Unable to join University Air squadron because of childhood asthma
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The Services still need graduate officers. They need to engage with potential officers before they graduate and a University unit is a good and economical proposition rather than trying to recruit them through adverts etc.
The Services still need graduate officers
Having new jnr officers with experience/practical knowledge of all the services, beyond that they get taught during IOT/equivalent would only be beneficial to the Service they then join...?
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Motn, indeed that is a good idea. I started in the Army cadets and never forgot the field craft etc that I was taught. Our officers were all ex-military including Para and our mentors were the Border Regiment.
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Purple OTC?
Schools with CCF sections have at least Army, often RAF and less commonly Royal Navy sections, with Royal Marines sections not unheard of.
No reason why URNU/OTC/UAS could not do the same, with a common first year, and then blue/green/light blue options for each of years two and three.
No reason why URNU/OTC/UAS could not do the same, with a common first year, and then blue/green/light blue options for each of years two and three.
Who would ever wish to join such an organisation though?
The more I hear about the way things have changed at UASs, the more glad I am to have had my time as a regular RAF QFI whilst things were still good. We still gave students high standards of flying training and deployed to a Summer camp at another RAF aerodrome. No 'strength through joy' nonsense - and a good time was had by all. The students had a much more demanding syallabus than I'd know as a student in the early 1970s and it was a pleasure to have worked with them. But even in 1993, the end of the University Cadet programme was forecast - 'bursaries' and 'bounties' were worth a fraction of the generous pay scales we'd enjoyed as APOs immediately after the 'military salary' scheme had been introduced in 1970. Because I'd done a year as a Flt Cdt at RAFC before going to university, I was a substantive Plt Off in my final university year and was paid about 3 times the amount of money a civilian student on a maximum LEA grant received.
How did we ever let things slide to the current nadir? To be honest, there appears little worth saving......
The more I hear about the way things have changed at UASs, the more glad I am to have had my time as a regular RAF QFI whilst things were still good. We still gave students high standards of flying training and deployed to a Summer camp at another RAF aerodrome. No 'strength through joy' nonsense - and a good time was had by all. The students had a much more demanding syallabus than I'd know as a student in the early 1970s and it was a pleasure to have worked with them. But even in 1993, the end of the University Cadet programme was forecast - 'bursaries' and 'bounties' were worth a fraction of the generous pay scales we'd enjoyed as APOs immediately after the 'military salary' scheme had been introduced in 1970. Because I'd done a year as a Flt Cdt at RAFC before going to university, I was a substantive Plt Off in my final university year and was paid about 3 times the amount of money a civilian student on a maximum LEA grant received.
How did we ever let things slide to the current nadir? To be honest, there appears little worth saving......
We are broke enough to be selling the family silver, so how do you justify the cost of UASs, even if it is small..?
First of all, in terms of graduate recruitment. What proportion of graduates currently joining the RAF were never in a UAS? Presumably there is no evidence to suggest, especially after the new enhanced 30 week IOT, that these non-UAS graduates go on to be worse officers than their ex-UAS contempories. How many universities are actually covered by the current UASs?
I thought I had read somewhere that the RAF was looking to recruit a higher proportion of pilots at 18, to get more years out of them when they are fitter, have higher g- tolerance, better eyesight, etc.. Maybe that was boll*#ks though....
You could argue that people who want to join the military will find their own way into it without the UAS experience, and with a drastically reduced military the recruitment numbers required are much smaller anyway.
First of all, in terms of graduate recruitment. What proportion of graduates currently joining the RAF were never in a UAS? Presumably there is no evidence to suggest, especially after the new enhanced 30 week IOT, that these non-UAS graduates go on to be worse officers than their ex-UAS contempories. How many universities are actually covered by the current UASs?
I thought I had read somewhere that the RAF was looking to recruit a higher proportion of pilots at 18, to get more years out of them when they are fitter, have higher g- tolerance, better eyesight, etc.. Maybe that was boll*#ks though....
You could argue that people who want to join the military will find their own way into it without the UAS experience, and with a drastically reduced military the recruitment numbers required are much smaller anyway.
Who would ever wish to join such an organisation though?
Yes, it's not the same as the one you went through.
No, we don't care.
Why should we care what you did? It has zero relevance to what we do.
How did we ever let things slide to the current nadir?
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
How many universities are actually covered by the current UASs?
I thought I had read somewhere that the RAF was looking to recruit a higher proportion of pilots at 18, to get more years out of them when they are fitter, have higher g- tolerance, better eyesight, etc.. Maybe that was boll*#ks though....
You could argue that people who want to join the military will find their own way into it without the UAS experience, and with a drastically reduced military the recruitment numbers required are much smaller anyway.
It is just one of the options. Is it an economic one is a different question.
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I thought I had read somewhere that the RAF was looking to recruit a higher proportion of pilots at 18, to get more years out of them when they are fitter, have higher g- tolerance, better eyesight, etc.. Maybe that was boll*#ks though....
Ms AA looked at the 18 y/o entry for the FAA (with in-service degree) but realised that if she got chopped/medic'd out she'd have to start all over again to get a degree, which would be tough, if perhaps you left aged 21. Far easier to go to university, and apply in the third year, or apply for a bursary in/before first year. Since she got 3 x A at A-level she had a wide choice of universities, too.
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Because I'd done a year as a Flt Cdt at RAFC before going to university, I was a substantive Plt Off in my final university year and was paid about 3 times the amount of money a civilian student on a maximum LEA grant received.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Mr C H, mmmm 
The same was obviously considered true of flying instructional pay pre-90s until they realised it was a recruiting incentive to the willing who would possibly have paid to be trained
Certainly when I joined, pay was so low we needed that extra 6/- per day.
The same was obviously considered true of flying instructional pay pre-90s until they realised it was a recruiting incentive to the willing who would possibly have paid to be trained
Certainly when I joined, pay was so low we needed that extra 6/- per day.
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BEagle - in the 70s and early 80s the Services pissed money away.
I well remember GL (X) Midshipmites (Sub Lts in third year) being sent to do a three-year degree course at City University on lodging allowance for the entire time. They had more cash in their pockets than you could imagine, as they were on full pay too.
We live in straightened times, I'm sorry to say. I'm still certain that I had a higher disposable income as a 2nd year Mid with flying training pay (post '79 pay rise) than I have ever had since.
I well remember GL (X) Midshipmites (Sub Lts in third year) being sent to do a three-year degree course at City University on lodging allowance for the entire time. They had more cash in their pockets than you could imagine, as they were on full pay too.
We live in straightened times, I'm sorry to say. I'm still certain that I had a higher disposable income as a 2nd year Mid with flying training pay (post '79 pay rise) than I have ever had since.
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Yeah he's a top bloke, did my IOT grad a few years ago and he mentioned he enjoyed banging out of the odd harrier! As with the Asthma case I had an inhaler sporadically on my med records till the age of 15 and after alot of determination I forced my way to pilot, if you dont try you won't get!
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The Services still need graduate officers
The only benefit to the RAF I can see is the idea that the sort of people you currently find on a UAS are the sorts of people that, in time, may well end up as some of life's "high flyers". So a positive experience on a UAS for those people will leave a positive attitude and improved awareness of the forces among "tomorrow's leaders".
But how do you measure that? To me it's highly ambiguous and very questionable if it's worth ALL that money...
How many universities are actually covered by the current UASs?
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UAS's provide the RAF with very few junior officers each year (typically 4/5 per UAS)
(Full disclosure: I'm not one of them. I was a bursar.)
over half joined the UAS as bursars (i.e. were "in" before even arriving at the UAS)
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Just my few pennies worth....
When I was an Air Cadet, back in the eighties, my CO told us that a study had shown, that pound for pound, the Cadets were much better value for money in recruiting future FJ pilots, than the UAS' were.
Admittedly, he had a case of jealousy towards the Bulldogs the UAS were using, while we were still using Chipmunks.
Anyone remember this study?
To play devils advocate, scrap the UAS and plough half the money saved into the Air Cadets. A boost for them, and may well help some youngsters in deprived areas make something of themselves.
When I was an Air Cadet, back in the eighties, my CO told us that a study had shown, that pound for pound, the Cadets were much better value for money in recruiting future FJ pilots, than the UAS' were.
Admittedly, he had a case of jealousy towards the Bulldogs the UAS were using, while we were still using Chipmunks.
Anyone remember this study?
To play devils advocate, scrap the UAS and plough half the money saved into the Air Cadets. A boost for them, and may well help some youngsters in deprived areas make something of themselves.
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he had a case of jealousy towards the Bulldogs the UAS were using, while we were still using Chipmunks.
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Ah, but the 'dogs' were shiny and new, we were still waiting for a Chippie replacement and he was not viewing with the benefit of nostalgic eyesight. I'd have to agree now though.
I think the real reason though was a bit of organisational rivalry over budgets.
I think the real reason though was a bit of organisational rivalry over budgets.
Last edited by ghostie; 15th Oct 2010 at 18:37. Reason: To add 2nd paragraph, for clarity