Royal Air Force Club
Lightning
Are you calling Newt a "cewt"?
Jack
PS Perhaps more importantly, from my brief forays past the august portals (pun intended) I would have to say that the light blue are very fortunate to have such a splendid central London venue, at such relatively slender cost, and the old cry of "Use or lose it" comes to mind ....
Are you calling Newt a "cewt"?
Jack
PS Perhaps more importantly, from my brief forays past the august portals (pun intended) I would have to say that the light blue are very fortunate to have such a splendid central London venue, at such relatively slender cost, and the old cry of "Use or lose it" comes to mind ....
Last edited by Union Jack; 24th Nov 2009 at 17:11.
So its have a go at Newt again!!
Must be that time of year!
Do not know who you are grobace but I think your pseudonym recce is way off the mark!! You might also note that I am not being rude and calling you names without knowing who you are!
Bah Humbug!
The rest is
Must be that time of year!
Do not know who you are grobace but I think your pseudonym recce is way off the mark!! You might also note that I am not being rude and calling you names without knowing who you are!
Bah Humbug!
The rest is
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There was a caveat in my post, newt, that the less than polite comment only applied if you were who I thought you might be. But, as it appears that, unlike Lightning Mate, you were not one ( a Lightning mate, that is), you are clearly not the cutie someone else knows you to be. I think I'll stop here before I confuse everyone on this forum, not just myself.
It's worth remembering that the only reason we still have such a splendidly located facility is because of the committee's very astute decision to purchase the freehold some years back. Had this not been so we would probably have been languishing somewhere in Paddington now - if anywhere! I understand that the reason the In and Out had to move was that they only held a lease and the owners had upped to the rent to unmeetable levels.
BTW does anyone know what happens at the old In and Out these days? Have the Japanese moved in from next door?
BTW does anyone know what happens at the old In and Out these days? Have the Japanese moved in from next door?
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BTW does anyone know what happens at the old In and Out these days? Have the Japanese moved in from next door?
It was put on the market about a year ago for a rumoured £250m; I don't know if it was sold.
It now looks run-down and shabby. A pity, it's a magnificent building.
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As a member of a now defunct Antipodean club with reciprocal membership, my wife and I have stayed at the RAF Club on visits to the Old Dart. Only criticism is that by Oz standards (and French chambres at Chez Cercle National des Armees), the bedrooms are a tad small - but the same can be said for the 'In and Out' and the Naval Club. Must be a Brit thing.
If you don't use it, you will lose it. My former Club (the Naval & Military in Melbourne) went to the wall earlier this year. With a declining Service membership, a perceived need to maintain 'standards' and failed initiatives to broaden the membership base, it was only a matter of time before Mr Micawber's words came true:
The Bank called in the secured loans, the place was sold, the contents unceremoniously auctioned off and 140 or so years of tradition went down the gurgler!
If you don't use it, you will lose it. My former Club (the Naval & Military in Melbourne) went to the wall earlier this year. With a declining Service membership, a perceived need to maintain 'standards' and failed initiatives to broaden the membership base, it was only a matter of time before Mr Micawber's words came true:
"Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pound ought and six, result misery."
Some members are more equal than others?
Have to say that I can see both sides of the story here. For the price, it is a fantastic facility in a lovely part of Town. However, as a serving member, often on ops, getting a room is up there with winning the lottery,
I did post a suggestion on the Club website a couple of years back, suggesting that a proportion of rooms should be set aside for serving members. I had tried to book in on several occasions over the previous couple of years only to be told it was fully booked. When I spoke to the Club, I was advised to book as far in advance as possible. I did point out that in today's expeditionary Air Force it was often difficult to know whethe one would be in the country in a months time let alone 6 months time, and as such, did they think it fair that retired members could effectively fill the Club years in advance?
According to the news letters at the time, they were then taking bookings for 2012 Olympics. So whilst Gp Capt Buffy Henderson-Smythe DFC BBC ITV* and his chums are sorted, where does that leave the operational elements freqiently deployed but paying subs for the retired personnel and their chums to enjoy this marvellous facility?
I'm not saying we should ban retired personnel - that would be a serious blow to Club membership and ethos. But for the Club to remain a viable and relevant institution, there must be more recognition of the demands placed on currently serving members and an acknowledgment that long-range advance booking may not be possible. Failure to do so will only serve to alienate large numbers of members, threatining the viability of the Club long term.
And then we would have to go to the Union Jack Club
I did post a suggestion on the Club website a couple of years back, suggesting that a proportion of rooms should be set aside for serving members. I had tried to book in on several occasions over the previous couple of years only to be told it was fully booked. When I spoke to the Club, I was advised to book as far in advance as possible. I did point out that in today's expeditionary Air Force it was often difficult to know whethe one would be in the country in a months time let alone 6 months time, and as such, did they think it fair that retired members could effectively fill the Club years in advance?
According to the news letters at the time, they were then taking bookings for 2012 Olympics. So whilst Gp Capt Buffy Henderson-Smythe DFC BBC ITV* and his chums are sorted, where does that leave the operational elements freqiently deployed but paying subs for the retired personnel and their chums to enjoy this marvellous facility?
I'm not saying we should ban retired personnel - that would be a serious blow to Club membership and ethos. But for the Club to remain a viable and relevant institution, there must be more recognition of the demands placed on currently serving members and an acknowledgment that long-range advance booking may not be possible. Failure to do so will only serve to alienate large numbers of members, threatining the viability of the Club long term.
And then we would have to go to the Union Jack Club
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The RAF Club will go the way of the 'In and Out' Club
I resigned a number of years ago for the reasons stated by many in previous threads. Having spent many years paying my subs and finally getting a room there, I was very unimpressed with the allegedly refurbished rooms. The room we stayed in was tiny and seemed to have a 'Merlin on idle' ouside the room for most of the night. The staff's attitude was of a standard expected in a Holiday Inn Express (sorry Holiday Inn) and I left the following morning vowing never to spend any more time and money in/on the premises. I think if I'd been a Snr Officer out of MOD Main Building I would have been gushing about the quality of 'my Club' and what 'a wonderful facility it is in a lovely part of town' and how the latest 'reunion of ancient former Air Officers' was such a tremendous evening! What the RAF Club should be doing is attracting the JOs to spend time there as full an appreciated membersand not only visit as part of IOTC and be parted from their money to support Air Marshall Ffoulks-Smythe and his cronies!. How many times over the past 20 yrs (in my experience), have we had this call to members to 'support the Club lest it close and we lose a valuable asset'. Then it has a revamp and falls into its old ways and the old farts corner all the rooms...and so it continues. I say stuff the club and stay in one of the better hotels.
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The Club is a great asset to have in central London providing good, cheap accomodation. I use it from time to time, generally at short notice. Sometimes I can get a room, other times it's fully booked but then I frequently find the same thing with hotels all over the country.
A few years ago my wife was quite seriously ill and transferred to St Thomas's hospital from Norfolk where we lived. We had three small children at the time. I have to say that the Club was extremely helpful over weekend visits to see her, arranging a room, putting extra beds in and generally helping where they could.
The only downside to the club is that, having regard to one's spouses automatic membership, it's a bit close to the shops and the front desk are far too helpful at storing shopping bags.
A few years ago my wife was quite seriously ill and transferred to St Thomas's hospital from Norfolk where we lived. We had three small children at the time. I have to say that the Club was extremely helpful over weekend visits to see her, arranging a room, putting extra beds in and generally helping where they could.
The only downside to the club is that, having regard to one's spouses automatic membership, it's a bit close to the shops and the front desk are far too helpful at storing shopping bags.
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I,too, have recently cancelled my membership after 24+ years. If I had a 9-5 position then, yes, I could plan months in advance to secure a room, but I don't.
Allowing nondescript persons to secure affiliate membership over, for example, serving warrant officers is, simply, wrong. The RAF (Officers') Club (with its highly prized charitable status) needs to reinvent itself to survive.
AA
Allowing nondescript persons to secure affiliate membership over, for example, serving warrant officers is, simply, wrong. The RAF (Officers') Club (with its highly prized charitable status) needs to reinvent itself to survive.
AA
grobace,
I'm afraid that I agree with many comments on the thread.
When I'm in town I stay at a private residence which is part of the Wolsey Homes chain. Dine well with the owners too, all for a price that beats the Club hands down.
By the way, what's a Grob 115E? Does it have a trigger?
I'm afraid that I agree with many comments on the thread.
When I'm in town I stay at a private residence which is part of the Wolsey Homes chain. Dine well with the owners too, all for a price that beats the Club hands down.
By the way, what's a Grob 115E? Does it have a trigger?
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As a fresh faced Fg Off not too many years ago I used to use The Club all the time. It had recently had a shake-up, adjusted the tariffs and brought some young blood in. Frequently when on BFT/AFT, my coursemates and I would head down to London for a weekend on the town and I could generally get a basic single for about £30. I probably averaged about three nights there per month consistently, and just wanted somewhere to lay my head - not bothered about breakfast, little bottles of shampoo etc.
Now it's a different story. I see that basic rooms are still listed but I can barely remember the last time I could book a room at the club for less than about £100. Now as a poverty stricken junior first officer I can't really justify that expense when I can get a rooms in decent hotels in central London for about £50 through a certain website.
I do like the RAF Club and want to support it but at the moment it is pricing itself out of the market to a certain extent. Due to the constraints of the fabric of the building the quality of the rooms is limited and its USPs are really only it's status and address. They'll need some careful planning to succeed in the future, but I hope they do.
I don't begrudge the old Rowley Birkin types propped up in the best seats of the Cowdray Room as I aspire to be the same one day!
Now it's a different story. I see that basic rooms are still listed but I can barely remember the last time I could book a room at the club for less than about £100. Now as a poverty stricken junior first officer I can't really justify that expense when I can get a rooms in decent hotels in central London for about £50 through a certain website.
I do like the RAF Club and want to support it but at the moment it is pricing itself out of the market to a certain extent. Due to the constraints of the fabric of the building the quality of the rooms is limited and its USPs are really only it's status and address. They'll need some careful planning to succeed in the future, but I hope they do.
I don't begrudge the old Rowley Birkin types propped up in the best seats of the Cowdray Room as I aspire to be the same one day!
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During my last visit to the Club, I had the pleasure of being invited into the company of a party celebrating their awards that day at Buckingham Palace (MCs, DFCs). Most were young serving members, and I felt proud and privileged to share their company. Unlike one or two others posting here, I would like to think that they, and their views on life, represent the majority of today's generation of junior officers.
And for the few that choose to claim their peripatetic lifestyle, brought on by their operational status, as a reason for being unable to maintain membership, that's fine. But remember that many members have been in that position during their serving life, and to collectively describe them in the manner of Posts 29 & 31 is inappropriate.
Torque,
My single room with shower and WC for two weekday nights in December is £114 - surely that can't be bad? Don't know Rowley, but me and my old muckers will raise a glass to him. Won't tell you which night, but you would recognise us by our good manners, friendly banter, lack of upper foliage and inebriated demeanour. Join us!
And for the few that choose to claim their peripatetic lifestyle, brought on by their operational status, as a reason for being unable to maintain membership, that's fine. But remember that many members have been in that position during their serving life, and to collectively describe them in the manner of Posts 29 & 31 is inappropriate.
Torque,
My single room with shower and WC for two weekday nights in December is £114 - surely that can't be bad? Don't know Rowley, but me and my old muckers will raise a glass to him. Won't tell you which night, but you would recognise us by our good manners, friendly banter, lack of upper foliage and inebriated demeanour. Join us!
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You clearly know full well what a Grob 115E is, Lightning Mate, and I don't imagine your current steed has a trigger, either.
As to the to and fro of the discussion points, surely we can all make our own minds up as to whether we wish to be members of the RAF Club. Nobody forced me to join, and I would hope that the newbies coming out of IOT are not being given the hard sell.
As to the to and fro of the discussion points, surely we can all make our own minds up as to whether we wish to be members of the RAF Club. Nobody forced me to join, and I would hope that the newbies coming out of IOT are not being given the hard sell.
Well said, jindabyne!
Years ago - quite a few, actually - I was sitting in the Cowdray Room having a quiet drink. A distinguished-looking old gent and his guest sat down opposite and began to chat....
It was Bob Stanford-Tuck - he was chatting with some meeja-luvvy about his friend, 'Dolfo' Galland.
The RAF Club has improved immeasurably over the years. It isn't some convenient doss house for kids out-on-the-town, it's a Club. But it is neither stuffy nor an old farts' rest home, it's what the members make it.
I say stuff the ignorant young oiks; let them stay in one of the hotels. Innit...
Years ago - quite a few, actually - I was sitting in the Cowdray Room having a quiet drink. A distinguished-looking old gent and his guest sat down opposite and began to chat....
It was Bob Stanford-Tuck - he was chatting with some meeja-luvvy about his friend, 'Dolfo' Galland.
The RAF Club has improved immeasurably over the years. It isn't some convenient doss house for kids out-on-the-town, it's a Club. But it is neither stuffy nor an old farts' rest home, it's what the members make it.
I say stuff the ignorant young oiks; let them stay in one of the hotels. Innit...
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Sorry Beags, I think you're well off the mark with your last post, which I presume was aimed fairly squarely at me. If you write off me and my colleagues as ignorant young oiks, then I presume you'll understand why The Club is in trouble again, wondering how to get more young blood and cashflow in.
The truth is I am proud to be a member of the RAF Club and value it as a direct link to my former job, of which I am also very proud. I plan to remain a member for life and would use it every day if I worked in central London.
However, in the decade-ish that I've known it, the Club has gone from being b----dy good value to a bit on the steep side. I'm sure you can work out the effect that has on those of us who are not on Spec Aircrew rates. I always enjoy visiting whether it be for a reunion and dinining-in night, a meal in the restaurant, a G&T on the balcony or just as somewhere to crash out after a night on the town. They always seem happy for me to settle my bill regardless of the reason for my visit.
I suspect you and I were no different when you were my age (back in the Cretaceous Period)
The truth is I am proud to be a member of the RAF Club and value it as a direct link to my former job, of which I am also very proud. I plan to remain a member for life and would use it every day if I worked in central London.
However, in the decade-ish that I've known it, the Club has gone from being b----dy good value to a bit on the steep side. I'm sure you can work out the effect that has on those of us who are not on Spec Aircrew rates. I always enjoy visiting whether it be for a reunion and dinining-in night, a meal in the restaurant, a G&T on the balcony or just as somewhere to crash out after a night on the town. They always seem happy for me to settle my bill regardless of the reason for my visit.
I suspect you and I were no different when you were my age (back in the Cretaceous Period)
No, not having a go at you, Torque Tonight, just mocking the prose of those who consider it acceptable to complain about 'old farts' in the Club.
As for price, I've booked 2 nights in Jan 2010 - arriving Sunday evening and leaving Tuesday morning. Single with shower and WC - total cost £109.
Whereas for the same period at somewhere like the Novotel in Paddington, the cost would have been at least double that figure.
Yes, hotels in the UK are generally pretty expensive compared with those in Europe, but the Club's prices are very reasonable - particularly for 'old farts' living on a Service pension.
As for price, I've booked 2 nights in Jan 2010 - arriving Sunday evening and leaving Tuesday morning. Single with shower and WC - total cost £109.
Whereas for the same period at somewhere like the Novotel in Paddington, the cost would have been at least double that figure.
Yes, hotels in the UK are generally pretty expensive compared with those in Europe, but the Club's prices are very reasonable - particularly for 'old farts' living on a Service pension.