More GR4 to Afghanistan
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Looking at the rather pathetic amount of GR4's we have there, I do wonder just how many Tornado's the general public would think we had out there, bearing in mind I would imagine they have a fairly accurate picture of the number of ground troops.
When there was talk of extra helicopters (or ellicopters at the time), I felt that the government hid behind 'operational security' when only mentioning percentages, rather than actual numbers of aircraft. With this new 'surge' in GR4's it really does sound better if we announce a 25% increase in numbers, rather than a measly 2 more!
Just my two penneth
When there was talk of extra helicopters (or ellicopters at the time), I felt that the government hid behind 'operational security' when only mentioning percentages, rather than actual numbers of aircraft. With this new 'surge' in GR4's it really does sound better if we announce a 25% increase in numbers, rather than a measly 2 more!
Just my two penneth
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Extra RAF jets announced as Defence Secretary visits Afghanistan
The UK is to send two additional Royal Air Force Tornado jets to Afghanistan, the Defence Secretary has announced on a visit to British forces serving there.
Dr Liam Fox, on his second visit to Afghanistan since being appointed Secretary of State, confirmed that the two Tornado GR4 aircraft have been sent from RAF Lossiemouth in Moray, arriving at Kandahar Airfield tomorrow (Thursday 12 August).
To read the full story click Here
Dr Liam Fox, on his second visit to Afghanistan since being appointed Secretary of State, confirmed that the two Tornado GR4 aircraft have been sent from RAF Lossiemouth in Moray, arriving at Kandahar Airfield tomorrow (Thursday 12 August).
To read the full story click Here
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Question?
Out of interest, how many extra Tornados and Attack Helicopters would we need to give the British guys on the ground 100% of the air cover required from British aircraft?
how many extra Tornados and Attack Helicopters would we need
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Is it me, or does the fact that we have a SoS announcement trumpeting the deployment of err, um, TWO GR4s underline the current emptiness of the cabinet? 
No disrespect to the crews (ground & air), but a Ministerial Statement for 2 jets? For 2 Sqns, maybe? But 2 jets?
Be safe out there!
S41
No disrespect to the crews (ground & air), but a Ministerial Statement for 2 jets? For 2 Sqns, maybe? But 2 jets?
Be safe out there!
S41
S41,
Couldn't agree more - when two of our most numerous combat type count as an important boost, it's time to worry! Oh well, at least it will be easier to deliver the jets from there to Bangladesh, or whichever other tinpot Asian country buys them for $500, once they are sold off after the SDSR...
Couldn't agree more - when two of our most numerous combat type count as an important boost, it's time to worry! Oh well, at least it will be easier to deliver the jets from there to Bangladesh, or whichever other tinpot Asian country buys them for $500, once they are sold off after the SDSR...
Last edited by TorqueOfTheDevil; 11th Aug 2010 at 20:27.
Come on Trim Stab you're starting to get really boring with your 'anti-FJ' digs in every post you make. How about you back your random accusation up with some facts (and not those that your TA mate told you down the pub .... or your bitter and twisted failed FJ co-pilot told you when you were last in your little biz jet).
S41 - it used to be that any increase in deployed forces, over and above those declared to parliament, required a formal SofS announcement to the House (particularly if it went over the agreed maximum 'head count'). Given the House is on its summer break I guess this was the next best method. Honesty, and following parliamentary protocol, was something lost on the previous administration and hence you didn't see it often. It is, after all, a 20-25% "surge" - if we surged a similar percentage of ground troops there would probably be quite a stir amongst the armchair fraternity.
S41 - it used to be that any increase in deployed forces, over and above those declared to parliament, required a formal SofS announcement to the House (particularly if it went over the agreed maximum 'head count'). Given the House is on its summer break I guess this was the next best method. Honesty, and following parliamentary protocol, was something lost on the previous administration and hence you didn't see it often. It is, after all, a 20-25% "surge" - if we surged a similar percentage of ground troops there would probably be quite a stir amongst the armchair fraternity.
Come on Trim Stab you're starting to get really boring with your 'anti-FJ' digs in every post you make. How about you back your random accusation up with some facts (and not those that your TA mate told you down the pub .... or your bitter and twisted failed FJ co-pilot told you when you were last in your little biz jet).
It was a genuine question. There was no "random accusation", nor am I anti FJ. I just asked whether the extra aircraft will increase net capability, or whether they are maybe just to cover poor dispatch rates of GR4? If extra crew are being deployed then the former, if no extra crew, then one has to presume the latter.
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WM,
Happy with this. And (much) happier that this Wasn't played as a "25% Surge" (not that any previous administration would ever have concerned themselves with such things.... ).
Nonetheless, a written statement would've been fine. And this does smack of desperation. Now, if they were sending another couple of Sqns of GR4 (North West Frontier Strike Wg, anyone?) then by all means a full Ministerial Statement.
S41
Given the House is on its summer break I guess this was the next best method. Honesty, and following parliamentary protocol, was something lost on the previous administration and hence you didn't see it often.
).Nonetheless, a written statement would've been fine. And this does smack of desperation. Now, if they were sending another couple of Sqns of GR4 (North West Frontier Strike Wg, anyone?) then by all means a full Ministerial Statement.
S41
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orm putting a former Doctor in charge of Defence
Nothing wrong with that - we live in a democracy luckily.
Nothing wrong with that - we live in a democracy luckily.
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Why not, the head of the Civil Aviation Authority came from the Chair of the Food Standards Agency, so at least the food may have improved at Gatwick, but she will know bugger all about Aviation.........
No doubt having a Doctor as the Minister of Defence you are now getting enough roughage in your diet, so you will be able to rough it here and rough it there
No doubt having a Doctor as the Minister of Defence you are now getting enough roughage in your diet, so you will be able to rough it here and rough it there
Why send Tornados???
Just toanswer the question 'why send Tornado?". Believe it or not less than 50% of Joint Tactical Air Requests (JTARs) from Coalition Forces on the ground are being "serviced" recently. So ISAF have asked for more FJs. So all the wokka mates can shut the f@ck up with the "we don't need FJs anymore, what we need is more wokkas!".
And who asked for the FJs? General P - the head cheese as I understand it. He's also asked for E3s to control the CAS stacks instead of the rank amateurs from LFs that do it now.
And that Ladies and Gents is why you need an Air Force - I thank you...
LJ
And who asked for the FJs? General P - the head cheese as I understand it. He's also asked for E3s to control the CAS stacks instead of the rank amateurs from LFs that do it now.
And that Ladies and Gents is why you need an Air Force - I thank you...
LJ
Trim Stab,
Your grasp of English must be good enough to realise that writing statements such as
immediately implies to visiting readers (journos perhaps) that the GR4 goes u/s a lot in HERRICK. You are in no position to know whether that is true - so it's not your place to comment on it. Perhaps if you'd said something even subtly different like "maybe just to cover possible poor dispatch rates of GR4" then you wouldn't have provoked the reaction you did! Anyway, it's SOP anti-Tornado banter that dates from the GR1 days; the jet has moved on in serviceability and capability, the banter needs to catch up!
Your grasp of English must be good enough to realise that writing statements such as
maybe just to cover poor dispatch rates of GR4