Hats on - advice needed
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I knew I had done wrong. I had slopped off the sqn early only to get a phone call in the mess 5 minutes later recalling me to see the Boss. I had only been on the sqn a few eeks and my first tour so I didn't know the boss.
I duly knocked timidly on his door. "Come in", he said. "What are you doing tomorrow?"
Phew, so it's in the future, well maybe.
"We fly out tomorrow, OK for a 6 month det?"
Single, unattached, you bet.
I duly knocked timidly on his door. "Come in", he said. "What are you doing tomorrow?"
Phew, so it's in the future, well maybe.
"We fly out tomorrow, OK for a 6 month det?"
Single, unattached, you bet.
My first 'hat on' bollocking was completely out of the blue and I didn't have a scoobie what it was all about!
(turned out that Sqn ar5e licker TTB had been inventing things to make everyone else look bad etc blah blah)
Backfired on him but experience not very pleasant.
Second and subsequent 'hat on' bollockings were all a case of mistaken identity.....
Turned out he was bollocking someone who he thought should have given a sh1t!
Took my own carpet in the end...........
As already said - just take it - if you, sorry 'she' can justify actions within military law and all that trust placed with you etc etc then what is there to worry about?
If can't justify actions then she deserves everything the boss throws at her........
(turned out that Sqn ar5e licker TTB had been inventing things to make everyone else look bad etc blah blah)
Backfired on him but experience not very pleasant.
Second and subsequent 'hat on' bollockings were all a case of mistaken identity.....
Turned out he was bollocking someone who he thought should have given a sh1t!
Took my own carpet in the end...........
As already said - just take it - if you, sorry 'she' can justify actions within military law and all that trust placed with you etc etc then what is there to worry about?
If can't justify actions then she deserves everything the boss throws at her........
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Had three mass bollockings that I can remember. The last was the best.
Everyone assembled in mess dining room at ISL - Jag mates, Buccs, Shack aircrew, the lot. Chairs, not hats, no coffee and another Scottish Gp Captain.
Seemed one of the Bucc navs, having flown through an oil rig HPZ compounded the felony by saying "What HPZ".
Said staish could see his stars flying out of the window and delivered his mass bollocking to all aircrew. Threatened us with forever never becoming a 4-ship lead.
Yeah, right on, we Shack crews just kept quiet, smirked, and enjoyed the show.
Everyone assembled in mess dining room at ISL - Jag mates, Buccs, Shack aircrew, the lot. Chairs, not hats, no coffee and another Scottish Gp Captain.
Seemed one of the Bucc navs, having flown through an oil rig HPZ compounded the felony by saying "What HPZ".
Said staish could see his stars flying out of the window and delivered his mass bollocking to all aircrew. Threatened us with forever never becoming a 4-ship lead.
Yeah, right on, we Shack crews just kept quiet, smirked, and enjoyed the show.
I was fortunate to have a great deal of experience of these - 3 at Gp Capt Level and 1 at AOC 11Gp.
AOC 11 Gp was marvellous - in his truly professional way he had memorised the entire transcript and stared me directly in the eye all the way through. I don't mind admitting that he scared the poo out of me. After marching out I stood outside his office and his MA gave me a cigarette, at which point the AOC walked out of said office and I thought I'd get it again for smoking in his domain. Alas, he merely grinned and said 'Well that's that over and done with - don't do it again or at least don't get caught next time!' - Marvellous!
AOC 11 Gp was marvellous - in his truly professional way he had memorised the entire transcript and stared me directly in the eye all the way through. I don't mind admitting that he scared the poo out of me. After marching out I stood outside his office and his MA gave me a cigarette, at which point the AOC walked out of said office and I thought I'd get it again for smoking in his domain. Alas, he merely grinned and said 'Well that's that over and done with - don't do it again or at least don't get caught next time!' - Marvellous!
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It might be the case that the senior in question is doing you - sorry, your friend - a huge favor by keeping it to an in house "hats on", rather than allowing whatever the issue is to go any further. The best boss I ever had used to do anything within his powers to stop anything discussed at a one-sided interview leaving his desk. That earned him a serious amount of respect. He could bollock with the best of them, but you always went to him knowing that he'd do what he could to make sure it didn't escalate.
My advice would be to take the bolly, chalk it up to experience and then be hope it ends there. As has been said before, better to give your boss a damned good listening-to than to give a scuffer a statement under caution.
Blunty
My advice would be to take the bolly, chalk it up to experience and then be hope it ends there. As has been said before, better to give your boss a damned good listening-to than to give a scuffer a statement under caution.
Blunty
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You've got to keep this in perspective - ultimately, the system is limited to what it can do these days. Look on the bright side, whoever is going to be administering the bollocking can't make you pregnant. *
(* edit: Whoops! Sorry, I forgot we were talking about a female friend that you are just very concerned about).
(* edit: Whoops! Sorry, I forgot we were talking about a female friend that you are just very concerned about).
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Mark, that has crossed my mind 
There was a case about 4 years back, a chopped Nav came up on pprune incandescent with the injustice of being chopped - no more dteail is necessary - except that he gave so much background detail, lik ehis former branch, where he was when he was chopped, why it was unjust etc.
I went to 55 sqn the following day and guys on the other training flight had pprune up on the notice board and were creasing themselves. it did the choppee no good at all and probably a well deserved HOI too.
In this case hugely amusing for the spectators.
West of 8 West and the 25-yr rule are there for a purpose.
There was a case about 4 years back, a chopped Nav came up on pprune incandescent with the injustice of being chopped - no more dteail is necessary - except that he gave so much background detail, lik ehis former branch, where he was when he was chopped, why it was unjust etc.
I went to 55 sqn the following day and guys on the other training flight had pprune up on the notice board and were creasing themselves. it did the choppee no good at all and probably a well deserved HOI too.
In this case hugely amusing for the spectators.
West of 8 West and the 25-yr rule are there for a purpose.
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Due to the nature and possible recriminations of this kind of action, they are not entered into lightly. If there has been any actual or perceived wrong-doing, after the event the subject will have a fora to put their point across.
It is a damning insight that rather than self examine potential reasons for an interview someone with an interest (vested or not) has chosen a very public forum to bleat about whether it is illegal.
This is the military and line managers have an input when people screw up or need gentle rehabilitation. And no its not illegal. Take it, acknowledge any criticism and don't use public forums to wash dirty linen.
FFS what next - taking a human rights lawyer into OJAR debrief?
It is a damning insight that rather than self examine potential reasons for an interview someone with an interest (vested or not) has chosen a very public forum to bleat about whether it is illegal.
This is the military and line managers have an input when people screw up or need gentle rehabilitation. And no its not illegal. Take it, acknowledge any criticism and don't use public forums to wash dirty linen.
FFS what next - taking a human rights lawyer into OJAR debrief?
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Ahh AIDU you really are a gas... methane I think its called, but hey ho!
Anyway, to be reasonable about it, I really should point out (repeatedly I know - I doth protest too much) that it really really isn't me! At no point have I said its unfair (cos I don't know - it might be completely fair!), I'm not whining about it (its not my problem, in the end it doesn't affect me and I don't really care that much), and whilst I never take PPRuNe as gospel for anything (this isn't the real world after all), and whist trolls like AIDU have seriously compromised the quality, value, and atmosphere of this place, there is still a lot of good people and good advice around. So thanks! and where is that ignore button...
Chris Griffin, I'm asking questions because I don't know the answers myself - I'm not bleating, I've not got any axe to grind, I've not mentioned names, stations, locations, bra sizes or any other details that could be construed as trying to influence anything or anyone. I thank you for your comment though. At the end of the day, nothing can or will change what will happen - I'm just trying to give a little friendly advice, and better my own understanding.
Anyway, to be reasonable about it, I really should point out (repeatedly I know - I doth protest too much) that it really really isn't me!
At no point have I said its unfair (cos I don't know - it might be completely fair!), I'm not whining about it (its not my problem, in the end it doesn't affect me and I don't really care that much), and whilst I never take PPRuNe as gospel for anything (this isn't the real world after all), and whist trolls like AIDU have seriously compromised the quality, value, and atmosphere of this place, there is still a lot of good people and good advice around. So thanks! and where is that ignore button...Chris Griffin, I'm asking questions because I don't know the answers myself - I'm not bleating, I've not got any axe to grind, I've not mentioned names, stations, locations, bra sizes or any other details that could be construed as trying to influence anything or anyone. I thank you for your comment though. At the end of the day, nothing can or will change what will happen - I'm just trying to give a little friendly advice, and better my own understanding.
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Postie be very, very careful about being too closely identified with your "friend" particularly as it would appear that said friend is of the female persuasion.
They can lead you down all sorts of unwitting pathways that can bounce back on you.
Well I remember the blonde with a flirtatious manner who was constantly in my office asking for advice on how I would do this or that or the other; how would I write this letter, phrase that brief etc etc etc. It seemed that nearly half of my work was spent in sorting her professional problems out.
Come 1369 time (yep that dates me) the blonde came out of the interview with OCA (whom she'd also exercised her feminine wiles with) with 8s and 9s and a spec rec. I was told that I was high average with a rec but if I only had the professional aptitude like Flt Lt X then I would have done a lot lot better!!
I learnt about scheming (and ambitious) women from that.
They can lead you down all sorts of unwitting pathways that can bounce back on you.
Well I remember the blonde with a flirtatious manner who was constantly in my office asking for advice on how I would do this or that or the other; how would I write this letter, phrase that brief etc etc etc. It seemed that nearly half of my work was spent in sorting her professional problems out.
Come 1369 time (yep that dates me) the blonde came out of the interview with OCA (whom she'd also exercised her feminine wiles with) with 8s and 9s and a spec rec. I was told that I was high average with a rec but if I only had the professional aptitude like Flt Lt X then I would have done a lot lot better!!
I learnt about scheming (and ambitious) women from that.
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People do get found out on PPrune, and if trying to subvert – lose their right to leniency – so I hear???
If the lady is a cadet surely a Sqn Comd would know how it works. If she is now regular, the rules are slightly more grown up?
PS I think the pregnancy comment holds if the Boss is female - so long now I can't be sure??
If the lady is a cadet surely a Sqn Comd would know how it works. If she is now regular, the rules are slightly more grown up?
PS I think the pregnancy comment holds if the Boss is female - so long now I can't be sure??
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
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at least you'd know where you stood with the RAF Police, and you are given legal rights.
Scared me silly because it seemed like some major event had occurred, (Maggie assasinated or something...). Eventually, (because the convoy was leaving back to the UK in an hour), they threw me out and told me they'd be sending SIB to camp in the UK.
Two weeks later I find out from my boss that I had been accused of nicking a tenner from the wallet of a lad in the same tent as me when I got in the night before. Turns out that the lad accused me to deflect suspicion from him being a thief because he had nicked another lad's jeans because he forgot to bring any with him. Wnaker...
... and if I saw those two now - I have some choice words for the pr1cks...
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FWIW, I've been ambushed twice, both were highly bewildering, but in different ways:
1. I get sent to see Sergeant Major. He's incandescent. Calls in another WO, they start playing "Nice WO" and "Bad WO" on me. It turns out somebody with my name had been fined by a court in the West Country somewhere. I'm in Catterick. Amazingly enough, he gives the address of the Garrison Commander! So bailliffs turn up to said Brig's house, and try and seize goods to the value of. Brig calls RMP, who look in their files and presto, LCpl Roadster is on strength at 8 Sig Regt in Vimy Bks. The only thing that saved me from being thrown under the bus was Nice WO calls the court, and finds out I should be 45 next birthday, when I was plainly in my 20s. Not at all pleasant, but I can see why I didn't get a brief on the way in (other than troop staff pi$$ing themselves laughing).
2. I've broken my leg, and I'm on sick leave in my MQ in Germany. One fine day, doorbell rings, and it's my Tp Sgt with Sqn Comd in tow. "OMFG" thinks I, "what have I done?" . Five minutes later, shiny new Cpl Roadster is seeing them out the door. Again, I can see why no brief beforehand.
Good luck to your friend, it might a) be good or b) she may be innocent.
1. I get sent to see Sergeant Major. He's incandescent. Calls in another WO, they start playing "Nice WO" and "Bad WO" on me. It turns out somebody with my name had been fined by a court in the West Country somewhere. I'm in Catterick. Amazingly enough, he gives the address of the Garrison Commander! So bailliffs turn up to said Brig's house, and try and seize goods to the value of. Brig calls RMP, who look in their files and presto, LCpl Roadster is on strength at 8 Sig Regt in Vimy Bks. The only thing that saved me from being thrown under the bus was Nice WO calls the court, and finds out I should be 45 next birthday, when I was plainly in my 20s. Not at all pleasant, but I can see why I didn't get a brief on the way in (other than troop staff pi$$ing themselves laughing).
2. I've broken my leg, and I'm on sick leave in my MQ in Germany. One fine day, doorbell rings, and it's my Tp Sgt with Sqn Comd in tow. "OMFG" thinks I, "what have I done?" . Five minutes later, shiny new Cpl Roadster is seeing them out the door. Again, I can see why no brief beforehand.
Good luck to your friend, it might a) be good or b) she may be innocent.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Roadster reminds me, as a very green fg off, 3 month det, 7000 mile flight in 3 days, arrive by air at new station and wheeled straight in to a BOI still in grow bag.
Interrogated by this wg cdr, never saw him before, never saw him since, told I could go and that was that. F******g scary. B*stards.
Three years later I gave a heads up to the sqn ldr that had given me no warning. That was even better. When the Feds arrived he had to pretend he knew nothing.
Better still, the tip off came from the Feds bossman, the PM.
Interrogated by this wg cdr, never saw him before, never saw him since, told I could go and that was that. F******g scary. B*stards.
Three years later I gave a heads up to the sqn ldr that had given me no warning. That was even better. When the Feds arrived he had to pretend he knew nothing.
Better still, the tip off came from the Feds bossman, the PM.
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Whenever I was getting a one way discussion I often found that starting to smile as he gets into the swing of it really seems to wind them up, I had one and the person handing it out was getting redder and redder the more I smiled, by the end of it you could have toasted bread with the heat radiating off his face at which point I was positively beaming from ear to ear...... I walked out thinking he will have a heart attack if he carries on like that........ he didn't dissapoint and a few months later did.
RAF Police are a joke, got arrested for being drunk on last night in Germany....... plods driving me back telling me now your in the poo, to which I replied, " maybe so, but I have saved the cost of a taxi back"
Was at the time seeing a married German lass and was interviewed by some herbert in the morning from the SIB In a really badly fitting suit, It went something like this........
Got the old "tell us who she is"..... " nope"...... "we will find out who she is"......... "good luck, there are millions of them, I wish you well interviewing them all"....... "did you discuss work with her?"......... " why would I want to bore her to death?"........... " so you find work boring?"........... "no, but I find talking to women about work boring, we have better things to do"............... "You know your career in the RAF is finished"........ "yawn"
Posted back to UK, 3 weeks later asked to sign on lol, course and promotion follows at same time.......... Muppets
RAF Police are a joke, got arrested for being drunk on last night in Germany....... plods driving me back telling me now your in the poo, to which I replied, " maybe so, but I have saved the cost of a taxi back"
Was at the time seeing a married German lass and was interviewed by some herbert in the morning from the SIB In a really badly fitting suit, It went something like this........
Got the old "tell us who she is"..... " nope"...... "we will find out who she is"......... "good luck, there are millions of them, I wish you well interviewing them all"....... "did you discuss work with her?"......... " why would I want to bore her to death?"........... " so you find work boring?"........... "no, but I find talking to women about work boring, we have better things to do
"............... "You know your career in the RAF is finished"........ "yawn"Posted back to UK, 3 weeks later asked to sign on lol, course and promotion follows at same time.......... Muppets
Last edited by NutLoose; 23rd Oct 2008 at 17:24.
