Diving with open Airbrakes....
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,858
Likes: 18
From: SW England
I still prefer the Victor!! What a forward looking design that was!!
A 1955 Victor B1 in anti-flash white before they started sticking all the bits and bobs on still looks like something from the future.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 435
Likes: 0
From: Toulouse area, France
Vampire flaps ...
On the single-seat (i.e. REAL !!!) Vampires and Venoms I remember the stick moving noticeably forward as flap went down - visiting genii from the Central School of Driving Aereoplanes once told us 2TAF mud-moving squadron drivers that this was NOT a trim change, but due to changing airflow over the tailplane ... seemed like a trim change to us nevertheless ...
The above gentle people were also a bit smiffy about our landing techniques - stick back after mainwheel touchdown for max braking, then let the nose-wheel drop gently onto the runway ... If bored while all this was happening, use left hand to wind back the canopy and let some fresh air in. They said this had about as much effect as hanging a knotted handkerchief out, but I don't think anybody put that to the test.
After flaps down, the airbrakes could be used to try to soak up some speed on finals: I don't remember that they really had all that much effect either, but at least we tried ... Aaaah de Havilland !!!
About the mighty and beautiful Victor 1 - those barn doors were great on the approach, and at one stage there was an idea to use constant engine rpm, controlling speed with the airbrakes - but it was soon clear that traditional methods were OK (even to asking for "1/2%" rpm changes - remeber those tiny dials ??? )... Cocky or what ???
The above gentle people were also a bit smiffy about our landing techniques - stick back after mainwheel touchdown for max braking, then let the nose-wheel drop gently onto the runway ... If bored while all this was happening, use left hand to wind back the canopy and let some fresh air in. They said this had about as much effect as hanging a knotted handkerchief out, but I don't think anybody put that to the test.
After flaps down, the airbrakes could be used to try to soak up some speed on finals: I don't remember that they really had all that much effect either, but at least we tried ... Aaaah de Havilland !!!
About the mighty and beautiful Victor 1 - those barn doors were great on the approach, and at one stage there was an idea to use constant engine rpm, controlling speed with the airbrakes - but it was soon clear that traditional methods were OK (even to asking for "1/2%" rpm changes - remeber those tiny dials ??? )... Cocky or what ???
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 1,332
Likes: 0
From: due south
Jig Peter: Re the stick moving forward with flap selection, IIRC it used to move forward just enough to completely obscure the compass.
Just what was need on a GCA !
VictorPilot: Good airbrakes on a Vampire ? I suppose it depends on what you are comparing them with.
I thought they were pathetic after the Meteor.
Just what was need on a GCA !
VictorPilot: Good airbrakes on a Vampire ? I suppose it depends on what you are comparing them with.
I thought they were pathetic after the Meteor.
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,226
Likes: 2
From: down south
"Agree, the Aircrew Manual says 650/1.3 for the F3 and F6 and 650/1.2 for the Tub"
If I remember (and I flew the 3, 5, and 6), 650 kts was the IAS limit.
In terms of dynamic pressure, therefore, there was no IAS limit on the use of the brakes.
If I remember (and I flew the 3, 5, and 6), 650 kts was the IAS limit.
In terms of dynamic pressure, therefore, there was no IAS limit on the use of the brakes.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 435
Likes: 0
From: Toulouse area, France
Feeble airbrakes ?
Agreed that the Vamp's airbrakes weren't all that world-shattering, which the Meteor's certainly were before the Phantom Diver struck and their travel was limited, after which they were just "slowing down thingies", I think ...
But you are so right about "stick forward into the G4" - needed the seat high and a spot of peering about with head on one side, IIRC ... Didn't stop us from getting safely down in some claggy North German weather though ...
On reflection, I think our Vamps had the "spade grip" stick and DGs for heading, while the Venom had the stick grip and a G4B. But in both cases I don't remember problems seeing one's heading was doing on GCA finals with full flap, perhaps because our GCA controllers had such a reassuring patter ...
But you are so right about "stick forward into the G4" - needed the seat high and a spot of peering about with head on one side, IIRC ... Didn't stop us from getting safely down in some claggy North German weather though ...
On reflection, I think our Vamps had the "spade grip" stick and DGs for heading, while the Venom had the stick grip and a G4B. But in both cases I don't remember problems seeing one's heading was doing on GCA finals with full flap, perhaps because our GCA controllers had such a reassuring patter ...
Last edited by Jig Peter; 30th June 2009 at 17:15. Reason: Second thoughts
