MK3 Merlin accident
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MK3 Merlin accident
First time post.(long time lurker)
For your interest guys and gals
RAF officials to investigate helicopter landing in Holtville airstrip, official says - Imperial Valley Press Online - Local News
All survived, thank goodness!
For your interest guys and gals
RAF officials to investigate helicopter landing in Holtville airstrip, official says - Imperial Valley Press Online - Local News
All survived, thank goodness!
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Already been posted here
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ter-order.html
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircr...ter-order.html
They wanted them for spares for the Presidential 101
It only rolled over on landing yet 3 crew were injured - how does that male it crashworthy - unless you were being ironic and I missed it?
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read the signal ,it didn't just rollover on touchdown
as has been so simply stated, forget the newpaper report it's full of inaccuracies
We all know it is SOP for the RAF to have rear crewmen unseated on landings (but restrained) so a few injuries on an aircraft that ended up on its side can't come a surprise can it?
still it all looks like to be in 1 bit, no doubt we will see it in the air again
DM
We all know it is SOP for the RAF to have rear crewmen unseated on landings (but restrained) so a few injuries on an aircraft that ended up on its side can't come a surprise can it?
still it all looks like to be in 1 bit, no doubt we will see it in the air again
DM
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One day the crabs will learn that their Crewmen need to be sat down in a seat and strapped in before landings..... If there was ever a real airworthiness issue its the way the crabs insist that their Crewmen hang out of the door whilst the aircraft is landing.
Some body is going to retaliate and insist that its important that someone is making sure that the tail is clear of obstructions..... (In the Californian desert)
Some body is going to retaliate and insist that its important that someone is making sure that the tail is clear of obstructions..... (In the Californian desert)
No he will be advising the pilot of where the dust cloud is and be ready to give height information should the pilot lose references - tricky to do from being strapped inside the cabin.
If voice marshalling is not required they will be strapped in.
If voice marshalling is not required they will be strapped in.
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One day the crabs will learn that their Crewmen need to be sat down in a seat and strapped in before landings..... If there was ever a real airworthiness issue its the way the crabs insist that their Crewmen hang out of the door whilst the aircraft is landing.
Some body is going to retaliate and insist that its important that someone is making sure that the tail is clear of obstructions..... (In the Californian desert)
Some body is going to retaliate and insist that its important that someone is making sure that the tail is clear of obstructions..... (In the Californian desert)
As you quite correctly state, it is important that someone helps prevent an aircraft without any type of stinger from having a tail strike.
You don't need one you say??
Mmm
You get back to what you do best. Talking bollocks.
P.S Good effort. Two bites on two threads. I must try harder to resist.
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Originally Posted by [email protected]
No he will be advising the pilot of where the dust cloud is and be ready to give height information should the pilot lose references - tricky to do from being strapped inside the cabin.
If voice marshalling is not required they will be strapped in.
If voice marshalling is not required they will be strapped in.
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could it be similar?
At least a correctly harnessed aircrew wouldn't have ended up like that chap on the Utube video of the Puma crash on landing. Ouch! What do reckon on the MK3, too much flare leading to a tail blade strike?? (just like that Puma). I would imagine it would be easy to do at night in the dust etc.
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Stop and think
Chaps if you don't know the details of what happened then you obviously can't be current or dare I say experienced enough (5000hrs of RAFG doesn't count) with the current SOPs and training requirements for OOA operations.
In a modern military (which is has an almost pathaolgical fear of the "where there is blame, there is a claim" culture) there is normally a very good reason for doing things a certain way. If you were experienced or current then I'm sure you would realise this, many things have changed in a big way in the last 2 or 3 years.
Dust landings require a crewman to be scanning the tail, dust cloud and for obstructions forward and below the aircraft. The dust landing SOP doesn't (and shouldn't) change for flat, sloping or rough ground. It is one size fits all, this helps to prevent cognitive failure when the chips are down. You need something that will be remembered when, your on a hillside in Afghan, taking rounds, dropping of an IRT, with very little power in hand, in a hot and high environment and the dust is like talcum powder.
The whole SOP is geared around a very logical work cycle that involves all the crew saying pre-determined phrases and in a pre-determined order. This has been proven again and again and again while operating in a dust environment. One of these calls is from the crewman to confirm that the aircraft is clear forward and down to land and the position of the dust cloud. Which I am sure you will agree is fairly important.
Even with a crewman doing this it can still be difficult, I have came close to an aircraft rolling over after a pot hole was missed, the wheel found it shortly beforehand and stopped VERY quickly. Conversly I have overshot from at 20+ dust approaches because of berms, pot holes, fences, polythene tunnels, domestic wires and numerous other obstructions. I'm not sure how many of those overshoots would have been an accident but I would bet a years wages i would have had at least 5 or 6 accidents.
The Merlin was conducting dust training for Ops so it has to actually prepare crews for the worst case scenario, sitting in a seat just isn't an option. As I said, If you don't know the details of the accident then you are not qualified or indeed have the authority to comment.
Train hard fight easy.
HG
In a modern military (which is has an almost pathaolgical fear of the "where there is blame, there is a claim" culture) there is normally a very good reason for doing things a certain way. If you were experienced or current then I'm sure you would realise this, many things have changed in a big way in the last 2 or 3 years.
Dust landings require a crewman to be scanning the tail, dust cloud and for obstructions forward and below the aircraft. The dust landing SOP doesn't (and shouldn't) change for flat, sloping or rough ground. It is one size fits all, this helps to prevent cognitive failure when the chips are down. You need something that will be remembered when, your on a hillside in Afghan, taking rounds, dropping of an IRT, with very little power in hand, in a hot and high environment and the dust is like talcum powder.
The whole SOP is geared around a very logical work cycle that involves all the crew saying pre-determined phrases and in a pre-determined order. This has been proven again and again and again while operating in a dust environment. One of these calls is from the crewman to confirm that the aircraft is clear forward and down to land and the position of the dust cloud. Which I am sure you will agree is fairly important.
Even with a crewman doing this it can still be difficult, I have came close to an aircraft rolling over after a pot hole was missed, the wheel found it shortly beforehand and stopped VERY quickly. Conversly I have overshot from at 20+ dust approaches because of berms, pot holes, fences, polythene tunnels, domestic wires and numerous other obstructions. I'm not sure how many of those overshoots would have been an accident but I would bet a years wages i would have had at least 5 or 6 accidents.
The Merlin was conducting dust training for Ops so it has to actually prepare crews for the worst case scenario, sitting in a seat just isn't an option. As I said, If you don't know the details of the accident then you are not qualified or indeed have the authority to comment.
Train hard fight easy.
HG