buddha may not have started singing yet....

[jindabyne]

Mods. Do you want to waste BW on this topic for the next four years? For it will be at least that time before a purchase contract is signed, whatever the aircraft. Trust me. India

[HAWK21M]

How long before the order is signed.....

[racedo]

Seems like some Indian Mod people have been enjoying hospitality or no doubt that might be alledged..................

[BombayDuck]

Originally Posted by GreenKnight121

I have read that Sukhoi's contract with India for Su-27/33 forbids India from making spare/replacement parts. All spares must be purchased from Russia at whatever price Russia demands.

Considering that HAL makes the Sukhoi 30MKI under licence in India, I really doubt that source of yours.

[GreenKnight121]

The source was someone within the manufacturing program.

They are allowed to build only parts for installation in new aircraft on the production line, and no more.

The repair parts supply system is fire-walled away from the production lines, with all repair parts coming through Sukhoi, no matter where those parts were made.

[BEagle]

Seems like some Indian MoD people have been enjoying hospitality or no doubt that might be alleged..................

Hmm - 'hospitality'. Fine French cuisine chez Marcel or tripe and trotters wi 't Bungling Baron Waste o' Space?

If that was the sole criterion, Eurofighter would never have stood a chance!

[Victor Inox]

It would be extremely charitable to believe that the Indian procurement process for a new fighter jet will be any better than the now infamous process for selling and allocating cellular frequency spectrum.

Whilst BAE are less than faultless themselves when it comes to transparent processes (e.g. Saudi Arabia), French marketing skills in the armaments business has been well documented throughout history. In more recent years, their submarine sales to Malaysia spring to mind.

[Shack37]

A little ray of hope?


Manipulation claim over Indian Rafale jet deal - Telegraph

[LowObservable]

British hopes were raised when the Typhoon performed best in trials..

Indian MP Mysura Reddy..... was also concerned by reports Rafales were outperformed by Typhoons in operations over Libya.

Jackonicko is clearly respected on the subcontinent...

[racedo]

Elements of clutching at straws I think.....

[5 Forward 6 Back]

Who on Earth is reporting that Typhoon outperformed Rafale in Libya??

[wokawoka]

?????????

What? The jet which could not self designate and can only deliver one type of air to ground munition, oh and has not got a gun which funnily enough is now an important weapon for COIN CAS. Whatever.

[pr00ne]

Typhoon HAS got a gun and has had for years.

[Easy Street]

Typhoon has self-designated LGBs successfully. The reason they didn't do it over Libya was that funding for the flying hours required to train for it was withdrawn after the capability was proved in 2008. The force only had enough hours to maintain its core role of DCA. Given that fact, it reflects well on the chaps that they quickly resurrected EPW2 and successfully employed it (predominantly in GPS-guided mode - laser guidance is so 1990s!)

The Indians would have been briefed on this and would have seen the evidence from 2008, of that you can be virtually certain!

[Heathrow Harry]

Pr00ne - IIRC the MOD tried to cancel the gun in development to save costs and replace it with ballast but our German friends insisted - thank God!

[TEEEJ]

wokawoka wrote

....oh and has not got a gun....

The decision to not support the cannon in RAF service was reversed in 2006. The cannon is retained by all users of the Typhoon.

At a conference last week, Air Vice-Marshal David Walker, the officer commanding No 1 Group, which includes the Harrier and the newly-forming Typhoon squadrons, said he had decided to proceed with the Typhoon gun, buying ammunition, spares and maintenance equipment.

Typhoon wins gun dogfight - Telegraph

'Several pilots from the RAF's 3 Sqn - its first frontline unit to have received the Typhoon, initially for use only for air defence purposes - took part in the exercise, where around 700 rounds were also fired from the type's Mauser 27mm cannon. More work needs to be done with the reactivated weapon, but Atha says: "As a first step, we're there."

Eurofighter Typhoon proves close-air support credentials for RAF

[KAG]

The Telegraph... Right...
Like it was the first time this news paper was writing bullcr@p. (yes you read me, I wrote bullcr@p, I am the first one and it will become fashion soon... )


Seems some have not accepted reality yet, well it doesn't really matter.