Raf Atco ??
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Raf Atco ??
Hi guys
Is ATCO for NATS better than RAF ????
Guessing RAF is better!
Whats it like controlling for the RAF - and how easy is it to go from RAF to civil??
cheers
Is ATCO for NATS better than RAF ????
Guessing RAF is better!
Whats it like controlling for the RAF - and how easy is it to go from RAF to civil??
cheers
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1. Define 'better'?
2. Guess again!
3a. Excellent fun.
3b. RAF > Civil. On the whole the application process remains the same. Whilst on the course your experience may, and I do mean may, help you from time to time.
Feel free to pm.
Grabbers
2. Guess again!
3a. Excellent fun.
3b. RAF > Civil. On the whole the application process remains the same. Whilst on the course your experience may, and I do mean may, help you from time to time.
Feel free to pm.
Grabbers
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Is ATCO for NATS better than RAF ????
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Rather an interesting attack there Flt Lt Mac. Been on the unhappy juice? A new chap pops in and asks a simple and obviously naive set of questions that could be answered in a mature, gentlemanly manner. Instead you flame him. Well done for demonstrating the very worst of this forum.
Also, can you point us towards the facts supporting your 45%+ assertion?
RyanEdin, I seem to remember there have been a few threads about this before. Can I suggest you do a quick search?
Also, can you point us towards the facts supporting your 45%+ assertion?
RyanEdin, I seem to remember there have been a few threads about this before. Can I suggest you do a quick search?
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Flt Lt Mac
Join Date: Mar 2008
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I can't comment on the training, all I will say is that I have yet to encounter a bad-tempered, miserable, rude or unhelpful MIL ATCO and my PPL training meant I came into contact with a lot of MIL ATCOs and students. I cannot say the same for their civilian counterparts.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Buxton
Age: 2 Say no more.
I can't comment on the training, all I will say is that I have yet to encounter a bad-tempered, miserable, rude or unhelpful MIL ATCO and my PPL training meant I came into contact with a lot of MIL ATCOs and students. I cannot say the same for their civilian counterparts.
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Quote:
Don't you watch the news? RAF controllers are always talking aircraft into each other. The amount of incidents including RAF controllers is more than 45% higher than their civilian counterparts. What do you reckon? If you want to be a civilian controller then apply to NATS. Don't think that the RAF is an easy route because it isn't. What a ridiculous question.
In fact - I was looking at what its like life wise! - Somehow neither is easier nor harder I do know these things - having visited NATS Edinburgh I do no
I just wanted to know what lifes like!
thank for the input anyways
Don't you watch the news? RAF controllers are always talking aircraft into each other. The amount of incidents including RAF controllers is more than 45% higher than their civilian counterparts. What do you reckon? If you want to be a civilian controller then apply to NATS. Don't think that the RAF is an easy route because it isn't. What a ridiculous question.
In fact - I was looking at what its like life wise! - Somehow neither is easier nor harder I do know these things - having visited NATS Edinburgh I do no
I just wanted to know what lifes like!
thank for the input anyways
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RyanEdin
I am guessing you are in Edinburgh, so drop a line to the SATCO at RAF Leuchars and he can sort you out a visit. Likewise, get on the train to Prestwick and visit both the Civil and Mil en route controllers in the same building.
As for the life - expect to work pretty hard on the Joint Air Traffic Control Course and during your first tour trying to get endorsed. Expect to play hard as well. Assume that once you have some controlling tickets at your first unit you will be eligible for deployment and that those deployments will come around every couple of years for the rest of your time in.
You did not indicate whether you are looking for a commission or to join as a direct entrant sergeant. Different routes to Shawbury but the same professional training. You will have more responsibility as an officer but plenty will be expected of you as a senior non-commissioned officer as well and the old and bold will resent your instant access to their Mess. As an officer you will spend longer as a flight lieutenant than most other branches until promotion to squadron leader.
As for NATS - a cadet only earns about £10 000 pa in training but you will soon overtake your military counterparts. The training is longer and less forgiving and you still have little choice about where you end up working. You will get paid extra for the responsiblities that the RAF will just expect you to take - training team, examining officer, etc.
Lots of ex-RAF try to convert to civil controlling, not all get through the re-programming process as the two streams have differing methodologies based around the same rules. Those who do get through the training tend to do well and their fellow ATCOs will allow them to take on the extra jobs that they were used to doing in the RAF. A lot of civil ATCOs will just turn up and do their shifts and nothing else.
Sort out some more visits, do your homework and good luck.
I am guessing you are in Edinburgh, so drop a line to the SATCO at RAF Leuchars and he can sort you out a visit. Likewise, get on the train to Prestwick and visit both the Civil and Mil en route controllers in the same building.
As for the life - expect to work pretty hard on the Joint Air Traffic Control Course and during your first tour trying to get endorsed. Expect to play hard as well. Assume that once you have some controlling tickets at your first unit you will be eligible for deployment and that those deployments will come around every couple of years for the rest of your time in.
You did not indicate whether you are looking for a commission or to join as a direct entrant sergeant. Different routes to Shawbury but the same professional training. You will have more responsibility as an officer but plenty will be expected of you as a senior non-commissioned officer as well and the old and bold will resent your instant access to their Mess. As an officer you will spend longer as a flight lieutenant than most other branches until promotion to squadron leader.
As for NATS - a cadet only earns about £10 000 pa in training but you will soon overtake your military counterparts. The training is longer and less forgiving and you still have little choice about where you end up working. You will get paid extra for the responsiblities that the RAF will just expect you to take - training team, examining officer, etc.
Lots of ex-RAF try to convert to civil controlling, not all get through the re-programming process as the two streams have differing methodologies based around the same rules. Those who do get through the training tend to do well and their fellow ATCOs will allow them to take on the extra jobs that they were used to doing in the RAF. A lot of civil ATCOs will just turn up and do their shifts and nothing else.
Sort out some more visits, do your homework and good luck.
Last edited by orgASMic; 31st Jul 2009 at 08:50. Reason: spelling
Dunno where Flt Lt Mac gets his statistics from; I'd say it was pretty much level pegging, and in my experience RAF and civil ATCOs are on par with each other.
As regards rude and miserable controllers; well once again level par; civil one at an airfield in south east England who wouldn't wait for an airways clearance, so told the pilot to call London Control just as he was rotating, or military one at Colt in the mid 70s; I took some cadets to ATC on a pre-programmed visit; he said a few words like 'this is the runway, this is the RTF, any questions?' and when there were none, told us to get out!
As regards rude and miserable controllers; well once again level par; civil one at an airfield in south east England who wouldn't wait for an airways clearance, so told the pilot to call London Control just as he was rotating, or military one at Colt in the mid 70s; I took some cadets to ATC on a pre-programmed visit; he said a few words like 'this is the runway, this is the RTF, any questions?' and when there were none, told us to get out!
