Pay as you Train
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Exiled in England
Age: 48
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It is tales like this that make me so glad I am out ( and I'm not refering to any type of closet here).
The standard of admin support etc has increased in its rate of descent since I binned the firm.
I am currently responsible for about 4 million in factory and machinery, when I want something I order it on my trade accounts, if not I use one of the company credit cards. I have a nominal budget to try and keep to and if I go over it so be it.
I am trusted not to abuse the system and use my integrity.......
Maybe the ****ty shiny arses don't think those at the coal face have personal integrity anymore. Must dash, I'm off to blow company money on shiny machines that go ping.
The standard of admin support etc has increased in its rate of descent since I binned the firm.
I am currently responsible for about 4 million in factory and machinery, when I want something I order it on my trade accounts, if not I use one of the company credit cards. I have a nominal budget to try and keep to and if I go over it so be it.
I am trusted not to abuse the system and use my integrity.......
Maybe the ****ty shiny arses don't think those at the coal face have personal integrity anymore. Must dash, I'm off to blow company money on shiny machines that go ping.
What's needed is an Admin Branch that actually serves it's purpose........
I wish the RN had an Admin branch...... Its DIY in this mob
Or is the 'DIY' bit more to do with the fact that your adminers wont 'put out' for WAFUs?
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Falmouth
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They are the Loggies.... they don't do admin. Squadrons don't have admin staff on their books...Big ones might but the majority don't. The Loggies who sort your pay out work in the UPO and there are about 10 of them at Culdrose (4000 people work at Culdrose). They generally deal with SJAR problems. When the Aircrew write the SJARs for their people the Loggies to the Admin for the SJARs.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: South Wales
Age: 63
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Just wondering what the course is about or for?
Who normally goes on it?
Is it essential or just useful??
If it was a really important course to go on I am sure the system would kick in to ensure that you did not have to pay up front!!
Who normally goes on it?
Is it essential or just useful??
If it was a really important course to go on I am sure the system would kick in to ensure that you did not have to pay up front!!
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
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Lets compare the procedures for funding:
4 years ago: Fill out a manual F300, and pass it to boss for signature. Send it down to Allowances for them to process, work out what you were entitled to (based on 80% of your Subsistence Allowance and 100% of your accommodation), input on a computer and then pass to account for batching and paying. The money would be in your bank 3-5 working days after Accounts processed the batch it was in. On return, fill in a F1771 and pass to Allowances who would manually work out what you are entitled to and input it on the computer, then put the net difference on another batch and pass to accounts for payment. Again the money would be in your account 3-5 days afterwards.
Present Day: Log onto JPA and request an advance. Computer says "How Much?". You type in a figure (can be 100% of your Subsistence Allowance) and it goes "Ok then", and the money appears in your account 3 days later. After returning, you again log on and put in a claim for what you spent, plus your incidentals. Computer quickly works out the difference and it is again in your account 3 days later.
Sorry OP, but its a no-brainer. One of the successes of JPA is the speed in which advances and claims are paid. No "staff sickness" or "gapped posts" to hold up claims. As a former allowances/accts supervisor, I know how prone to delays the old style advances system was - in particular recovering money from people who took an advance then cancelled the course!
4 years ago: Fill out a manual F300, and pass it to boss for signature. Send it down to Allowances for them to process, work out what you were entitled to (based on 80% of your Subsistence Allowance and 100% of your accommodation), input on a computer and then pass to account for batching and paying. The money would be in your bank 3-5 working days after Accounts processed the batch it was in. On return, fill in a F1771 and pass to Allowances who would manually work out what you are entitled to and input it on the computer, then put the net difference on another batch and pass to accounts for payment. Again the money would be in your account 3-5 days afterwards.
Present Day: Log onto JPA and request an advance. Computer says "How Much?". You type in a figure (can be 100% of your Subsistence Allowance) and it goes "Ok then", and the money appears in your account 3 days later. After returning, you again log on and put in a claim for what you spent, plus your incidentals. Computer quickly works out the difference and it is again in your account 3 days later.
Sorry OP, but its a no-brainer. One of the successes of JPA is the speed in which advances and claims are paid. No "staff sickness" or "gapped posts" to hold up claims. As a former allowances/accts supervisor, I know how prone to delays the old style advances system was - in particular recovering money from people who took an advance then cancelled the course!
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Falmouth
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Or an easier way would be for you to pay for the course yourself and then claim the money back through JPA. Like the man says, JPA is so quick nowadays that this is an easy solution.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: England
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But does JPA only permit you to claim an advance for Subsistence (100%)? If so, and you use that cash to pay for a course how are you supposed to claim for your subsistence and the course fees on your return. Or have I missed something? Would the amount you try and get back from JPA on your return be potentially around 200% of the original advance.
Computer says.....
Computer says.....
Thread Starter
SRENNAPS - that was the whole point behind my original post - it's a pre-OOA course needed for whoever fills the post in question.
The principle here is that the RAF wants to send people off on pre-deplyoment training, but the system is either unwilling or unable to provide the necessary administrative and financial support necessary for that training to be carried out. As I said in an earlier post, this is no different to TELIC 1 and guys being forced to buy their own kit and claim costs because the system was not capable of providing what was required. In this case, just substutute kit for training.
This isn't about some sort of jolly or time out of the office for a bit of personal development, it is an operational requirement and the system's attitude towards individuals. And that is what really grips - the system is broken to such an extent that individuals are now being expected to plug the gaps for operational training. The fact that our station budget manager is now looking into this and where funding comes from, because no one can work out just how costs for this would be reimbursed are indicative of the fact that the system is broken. All ops related training should automatically be funded and administered; individuals should not be running round, wasting time sorting funding lines when they should be honing operational skills.
Contrary to the original troll and some of the other more reasoned posts, it isn't about not wanting to do personal admin. In these JPA days, everyone accepts that they have to take responsibility for a degree of their own admin and personal / career development.
The principle here is that the RAF wants to send people off on pre-deplyoment training, but the system is either unwilling or unable to provide the necessary administrative and financial support necessary for that training to be carried out. As I said in an earlier post, this is no different to TELIC 1 and guys being forced to buy their own kit and claim costs because the system was not capable of providing what was required. In this case, just substutute kit for training.
This isn't about some sort of jolly or time out of the office for a bit of personal development, it is an operational requirement and the system's attitude towards individuals. And that is what really grips - the system is broken to such an extent that individuals are now being expected to plug the gaps for operational training. The fact that our station budget manager is now looking into this and where funding comes from, because no one can work out just how costs for this would be reimbursed are indicative of the fact that the system is broken. All ops related training should automatically be funded and administered; individuals should not be running round, wasting time sorting funding lines when they should be honing operational skills.
Contrary to the original troll and some of the other more reasoned posts, it isn't about not wanting to do personal admin. In these JPA days, everyone accepts that they have to take responsibility for a degree of their own admin and personal / career development.
Last edited by Melchett01; 24th Oct 2009 at 11:36. Reason: Make more sense after 1st coffee of the day
Join Date: Oct 2007
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I had 3 years in Accounts, and if someone came to us with this sort of scenario, we would give him/her the money for the course in return for a letter from the course HQ stating how much it was. That money would then be held in abeyance until the individual returned and gave us the receipt for said course. At no time did we ever insist people paid up front, although many did pay up front and just claim later, purely to save themselves the time spent visiting Accts Flt. I would imagine any friendly Accts Flt would still do this if required?
The hotel bill can be paid for by a GPC - either the individual's or his unit travel cell if he doesnt have one.
The Subsistence Allowance can be claimed on JPA.
There is no reson for anyone to be out of pocket doing any course.
The hotel bill can be paid for by a GPC - either the individual's or his unit travel cell if he doesnt have one.
The Subsistence Allowance can be claimed on JPA.
There is no reson for anyone to be out of pocket doing any course.
Where do I apply for a GPC? In all seriousness, I much prefer the idea of having a company credit card take the strain rather than my own, no matter whether or not it's going to get reimbursed.
If a JPA-permitted expense is paid for using a GPC (for example DS when away), how do you "authorise" it when you get home? Do you need to tap something out on JPA to say what you claimed?
If a JPA-permitted expense is paid for using a GPC (for example DS when away), how do you "authorise" it when you get home? Do you need to tap something out on JPA to say what you claimed?
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Speak with your Accts Flt regarding the eligibility. They are generally issued to personnel who go away quite a bit. Common users are pilots (diverting), Movers (always away) and EngO's (recovery parties). Sqn Adjts often have them too.
If you spend on it, you submit an expenditure log and a copy of your bills to Accts. They will verify that expenditure was all legitimate and within limits, and pay the bill.
If you spend on it, you submit an expenditure log and a copy of your bills to Accts. They will verify that expenditure was all legitimate and within limits, and pay the bill.
