PUMA out of Gas?
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the crew made the correct decision by landing as they approached their fuel minima, having worked out that it was unlikely that they could make their destination, as they are trained to do. Had they not, and pressed on, the circumstances may have been markedly different, and may have justified the over-reaction from the emergency services
or
refuel site 22 miles from take off point, with 27 minutes endurance....
Applecross = 0' AMSL, Aultbea = 0' AMSL
Well done the crew (and for staying with the aircraft)
AFCs all round then?
'they learned about flying from that', as Wg Cdr Spry used to say!
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"Yesterday, a Ministry of Defence spokeswoman said bad weather had caused the Super Puma's estimated journey time to increase."
Pasptoo - I do hope you are on the wind up as you truly have shown a lot or ignorance/arrogance towards this incident. As the above quote suggests the crew did have enough fuel to fly direct to their destination but were unable to because of weather. This resulted in not having enough heading the long way round. As for "heading for the mountains" they were mountain flying already, not diverting there as suggested by you.
The crews stayed with the aircraft overnight to make sure it wasn't plundered during the night. Nothing to do with medals. Would you like to leave your car in the middle of nowhere overnight with sensitive equipment on board after having a lot of attention from the media and locals? I would suggest not.
The Daily Record is not renowned for is award winning journalism, dont take what the newspapers say as gospel.
Dont believe everything you read, newspapers wouldnt make money selling good news!
HG
Pasptoo - I do hope you are on the wind up as you truly have shown a lot or ignorance/arrogance towards this incident. As the above quote suggests the crew did have enough fuel to fly direct to their destination but were unable to because of weather. This resulted in not having enough heading the long way round. As for "heading for the mountains" they were mountain flying already, not diverting there as suggested by you.
The crews stayed with the aircraft overnight to make sure it wasn't plundered during the night. Nothing to do with medals. Would you like to leave your car in the middle of nowhere overnight with sensitive equipment on board after having a lot of attention from the media and locals? I would suggest not.
The Daily Record is not renowned for is award winning journalism, dont take what the newspapers say as gospel.
Dont believe everything you read, newspapers wouldnt make money selling good news!
HG
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Was this from ALD or Benson?
PS. Agreed heights good. The crew weren’t the first to land on outside the big fence due to lack of Avtur and won’t be the last. Not a drama.
Last edited by PhamousPhotographer; 30th Mar 2010 at 10:25. Reason: PS added
Many years ago in far warmer and wetter climes somebody was driving their Whirlwind around Malaysia on a Cat renewel. The trapper gave him odd tasks and small diversions and he followed these to the letter.
Eventually, after lots of prompting the trapper persuaded the candidate to land in a clearing before the engine went quiet. Fuel endurance had been the last thing on the mind of our hero and he was running out. I had to bring a drum of fuel and a pump so they could get back to Changi.
How to fail a 'D' Cat. renewel.
Eventually, after lots of prompting the trapper persuaded the candidate to land in a clearing before the engine went quiet. Fuel endurance had been the last thing on the mind of our hero and he was running out. I had to bring a drum of fuel and a pump so they could get back to Changi.
How to fail a 'D' Cat. renewel.
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QUOTE V Shocking.... Never happen in the Navy 
Vice Admiral Richard Bell Davies VC CB DSO AFC. Returning to Eastchurch, low on fuel. We would look for a hospitable looking country house, where we would land for lunch ,and petrol The house was Belhus Park , built in Tudor times, where Mrs Stead the owner provided lunch and fuel. He then took her up for a flight. Collecting a barrel of oysters, on another day when, running out of fuel
Vice Admiral Richard Bell Davies VC CB DSO AFC. Returning to Eastchurch, low on fuel. We would look for a hospitable looking country house, where we would land for lunch ,and petrol The house was Belhus Park , built in Tudor times, where Mrs Stead the owner provided lunch and fuel. He then took her up for a flight. Collecting a barrel of oysters, on another day when, running out of fuel
Torque of the devil. Twas Portugal on or around '87. Nav kept telling the pilot to land - kept on - one flamed out - told to land - kept on - second flamed out - just in front of them were some barracks - EOL into the parade square - tail boom broke off. Pilot left soon after to fly airlines!
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I have to agree. I think the Aircraft Commander should get an AFC for this. Because of his quick thinking and instinctive decision making he saved his crew and he saved a valuable aircraft.
Well done that man... See you at the Palace
Well done that man... See you at the Palace
Oldbeefer,
That's the one! Am I right in thinking that the parade square where they ended up was only about a mile from the airfield they were trying to reach? Doesn't make it any better, but the pilot must have thought he was home and dry just as the second engine quit. I'm surprised the nav hadn't tried more physical intervention by that stage when it became obvious that the pilot was giving a stiff ignoring to his warnings and to the loss of the first engine...!
TOTD
That's the one! Am I right in thinking that the parade square where they ended up was only about a mile from the airfield they were trying to reach? Doesn't make it any better, but the pilot must have thought he was home and dry just as the second engine quit. I'm surprised the nav hadn't tried more physical intervention by that stage when it became obvious that the pilot was giving a stiff ignoring to his warnings and to the loss of the first engine...!
TOTD
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Just so I get this straight, then:
They planned to fly through mountains, with less than 30 mins endurance. When bad weather was encountered (it was Scotland in winter, after all), instead of turning back towards their departure point which, if I did my sums right, they had enough fuel to reach (the entire planned journey taking less than half of their fuel), they div-navved onwards towards their destination, but couldn't get there with the fuel available, so landed in a field before they ran out of fuel and crashed.
Anyone else see the flaws?
Yes, all's well that ended well, and it's easier to analyse in hindsight, but a couple of better decisions earlier in the sortie could have saved red faces all round here.
They planned to fly through mountains, with less than 30 mins endurance. When bad weather was encountered (it was Scotland in winter, after all), instead of turning back towards their departure point which, if I did my sums right, they had enough fuel to reach (the entire planned journey taking less than half of their fuel), they div-navved onwards towards their destination, but couldn't get there with the fuel available, so landed in a field before they ran out of fuel and crashed.
Anyone else see the flaws?
Yes, all's well that ended well, and it's easier to analyse in hindsight, but a couple of better decisions earlier in the sortie could have saved red faces all round here.
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Nobody died; the aircraft is safe. Sounds good to me.
With hindsight there are better ways to do this (show me a sortie where there isn't!), but when all is said and done, see my first sentence.
With hindsight there are better ways to do this (show me a sortie where there isn't!), but when all is said and done, see my first sentence.
I think the Aircraft Commander should get an AFC for this. Because of his quick thinking and instinctive decision making he saved his crew and he saved a valuable aircraft.
The took action based on situation they were in at the time yet everybody wants to second guess them, aircraft ok, crew ok, pride hurt............way better than the alternative.
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TOTD
I seem to recall that JH, the navigator made some sort of promise whilst wielding the crash axe.
Heads down, look out for the flack
I seem to recall that JH, the navigator made some sort of promise whilst wielding the crash axe.
Heads down, look out for the flack
Last edited by Cabe LeCutter; 31st Mar 2010 at 01:38. Reason: spilling
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Read the DSFOR today, paints a rather different picture (unsurprisingly) from the drivel that's been in the press and on some of the posts here. Well worth a read.
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Seems like a lot of fuss about nothing - keeps the 'holier than thou' brigade going though and saves the rest of the trouble of digging up old Puma banter. Strikes me that if you've never got a bit low on gas and had to make the call then you're not doing it right - I just never ended up in the papers (not for almost running out of fuel that is......)
Worrying thing must be the amount of time SAR took to find a fully 'S' aircraft with uninjured crew who were operating all their mandatory equipment correctly on the mainland UK.
Mmmnice,
What did you make the papers for?
Mmmnice,
What did you make the papers for?