F-35 Cancelled, then what ?
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g r
You and I both know that it 'isn't the case', which was the point of F-35 not being solely for carriers. Reality, not time, is what will tell, and I can tell you that reality right now is that the RN could not do this alone and does not want to because it sees the enormity of it. It would take years and years for them to train enough people to be self-sustaining. Not to mention a massive budget slice.
Thankfully there is only a very, very small number of RN that still harbour the paranoia of light blue skullduggery. They are the ones who need to (as you so eloquently put it) stfu. There is no skullduggery, just a mutually agreed plan to bring Carrier Strike to life, together. None of it will work unless it's Joint.
From where I sit right now it's nothing but Joint. Sadly the small 'cadre of the paranoid' can only be heard above the noise of Jointery by using former 1SLs as a platform. It doesn't make him look good in this day and age.
You and I both know that it 'isn't the case', which was the point of F-35 not being solely for carriers. Reality, not time, is what will tell, and I can tell you that reality right now is that the RN could not do this alone and does not want to because it sees the enormity of it. It would take years and years for them to train enough people to be self-sustaining. Not to mention a massive budget slice.
Thankfully there is only a very, very small number of RN that still harbour the paranoia of light blue skullduggery. They are the ones who need to (as you so eloquently put it) stfu. There is no skullduggery, just a mutually agreed plan to bring Carrier Strike to life, together. None of it will work unless it's Joint.
From where I sit right now it's nothing but Joint. Sadly the small 'cadre of the paranoid' can only be heard above the noise of Jointery by using former 1SLs as a platform. It doesn't make him look good in this day and age.
Last edited by MSOCS; 13th Feb 2016 at 09:18. Reason: sp
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MSOCS, the F35B will be a UK asset, whether it should be is beyond the scope of this reply.
The fact that it is means that we, ie the UK, will have to make the best of it period.
The only chance of that is if the services jointly push for the very best outcome from their purchase.
This is further compounded by the seeming impossibility of any national "improvement" programmes.
making a purse out of a sow's ear...?
Good luck with that.
The fact that it is means that we, ie the UK, will have to make the best of it period.
The only chance of that is if the services jointly push for the very best outcome from their purchase.
This is further compounded by the seeming impossibility of any national "improvement" programmes.
making a purse out of a sow's ear...?
Good luck with that.
and as always, too little information can be a dangerous thing.
Indeed it can. But as someone said (I used to think it was Will Rogers, but it predates him): "It's not what we don't know that gets us in trouble, but what we do know, that ain't so."
Indeed it can. But as someone said (I used to think it was Will Rogers, but it predates him): "It's not what we don't know that gets us in trouble, but what we do know, that ain't so."
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CM : From a1b's link:
"the F-35 is an evolution in air superiority."
So it IS an air superiority fighter. Won't be needing F-22 anymore then.
"the F-35 is an evolution in air superiority."
So it IS an air superiority fighter. Won't be needing F-22 anymore then.
CM : You don't have to be a fighter to achieve air superiority. We referred to our job in the F-3 as air defence.
The modern term "air superiority fighter" was coined as a means of describing the claimed effectiveness of an aircraft in achieving that state. When that wasn't enough to make your jet stand out from the crowd, even better terms were invented - "air supremacy" and "air dominance". All of which actually mean the same thing in military terms.
The modern term "air superiority fighter" was coined as a means of describing the claimed effectiveness of an aircraft in achieving that state. When that wasn't enough to make your jet stand out from the crowd, even better terms were invented - "air supremacy" and "air dominance". All of which actually mean the same thing in military terms.
a1b: I just ran across the valuable piece of advice for people who type in lower case all the time:
Capital letters are the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse" and "i helped my uncle jack off a horse".
Capital letters are the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse" and "i helped my uncle jack off a horse".
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LowObservable
Great Put Down!!
a1bill
I believe that you meant now and NOT know
a1b: I just ran across the valuable piece of advice for people who type in lower case all the time:
Capital letters are the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse" and "i helped my uncle jack off a horse".
13th Feb 2016 12:13
Capital letters are the difference between "I helped my Uncle Jack off a horse" and "i helped my uncle jack off a horse".
13th Feb 2016 12:13
a1bill
you have lost me know.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Mark Twain, shoulda guessed.....
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
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ORAC,
Good find! Who woulda thought that history is repeating itself. I guess it confirms the saying, "The one thing about history is we learn we don't learn."
LOL.......
Edwards AFB executes F-35 'deployment' plan
412th LRS executes F-35 'deployment' plan
2/11/2016 - EDWARDS AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. -- The 412th Logistics Readiness Squadron "deployed" 81 personnel from the 31st Test and Evaluation Squadron to Mountain Home Air Force Base, Idaho, Feb. 9. The troops will be involved in a month-long test mission. A day earlier, six F-35s from the 31st TES took off and landed at the Idaho base
2/11/2016 - EDWARDS AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. -- The 412th Logistics Readiness Squadron "deployed" 81 personnel from the 31st Test and Evaluation Squadron to Mountain Home Air Force Base, Idaho, Feb. 9. The troops will be involved in a month-long test mission. A day earlier, six F-35s from the 31st TES took off and landed at the Idaho base
I would suspect lots of help with a mountain of spares and scores of contractors for the first off base test deployment of the A, like was done for the B test deployment/experiment aboard the USS WASP.
Of minor interest, the contract 737 from Southwest Airlines to send the 81 airmen- maybe they can pick up a few tips about quick turns and dispatch rates
Of minor interest, the contract 737 from Southwest Airlines to send the 81 airmen- maybe they can pick up a few tips about quick turns and dispatch rates
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Nobody is trumpeting the Italian F-35A crossing the Atlantic? Check out its stellar performance:
"F-35 Makes First Transatlantic Crossing"
"NAVAL AIR STATION PATUXENT RIVER, Md. – An Italian Air Force F-35 completed the fighter jet’s first transatlantic crossing Friday, a historic event that kicks off a landmark year for the international program.
The aircraft, an Italian Air Force F-35A dubbed AL-1, touched down here Feb. 5 after a seven-hour flight from Lajes Air Base, Portugal. The plane, which began its journey from Cameri Air Base in Italy, on Tuesday, was scheduled to arrive here on Wednesday, but was delayed due to weather and maintenance issues..."
F-35 Makes First Transatlantic Crossing
Wot? MX issues? No wonder it was accompanied by C-130s carrying SAR equipment (and presumably spares and maintainers.)
And check out this poll by FlightGlobal:
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...c-cele-421863/
Ho hum.
"F-35 Makes First Transatlantic Crossing"
"NAVAL AIR STATION PATUXENT RIVER, Md. – An Italian Air Force F-35 completed the fighter jet’s first transatlantic crossing Friday, a historic event that kicks off a landmark year for the international program.
The aircraft, an Italian Air Force F-35A dubbed AL-1, touched down here Feb. 5 after a seven-hour flight from Lajes Air Base, Portugal. The plane, which began its journey from Cameri Air Base in Italy, on Tuesday, was scheduled to arrive here on Wednesday, but was delayed due to weather and maintenance issues..."
F-35 Makes First Transatlantic Crossing
Wot? MX issues? No wonder it was accompanied by C-130s carrying SAR equipment (and presumably spares and maintainers.)
And check out this poll by FlightGlobal:
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/ar...c-cele-421863/
Ho hum.
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The Italian built F35 having made the first Ocean transit must be rather embarrassing for LM, as as far as I know no US made planes have managed to get out of US controlled airspace, except for trips to USS Wasp and a couple of carriers.
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PhilipG,
I'd very much doubt there's any embarrassment, as much as the jet's detractors would like there to be. If you remember, the first trans-Atlantic move was planned for June 2014 but, due to a completely unforeseen and catastrophic engine problem, the Program wisely curtailed the trip until they could take adequate stock of the situation.
Roll forward a year and the USMC focus was their IOC. The Marines had offered huge support and help to the MoD to send the jets to the UK in 2014 but their more important IOC meant they couldn't in 2015.
Roll forward another year and the plan is to very much get the jets to the UK for this summer.
Of course it's very easy to look at the above facts in isolation and spin them into whatever narrative one chooses.
I'd very much doubt there's any embarrassment, as much as the jet's detractors would like there to be. If you remember, the first trans-Atlantic move was planned for June 2014 but, due to a completely unforeseen and catastrophic engine problem, the Program wisely curtailed the trip until they could take adequate stock of the situation.
Roll forward a year and the USMC focus was their IOC. The Marines had offered huge support and help to the MoD to send the jets to the UK in 2014 but their more important IOC meant they couldn't in 2015.
Roll forward another year and the plan is to very much get the jets to the UK for this summer.
Of course it's very easy to look at the above facts in isolation and spin them into whatever narrative one chooses.
Also on Flight Global.
International F-35 customers pushing block-buy plan
International F-35 customers pushing block-buy plan