First Name Basis or 'Sir'?
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First Name Basis or 'Sir'?
Especially in relation to helis, when the pilot is an officer, is it best for your crew to call you by first name or by 'Sir'? I have heard different organisations use different terms in the air.... pros/cons/comments??
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8 years on SH and usually first name terms in the cockpit, on the sqn and in the crewroom for Junior Officers. Sir is usually reserved for Sqn Ldr and above.
Worked with the AAC on many occassions they seem to be much more formal on the ground, cant comment on in the air.
Worked with the AAC on many occassions they seem to be much more formal on the ground, cant comment on in the air.
Last edited by Door Slider; 19th Jan 2009 at 21:33.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
The difference between skipper, captain and pilot is one of position.
In the air one most often talks to the position in the aircraft, ie pilot.
On the ground, in the bar, but where other non-crew members are present the terms are often skip or boss rather than Tom, Dick or Harry.
In the air one most often talks to the position in the aircraft, ie pilot.
On the ground, in the bar, but where other non-crew members are present the terms are often skip or boss rather than Tom, Dick or Harry.
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The term 'Sir' should never be used in an aircraft - it only serves to promote 'cross-cockpit gradient' which is the antithesis of CRM.
If you know the guys you're flying with, it's usually first name terms. If the situation demands more formality, or the Captain is a senior officer, then referral to each other by crew position is more appropriate.
If you know the guys you're flying with, it's usually first name terms. If the situation demands more formality, or the Captain is a senior officer, then referral to each other by crew position is more appropriate.
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Always taught on larger multi-crew aircraft that you use crew positions in the aircraft - good advice when 4 of you have the same Christian name on a crew as once happened to me (I was one of them). Also, do not be called Mark - especially on an aircraft with smoke floats!
Bottom line - during quiet periods, or when saying thank-you then Christian names can be OK. However, when the workload goes up then crew position should be the order of the day.
I only use Sir when the Staish is flying....
For thread drift... are there any other names that have/can cause confusion on a crew apart from Mark?
Bottom line - during quiet periods, or when saying thank-you then Christian names can be OK. However, when the workload goes up then crew position should be the order of the day.
I only use Sir when the Staish is flying....
For thread drift... are there any other names that have/can cause confusion on a crew apart from Mark?
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Legend has it that a certain RAF captain on take off in a Britannia looked across
at his miserable looking co-pilot whilst accelerating towards V1 and said
"Cheer up!
The rest is history.
at his miserable looking co-pilot whilst accelerating towards V1 and said
"Cheer up!
The rest is history.
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This reminds me of an incident on 230 Sqn at Odiham in the late 1970s.
Master Loadie to Sqn Ldr pilot 'Nigel, blah, blah, blah ....'
Sqn Ldr goes mental. 'Do not call me Nigel, address me as Sir!'
Master Loadie 'Don't be a c&*t Nigel'.
SORF QFI returns to crew room with particularly grumpy senior officer JP student in tow. Normally the student makes the tea, but on this occasion QFI decides to do the honours.
Unfortunately the milk has gone off overnight, so QFI turns to student and asks "Do you mind coffee, mate?".
Senior officer goes red in the face and splutters "Young man, that degree of informality is quite out of place in a military organisation!"
"OK, sorry Sir, the bloody milk has gone off, Sir. So would like Coffeemate instead....SIR!!" came the reply.
Unfortunately the milk has gone off overnight, so QFI turns to student and asks "Do you mind coffee, mate?".
Senior officer goes red in the face and splutters "Young man, that degree of informality is quite out of place in a military organisation!"
"OK, sorry Sir, the bloody milk has gone off, Sir. So would like Coffeemate instead....SIR!!" came the reply.
Whilst acting as Operations Room Officer in a cruiser taking part in a NATO exercise, some time during the middle watch (0001-0400 for the hard of understanding .....), I receive a rather sleepy message from the Admiral's sea cabin "Plot - Flag, request sitrep".
Mindful of training advice to keep transmissions short and to the point, and with no flannel, I hardly have time to say "Flag - Plot, stand by for sitrep" when the Ops Room door opens and the Flag Captain bursts in and succinctly tells me "I call the Admiral "Sir", you call the Admiral "Sir"! OK?"
turns on his heel and retreats to his sea cabin. Feeling somewhat chastened, I brighten up when one of the radar plotters says to me "Well, cheer up, Sir. At least we now know exactly why the Captain's called 'Dick.' "!
Well, he was completely ballocky buff .....
Jack
Mindful of training advice to keep transmissions short and to the point, and with no flannel, I hardly have time to say "Flag - Plot, stand by for sitrep" when the Ops Room door opens and the Flag Captain bursts in and succinctly tells me "I call the Admiral "Sir", you call the Admiral "Sir"! OK?"
turns on his heel and retreats to his sea cabin. Feeling somewhat chastened, I brighten up when one of the radar plotters says to me "Well, cheer up, Sir. At least we now know exactly why the Captain's called 'Dick.' "!
Well, he was completely ballocky buff .....
Jack
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Who calls whom what, brings to mind the story regarding
RSM Brittian, addressing a new intake of officer cadets at Sandhurst. ''Gentlemen, I will address you as sir and you will address me as sir. The difference is gentlemen, when you address me as sir you will bloody well mean it''!
RSM Brittian, addressing a new intake of officer cadets at Sandhurst. ''Gentlemen, I will address you as sir and you will address me as sir. The difference is gentlemen, when you address me as sir you will bloody well mean it''!
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In multi crew, always use crew position. It makes it automatic and natural when on check or trapper rides and removes any possible chance of confusion or error. On the ground, on duty, normal rules apply.
Off duty, depends on the unit. Some, all the officers and senior masters were on first name terms, the junior sncos (sgt nco air) always use sir. Boss always called sir or boss.
Senior nco ground crew also on first name terms off duty on det.
Works fine, everyone comfortable with it.
Off duty, depends on the unit. Some, all the officers and senior masters were on first name terms, the junior sncos (sgt nco air) always use sir. Boss always called sir or boss.
Senior nco ground crew also on first name terms off duty on det.
Works fine, everyone comfortable with it.