OT: but relevant- Gallantry awards
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OT: but relevant- Gallantry awards
Saw CDS on the news tonight with the GC awards to two outstanding people, one posthumous, for S/Sgt Schmid. I always thought that, for any particular decoration, a posthumous award precedes. Yet ACM Stirrup dealt with the surviving member first.
I remember rainy windswept days at RAF Bicester in my OUAS days; if you couldn't fly, then you had to work on your officer-like qualities as you sucked down vast quantities of NATO standard nescafe. Whilst perusing- I cannot put it stronger- QR, I'm sure I saw that posthumous decorations took precedence over survivors. This is borne out when you look, for example, at the Falklands list.
Am I right or wrong?
I remember rainy windswept days at RAF Bicester in my OUAS days; if you couldn't fly, then you had to work on your officer-like qualities as you sucked down vast quantities of NATO standard nescafe. Whilst perusing- I cannot put it stronger- QR, I'm sure I saw that posthumous decorations took precedence over survivors. This is borne out when you look, for example, at the Falklands list.
Am I right or wrong?
Maybe it depends on how the Media gurus are currently briefing people to handle TV interviews... it's possible Sir Jock dealt with the more "significant" award last to leave that as the "take away message" for that particular interview?
Gong Protocol
I think you may find that although a postumous 'gazetting' takes precedent, when it comes to the ceremonial the award winner (living) takes precedence over the 'family member' who is receiving the award on behalf of the award winner (deceased).
In any event, this was presentation of an illuminated citation not the investiture, which will be later this year at Buck House. It is also possible that Mrs Schmid was being presented with the Elizabeth Cross as the widow of a soldier killed on active service.
O-D
In any event, this was presentation of an illuminated citation not the investiture, which will be later this year at Buck House. It is also possible that Mrs Schmid was being presented with the Elizabeth Cross as the widow of a soldier killed on active service.
O-D
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Chippy 63,
I caught some of the live coverage of the ceremony in the afternoon. CDS did indeed present the posthumous award first.
I guess the evening news swapped them around during the editing.
I caught some of the live coverage of the ceremony in the afternoon. CDS did indeed present the posthumous award first.
I guess the evening news swapped them around during the editing.
Well I didn't learn that from QR's. The only thing I remember about QR's was removing all the pages concerned with the award of "Hard Living" allowances while manning flying boats moored in heavy seas and/or adverse weather. But it was a very long time ago, a very very long time ago....
It seems to me that if it is the Custom of the Services (do you still use that phrase?) to announce awards in the manner chippy63 states, and appears was correctly abided with by the CDS, then should not the TV company (whichever it was) be prevailed upon to do the same? The custom is appropriate and upon consideration entirely correct. I suspect that the editing was done in the same manner as my awareness, ie blissful ignorance. The more that the civil population understands about such military formalities the better it will understand the military. There is much sympathy with the military at the moment, especially in the sacrifice in blood that it makes on behalf of us all. There is though little understanding of its ways. Explain them to the TV peeps and they might well introduce such a piece by stating that; "Sir Jock Stirrup, Chief of the Defence Staff, first presented the citation to the widow of S/Sgt Schmid as posthumous awards take precedence over those to the living", and everyone will be a little wiser.
Ah, Bicester! It still survives in its unique prewar/wartime state and hopes are to keep it that way by the Bomber Command Heritage folks:
Our Journey Together - Bomber Command Heritage Website
It seems to me that if it is the Custom of the Services (do you still use that phrase?) to announce awards in the manner chippy63 states, and appears was correctly abided with by the CDS, then should not the TV company (whichever it was) be prevailed upon to do the same? The custom is appropriate and upon consideration entirely correct. I suspect that the editing was done in the same manner as my awareness, ie blissful ignorance. The more that the civil population understands about such military formalities the better it will understand the military. There is much sympathy with the military at the moment, especially in the sacrifice in blood that it makes on behalf of us all. There is though little understanding of its ways. Explain them to the TV peeps and they might well introduce such a piece by stating that; "Sir Jock Stirrup, Chief of the Defence Staff, first presented the citation to the widow of S/Sgt Schmid as posthumous awards take precedence over those to the living", and everyone will be a little wiser.
Ah, Bicester! It still survives in its unique prewar/wartime state and hopes are to keep it that way by the Bomber Command Heritage folks:
Our Journey Together - Bomber Command Heritage Website
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Chug, Stradling, Customs and Etiquettes of the Service. [memo to self- must get and read a copy] You are quite right, however I have nt heard mention of Stradling in nigh 50 years and I would opine that the medio spinners have not even heard of Stradling.
Customs of the services : being helpful hints and advice to those newly commissioned / by A. H. Stra... | National Library of Australia
and note the domicile of the website.
Customs of the services : being helpful hints and advice to those newly commissioned / by A. H. Stra... | National Library of Australia
and note the domicile of the website.
