F-35 Cancelled, then what ?
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There is no end to the F-35 test program perfidy. First you had an UK civvie ex-UK knuck jumping off of ski ramps as lead test pilot, not to mention a Canuckian ONLY test pilot 'flying' the F-35B 'on the ground' in a cold/hot test chamber then he goes and beez the only aerobatic Parisian test pilot! What gives with this Norskman doing slippin' and a slidin' testin' for 'mericans, norf to Alaska - I'm going norf the rush is on. 
Plenty more test pilots are specialists but I'm too tired to type them all. 
Plenty more test pilots are specialists but I'm too tired to type them all.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
A bit OTT, but expressing the view of many USMC Grunts. The links embedded in the story lead to the original article.
SNAFU!: Pentagon takes over cost savings program from Lockheed...Death spiral obviously on the horizon.
SNAFU!: Pentagon takes over cost savings program from Lockheed...Death spiral obviously on the horizon.
Is the drag chute programme a fully LGBTXi? compliant exercise in female clothing?????
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I think there might be something based on how the machine and the human are interacting that’s altering the breathing,” Bishop said."
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
New F-35 warplane costs $1 trillion to operate
The estimated lifetime cost to operate and support the world’s most expensive warplane has risen by almost a quarter in four years, a US spending watchdog has found.
The figures on the US fleet of F-35 Lighting II, from the Government Accountability Office (GAO) in the United States, were released on Thursday, barely a week after a British defence minister, giving evidence to MPs, said that she did not know the UK-specific cost for the full F-35 programme......
The GAO report, entitled F-35 aircraft sustainment, painted a picture of rising support costs and a lack of understanding within the US military of what they were paying for. It said that the US Marine Corps, which flies the F-35B — the same variant as the UK — saw the amount of money charged for support this year rise to $364 million from $293 million, largely because of contractor personnel costs. To afford the hike “the Marine Corps had to reduce its planned flying hours”, the GAO said.
The F-35 JPO wants to reduce by 30 per cent the 60-year cost of support and operation for the US’s fleet of F-35s. It was estimated to be $850 billion in 2012. However, as of 2016 the estimate had jumped by 23.9 per cent to $1.06 trillion, the GAO said. It warned of a failure by the Pentagon to set budget limits for support costs based on what the military could afford. This could affect the availability of spare parts and support to Britain’s F-35s. The US plans to buy 2,457 jets in all. Britain owns 12 and plans to buy a total of 138.
A Lockheed Martin spokeswoman said: “We are working with the JPO to understand every factor of the cost per flying hour and identify disciplined ways we can reduce the overall operations and sustainment costs as we have done on the F-35’s unit recurring flyaway cost.”.....
The estimated lifetime cost to operate and support the world’s most expensive warplane has risen by almost a quarter in four years, a US spending watchdog has found.
The figures on the US fleet of F-35 Lighting II, from the Government Accountability Office (GAO) in the United States, were released on Thursday, barely a week after a British defence minister, giving evidence to MPs, said that she did not know the UK-specific cost for the full F-35 programme......
The GAO report, entitled F-35 aircraft sustainment, painted a picture of rising support costs and a lack of understanding within the US military of what they were paying for. It said that the US Marine Corps, which flies the F-35B — the same variant as the UK — saw the amount of money charged for support this year rise to $364 million from $293 million, largely because of contractor personnel costs. To afford the hike “the Marine Corps had to reduce its planned flying hours”, the GAO said.
The F-35 JPO wants to reduce by 30 per cent the 60-year cost of support and operation for the US’s fleet of F-35s. It was estimated to be $850 billion in 2012. However, as of 2016 the estimate had jumped by 23.9 per cent to $1.06 trillion, the GAO said. It warned of a failure by the Pentagon to set budget limits for support costs based on what the military could afford. This could affect the availability of spare parts and support to Britain’s F-35s. The US plans to buy 2,457 jets in all. Britain owns 12 and plans to buy a total of 138.
A Lockheed Martin spokeswoman said: “We are working with the JPO to understand every factor of the cost per flying hour and identify disciplined ways we can reduce the overall operations and sustainment costs as we have done on the F-35’s unit recurring flyaway cost.”.....
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Report is here:
http://www.gao.gov/assets/690/687982.pdf
I'm ready to be corrected, but I don't see where these numbers include the recurring costs of Block upgrades, particularly new hardware. They certainly don't include the development and testing costs for upgrades, which are the thick end of a billion per year (so if you're assessed according to your fleet, and you are at a point where there are 1000 airplanes in service, it's still $1m/aircraft/year.
I suspect that this is one of the things crimping UK and USAF procurement and giving the USAF pain in reaching 60/year. That's the magic rate, as the average age of the fighter force is already creeping towards 30 years; because if you nominally have 1763 jets to be replaced by F-35s, 60 a year is a 30-year turnover so you can only stabilize at a 30-year average age.
http://www.gao.gov/assets/690/687982.pdf
I'm ready to be corrected, but I don't see where these numbers include the recurring costs of Block upgrades, particularly new hardware. They certainly don't include the development and testing costs for upgrades, which are the thick end of a billion per year (so if you're assessed according to your fleet, and you are at a point where there are 1000 airplanes in service, it's still $1m/aircraft/year.
I suspect that this is one of the things crimping UK and USAF procurement and giving the USAF pain in reaching 60/year. That's the magic rate, as the average age of the fighter force is already creeping towards 30 years; because if you nominally have 1763 jets to be replaced by F-35s, 60 a year is a 30-year turnover so you can only stabilize at a 30-year average age.
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Quote
"Navy deployments are even more difficult, since “intermediate-level” repair capabilities are needed on board ship. A lack of budget for that program, the GAO warns, leaves a $267 million shortfall between 2019 and 2023.
As was discussed by Warisboring last week, it's possible as many as 200 F-35s will remain permanently unfit for combat, because “the Pentagon would rather buy new aircraft than upgrade the ones the American people have already paid for”.
I fail to understand the lack of comprehension of on-board operations and the need to "fix stuff" on board ship.
It's almost criminally negligent..
Last edited by glad rag; 30th Oct 2017 at 16:50. Reason: " things
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F-35B Does Vertical Landing & SRVL in Warton UK Simulator
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h-Ux4QCACo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h-Ux4QCACo
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 31st Oct 2017 at 10:07. Reason: add Jpgs
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Interest in the B model just gets betta & betta....
Turkey expresses interest in buying F-35B STOVL variant 30 Oct 2017 Kerry Herschelman
Turkey expresses interest in buying F-35B STOVL variant 30 Oct 2017 Kerry Herschelman
"Turkey recently expressed to the United States its interest in purchasing the F-35B short take-off/vertical landing (STOVL) version of the Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter, Jane’s has learned from Turkish and Western defence industry sources. This is in addition to the 100 F-35As it already plans to buy from Lockheed Martin.
A senior Turkish Defence Industries undersecretariat official expressed his country’s interest in buying F-35 STOVL variants to Vice Admiral Mathias Winter, head of the US Defense Department’s F-35 programme office, during a meeting held in Ankara in mid-October. It is unclear how many F-35B STOVL variants Turkey intends to buy...."
Turkey expresses interest in buying F-35B STOVL variant | Jane's 360
A senior Turkish Defence Industries undersecretariat official expressed his country’s interest in buying F-35 STOVL variants to Vice Admiral Mathias Winter, head of the US Defense Department’s F-35 programme office, during a meeting held in Ankara in mid-October. It is unclear how many F-35B STOVL variants Turkey intends to buy...."
Turkey expresses interest in buying F-35B STOVL variant | Jane's 360
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Yes thinking hot weather by UK brings to mind those mad dogs & Englishmen.... The English always wanna be different. 
" UK 'hot day'Ambient Temperature: 35.5ºC and Pressure: 992mb
https://vtol.org/store/product/devel...craft-9024.cfm
https://vtol.org/store/product/devel...craft-9024.cfm
KPP: somewhat less than above "sea level, tropical day, 10 kts operational WOD"
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Mad dogs and Englishmen aside, it appears to me that the delusional ones are the people who think that since the MIL-STD-210A assumes a certain pressure, and the KPP assumes a WOD, reality will conform to the MIL-spec wherever you might be operating.
Gulf weather is different, and generating WOD is not always easy without running into a tanker or out of water. And of course it doesn't help that even stripped, carved up, with downgraded g, the jet is still a ton heavier than it was at contract signature.
Gulf weather is different, and generating WOD is not always easy without running into a tanker or out of water. And of course it doesn't help that even stripped, carved up, with downgraded g, the jet is still a ton heavier than it was at contract signature.
Interesting, earlier this year the Turkish President Erdogan indicated Turkey will build aircraft carriers: Erdogan says Turkey to build aircraft carriers
We could see some interesting continuing, new, or returning, players to fixed wing carrier aviation with the B aboard various flat decks. Besides the US and UK, there have been the musings about Japan, Egypt, Australia, Italy, Spain all with their biggish flat tops, and now Turkey....
Bet Brazil would like to, but can't afford it
I don't think Turkey can either, SD.
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Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Depends what "block" your talking about....weight increases up to block 4....
There are suggestions by LM to change the engine of course (having eliminated the contemporary more powerful competitor), but at least a decade or more in the future - and untold billions more in cost - and unaffordable as a retrofit and thus fulfilling their wishes for a solution involving the replacement all the current and programmed tranches.....
Cynical? Moi??