AIRTANKER
I say Courtney, do you mean:
Ooooh yes..
Greetings everyone! Happy New Year to one and all! Having been away in darkest Yorkshire visiting relatives, my vile cold and I are now back in the soft saarf after a quick blast down the Fosse Way in the teutonic tourer this morning. Saw a Typhoon zotting along at low level in Yorkshire earlier today, which was nice! Lucky blighter!
The thing one has to remember is that ATrS will be providing the Voyager to the RAF on a power-by-the-hour basis. The RAF thus still has never 'bought' a new tanker as they will only be renting the Voyager.
One wonders how ATrS' business case will work, now that there are no Harriers, SHARs, Tornado F3s or Nimrod MRA4s. There are fewer Tornados and Typhoons than were originally anticipated - so how often will the crews be flying the Voyager in the AAR role? Will there really be a Voyager sitting out in the open (it won't fit in the Timmy hangar) at RAF Mount Pleasant, flying a tiny number of hours per month? How much AT work will the Voyager do otherwise, given that the north-west frontier war won't go on for ever....hopefully?
Still, the A330 is jolly nice and will make an excellent tanker......eventually
!
Oh - and always end with the 'pack shot':
Ooooh yes..
Greetings everyone! Happy New Year to one and all! Having been away in darkest Yorkshire visiting relatives, my vile cold and I are now back in the soft saarf after a quick blast down the Fosse Way in the teutonic tourer this morning. Saw a Typhoon zotting along at low level in Yorkshire earlier today, which was nice! Lucky blighter!
The thing one has to remember is that ATrS will be providing the Voyager to the RAF on a power-by-the-hour basis. The RAF thus still has never 'bought' a new tanker as they will only be renting the Voyager.
One wonders how ATrS' business case will work, now that there are no Harriers, SHARs, Tornado F3s or Nimrod MRA4s. There are fewer Tornados and Typhoons than were originally anticipated - so how often will the crews be flying the Voyager in the AAR role? Will there really be a Voyager sitting out in the open (it won't fit in the Timmy hangar) at RAF Mount Pleasant, flying a tiny number of hours per month? How much AT work will the Voyager do otherwise, given that the north-west frontier war won't go on for ever....hopefully?
Still, the A330 is jolly nice and will make an excellent tanker......eventually
!Oh - and always end with the 'pack shot':
The thing one has to remember is that ATrS will be providing the Voyager to the RAF on a power-by-the-hour basis.
A good deal for ATr (if they can get pilots).
However, the penalties are quite severe if they can't come up with the goods.
"Will there really be a Voyager sitting out in the open (it won't fit in the Timmy hangar) at RAF Mount Pleasant,"
Why would "they" want to put it in a hangar overnight, when the thing is designed to last for years outside?
Hangars (for "Commercial" aircraft - and that is what these are) are only for working in, not for parking in overnight because it gets cold out. Coats are cheaper.
...I'll just get mine...
Why would "they" want to put it in a hangar overnight, when the thing is designed to last for years outside?
Hangars (for "Commercial" aircraft - and that is what these are) are only for working in, not for parking in overnight because it gets cold out. Coats are cheaper.
...I'll just get mine...
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Rigga, to be instantly ready for "Q" duties, without having to mess around for hours sweeping snow off the wings before de-iceing etc.. Also gets pretty miserable doing long jobs outside at -15°!
The VC10 was often in the hangar during my 6 month stint darrn saarf (some might allude to the fact that it was U/S more often than not) when the weather was set to be or was suitably offensive.
The VC10 was often in the hangar during my 6 month stint darrn saarf (some might allude to the fact that it was U/S more often than not
) when the weather was set to be or was suitably offensive.
Can anyone tell me what increase in capabilities the new aircraft will bring?
The RAF demonstrated a long range strike capability during recent operations over Libya. I'm sure in part this was designed to demonstrate to certain parties the UKs 'reach'. So if we take it to the extreme, does Airtanker allow the RAF to put a package of 4 GR4s with 2 Stormshadow each over the Falklands. Could it manage this with 1 - 2 tankers instead of the large number required for Black Buck?
The RAF demonstrated a long range strike capability during recent operations over Libya. I'm sure in part this was designed to demonstrate to certain parties the UKs 'reach'. So if we take it to the extreme, does Airtanker allow the RAF to put a package of 4 GR4s with 2 Stormshadow each over the Falklands. Could it manage this with 1 - 2 tankers instead of the large number required for Black Buck?
brakedwell, no - Almeria, I think.
If we could get over the pprune viagra-substitute digression, could anybody answer my question about how many hours per year a current RAF tanker crew would typically fly?
If AT salaries are less than the norm for long-haul A330 captains, they could perhaps still offer attractive terms if the annual hours target is more reasonable. Do RAF long-haul crews do approaching 900 hours per year?
If AT salaries are less than the norm for long-haul A330 captains, they could perhaps still offer attractive terms if the annual hours target is more reasonable. Do RAF long-haul crews do approaching 900 hours per year?
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Trim Stab:
Tanker crews don't get anywhere near 900 hrs / year.
In the past 12 months I got circa 500 hrs which included 60 Ellamy missions.
I reckon both Tri* and VC10 crews get in the region of 350 - 450 hrs / year
Tanker crews don't get anywhere near 900 hrs / year.
In the past 12 months I got circa 500 hrs which included 60 Ellamy missions.
I reckon both Tri* and VC10 crews get in the region of 350 - 450 hrs / year
Thanks Chris - If AT fly about the same those would probably be quite attractive terms to most long-haul pilots these days. Admittedly they presumably won't have so many SD's as regulars though.
A MFF Airbus Captain in Charter world would be (fag packet) @500 hrs pa.
For this there is a salary @£110k+, PHI, 8x salary death in service, co pension of @15-20%, nice hotels and plenty of time off per year and per month.
If I was said Captain
my choice would be to go half time at the airline and still earn more than an Airtanker crew
As has been said previously in this thread, the package needs to be extraordinary to winkle out Civvy pilots from their comfort zone.
For this there is a salary @£110k+, PHI, 8x salary death in service, co pension of @15-20%, nice hotels and plenty of time off per year and per month.
If I was said Captain
my choice would be to go half time at the airline and still earn more than an Airtanker crewAs has been said previously in this thread, the package needs to be extraordinary to winkle out Civvy pilots from their comfort zone.
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Not quite the full story...
Just a little caution with regard to hours comparisons advised I think. If you think that the fewer hours flown by RAF crews would therefore mean either more home time or perhaps the possibility of another low-hours job on another airline, you must not forget that those 300-400 years come with additional 'free' umpteen hours on q at Brize or Falklands, another something-teen weeks away each year on det, typically 3-4 weeks at a time for circa 20-30 hours flying...(Let's not include the Ellamy surge). So to summarise, the leisurely appearance of 3-400 hrs/year is more like the work hours of 900 a year once you factor in the legendary Ascot efficiency. Oh, and those who have left, forgotten and considering returning, don't forget that your schedule/roster will change 3-4times per day and if you're not in the vicinity of the desk 24hours a day then you life will be f@c£Ed about from pillar to post and you won't even know what you're doing next week reliably never mind in x-months time for your daughters/fathers/sisters christening/birthday/wedding etc...