Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

Mrs Bloggs 'At Home' Etiquette/Protocols

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

Mrs Bloggs 'At Home' Etiquette/Protocols

Old 16th Nov 2010, 19:21
  #221 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,646
Originally Posted by Wander00 View Post
In the early 80s a fellow flight commander at Cranwell (P... Cong...?) wrote an updated guide for young officers called, if I remember correctly, "Behind the Hangar Doors". I have a copy somewhere. I must see if I can find it.
You mean:

An updated version of Stradling called 'Per ardua ad astra.' was written by a former Regiment officer, Phil Congdon, and published in 1987.There's some good stuff in it [although not as good as the advice on this thread] on how to reply to invitations etc
As posted by NRU74 at serial 214?
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 16th Nov 2010, 19:39
  #222 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
Posts: 25,552
And remember, NEVER, ever, fold a used linen napkin, at the end of a meal unless you are staying in the house for subsequent meals.
Normal hotel etiquette as well. But woe betide you should you ever refer to a napkin as a 'serviette'....
BEagle is offline  
Old 16th Nov 2010, 20:02
  #223 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: west lancs uk
Age: 72
Posts: 110
Napkins

Thought I had cracked the table etiquette after 30 months concentrated training, and disguised my lowly upbringing, until, graduation lunch in college hall, dear mother (who was clearly trying too hard) asked the senior officer to pass the cruet - the shame of it lingers !!!
chopd95 is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 06:54
  #224 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 1,259
The Important Thing .........

.......... was your mother sitting above or below the salt?

It suggests you and she were well placed at lunch, if you had a 'senior officer' within hailing distance.

Also to be remembered; it was the senior officer's fault!! If he had been the proper host, he would have enquired of your mother if she would like the salt & pepper and any other 'frillies' on the table. You have my permission to expunge your shame from the memory banks.

O-D
Old-Duffer is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 07:53
  #225 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,646
At a girls' boarding school near us they were forbidden from asking for the salt and pepper; they were always told to offer it.

So, the S&P sitting forlornly at one end of the table, the girl at the other end, wanting it, would politely ask "would you like the S&P Emily" of the girl with the S&P. Subtle!
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 07:58
  #226 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: East Midlands
Age: 80
Posts: 1,510
SFAIK The George at Leadenham has, or used to have, the largest collection of whiskies that were available to be bought and drunk. There may be larger collections but they are for show only. Years ago theye had an early Japanes whisky which claimed to be made from "Genuine Imported Scottish Grapes"!
A2QFI is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 08:00
  #227 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: France
Age: 76
Posts: 6,385
PN - corect on both points - I had missed Post 214, and you had a better memory of the correct title. Thanks
Wander00 is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 14:02
  #228 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Their Target for Tonight
Posts: 544
Wasn't the guide issued during IOT in the '80s the famed 'Caesar'? Customs, Etiquette and Social Responsibilities (CESR) if I recall correctly.
Red Line Entry is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 14:56
  #229 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,646
Drinks moderately and wisely

Mr & Mrs MM will of course drink socially and wisely but does anyone remember the "Drinks" item on the 1369? It was dropped after th e60s I believe but one box, can't remember if it rated a one or a nine was "Drinks immoderately and unwisely" or words to that effect.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 15:24
  #230 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 1,259
The Dreaded Letters

PN's post reminds me of the example letters which appeared in the ISS training manuals for those pursuing a staff college qualifier after the old 'Q' exam was binned.

The Formal official letter example was written by "Flt Lt D A L Croxley" and it was a masterpiece of 'Sir, I have the honour' stuff. This guy is complaining that he has been pillored for too much drinking and his 'direct' management style. Of course now it's called: Defence Writing and all those lovely styles have gone. My personal favourite was the Air Force Board Letter of Grave Displeasure!

On my OCTU course we had a female who couldn't understand that, even if you were writing to confess some awful crime, you still used the 'formal official style:

Sir,
I have the honour to report that I have murdered my wife and stolen the mess silver..........
Old-Duffer is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 15:53
  #231 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,646
Or the ending:

"I have the honour to be, Sir, your obedient servant"

but I prefer:

The Duke of Wellington is said to have once ended a letter "Your most humble and obedient servant (which you know damned well I am not).

But wouldn't be wonderful today not - using such a formula as some kind of ***-take - but to petty officials and MPs
"You have the honour to be, Sir, my most humble and obedient servant."
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 16:16
  #232 (permalink)  

Gentleman Aviator
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Teetering Towers - somewhere in the Shires
Age: 70
Posts: 3,394
PN
It was dropped after th e60s I believe but one box, can't remember if it rated a one or a nine was "Drinks immoderately and unwisely" or words to that effect.
It was a four box matrix headed "This officer Drinks ...." and the "axes" were Wisely/Unwisely and Frequently/Infrequently, so you could be Wisely Frequently, Wisely Infrequently, Unwisely Infrequently (most of us?) or Unwisely Frequently (and we all know some of them ....)

I did hear a suggestion that the entire 1369 could be replaced by that box, if the word "Thinks" were substituted for "Drinks".

And I must add that I'm not THAT old! But I worked once as a Barnwood desky, and we had (subtly differing) 1369s going back to the 1950s for some of our older brethren....
teeteringhead is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 17:40
  #233 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 1,259
Oh Dear ..........

............. Teeteringhead, how brave (rash?) of you to admit to being a Barnwood desky.

My first 1369 confidential report was written circa early 1965 and before the days of formal interviews and a more general openess. I was not unduly concerned of the finer points of the confidential report and filled in the bits that were mine and got shot of it. I took no notice of the bit that said 'if you award a starred number for this quality, you must inform the officer'. Starred numbers were '3' or below in some of the qualities but not all

Some weeks later, I was summoned by 'the boss' and he said as a throw away line; "Young Duffer, I've given you a starred item for Tact" - nothing more, no discussion etc. "Thank you, Sir" says and I go forth pretty pleased that I'm already scoring 'stars' and I've only been in the game less than a year.

It was only the following year, when I got the 1369 forms to fill in again that I realised what the boss had meant - and me having spent 12 months thinking I was a model of tact and diplomacy! Mind you, I was to receive many more blows to my ego, courtesy of the dreaded 1369.

O-D
Old-Duffer is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 17:51
  #234 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: UAE & Africa
Posts: 89
You guys make me homesick. This is such a hilarious thread! I must mention it to my mum, she is an air force widow and would find it terribly amusing as well.
John Miller is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 18:08
  #235 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: 45 yards from a tropical beach
Posts: 1,104
Ah! The time is approaching 1369.

At ISK in the latter '60s, we had a Flight Commander Bean-Stealer.There were at least 12 bachelor officers on 120, and he, of course, saw us all at work and at play. He was fond of saying that he wished there were a 'morals' section in the 1369, as there would be a few 'starred items' flying about.

He got his come-uppance when he was caught 'seeing to' the wife of an officer who was away on a two-month detachment in Sharjah. In those days, that was beyond the pale so he was Drummed Out - a year short of his pension.
Neptunus Rex is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 18:37
  #236 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,646
Originally Posted by Neptunus Rex View Post
In those days, that was beyond the pale so he was Drummed Out - a year short of his pension.
True of the 70s too although a 2-month det to Sharjah was discrete. Bonking during sorties was cutting it fine - too fine one night at the Flt Cdr miscounted

Or even worse during night shifts - the cuckold at ISL and Mrs at ISK.

But this is far too advaced for Mr & Mrs MM, unless of course it comes to car keys or tales out of school.
Pontius Navigator is online now  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 19:10
  #237 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: morayshire
Posts: 768
...and was drummed out"

...and died of a heart attack on an escalator on the Underground a short while afterwards. Referred to in the estimable "Sharjah Free Press" as hyphen blunt, no?

The Ancient Mariner
Rossian is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 20:20
  #238 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Wilts
Age: 74
Posts: 115
A speech I heard at a dining-in night given by an ex Barnwood desk officer included several (probably apocryphal) tales of entries on 1369's. My favourite was:
"There's only one person who drinks more beer in the mess than this officer and that is his wife"
He didn't relate the effect on the guy's career - probably onwards and upwards!
EngAl is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 20:34
  #239 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: South of Old Warden
Age: 82
Posts: 1,380
tales of entries on 1369's.
'This officer thinks he's the Squadron wit...unfortunately he is only half right!
goudie is offline  
Old 17th Nov 2010, 20:57
  #240 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Much-Binding-in-the-Marsh
Posts: 460
I used to lecture on CESR at IOT. My basic line was 'This is a load of bolleaux, if you need to be told how to behave - you're in the wrong place'!

Shortest lesson going - the Cadets loved it
Impiger is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.