We can do FI, Afghanistan and Iraq - 11sqn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Devon, England
Posts: 816
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We can do FI, Afghanistan and Iraq - 11sqn
Typhoon declared combat ready by 1st July 08 due to success in the USA.
99.3% success/serviceability rating in Green Flag.
http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/De...Capability.htm
99.3% success/serviceability rating in Green Flag.
http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/De...Capability.htm
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Ivory Tower
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You What ?
Wing Commander Gavin Parker, Officer Commanding XI Squadron, said that during pre-exercise training at Davis Monthan Air Force Base, Arizona, his squadron worked (Riddiculous Hours for little reward or praise in order to further himself) closely with 17 (Reserve) Squadron, the Typhoon Operational Evaluation Unit, also based at RAF Coningsby, and over a two-week period dropped a total of 67 munitions, comprising 43 Paveway II bombs, eight enhanced Paveway IIIs and 16 1,000 lb (454kg) free fall weapons. He said:
"It has been an outstanding success. The aircraft loved the hot and dry conditions. It achieved a 99.3 per cent strike rate at Davis Monthan, which means we achieved 99.3 per cent serviceability. We only lost two sorties, one due to high wind (which apparently can't be stopped by any Ginger no matter how much I stamped my feet) when no-one flew, and the other to a technical failure - again, unprecedented in my knowledge and experience (normally I will fly anything and have instructed my drones to do the same. Push Push Push...... I want to play Station Commander soon)."
Lets see how many PVR's are submitted when the chaps get back to work...........
Lets see how many PVR's are submitted when the chaps get back to work...........
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We're saved - hallelujah. The operational output of RAF FJ will be more than a GR4 in Qatar and the RN manning Harriers in the 'Stan....'.
You guys are amazing... and all at a cost (at best) of £125m each.
Eactly what we need to sit in the wheel and be talked on....
Or
Take on the immense air threa....
Er.... Well, at least there’s plenty of Chinooks, Merlin’s awesome and always ‘S’, there’s loads of AH spares and the replacement for Lynx is....
Oh well.....
Hurrah, 'the king is dead - long live the king'
You guys are amazing... and all at a cost (at best) of £125m each.
Eactly what we need to sit in the wheel and be talked on....
Or
Take on the immense air threa....
Er.... Well, at least there’s plenty of Chinooks, Merlin’s awesome and always ‘S’, there’s loads of AH spares and the replacement for Lynx is....
Oh well.....
Hurrah, 'the king is dead - long live the king'
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: GONE BY 2012
Age: 51
Posts: 151
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WOW! Must have been hell doing all those trials in the USA! Probably on expenses - thought we had weapon ranges in the UK!
At least we're sending them to the 'operational environment' of the Falklands - should get some awesome combat experience there.
And all for the cost of £125M per airframe!!!
Which roughly equates to:-
New DAS, avionics upgrade and new wings for 6 X C130Ks or
New DAS, software upgrades and enhancements for 8 x C130Js or
2 off the shelf CH47s or
2 Merlins or
8 Puma upgrades or
60 fully modified, combat proven Mi-17 utilty helicopters from a ex-Soviet republic.
Still - Typhoon will look good at the airshows and holding QRA in the FI. (Or maybe waiting for the next media-friendly Bear-F incursion)
nts
At least we're sending them to the 'operational environment' of the Falklands - should get some awesome combat experience there.
And all for the cost of £125M per airframe!!!
Which roughly equates to:-New DAS, avionics upgrade and new wings for 6 X C130Ks or
New DAS, software upgrades and enhancements for 8 x C130Js or
2 off the shelf CH47s or
2 Merlins or
8 Puma upgrades or
60 fully modified, combat proven Mi-17 utilty helicopters from a ex-Soviet republic.
Still - Typhoon will look good at the airshows and holding QRA in the FI. (Or maybe waiting for the next media-friendly Bear-F incursion)
nts
Maybe this is a WAH Truckie, but there aren't ranges in the UK we can deliver PGMs against realistic target sets in realistic release envelopes. Garvie is a huge island, and Aberporth is a barge in the sea - neither of which give realistic trg.
Regards
Regards
What a pathetic set of comments by some seriously sad people, particularly Pongochap. For heavens sake, systems need to be proved and if you can't do it at home, you have to go elsewhere.
I would lay money on the fact that the majority of the previous posters have never been deemed as capable of flying and operating a single seat fighter--I could well be wrong but I don't really care.
I would lay money on the fact that the majority of the previous posters have never been deemed as capable of flying and operating a single seat fighter--I could well be wrong but I don't really care.
Last edited by Audax; 9th Jun 2008 at 18:54.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Errr.... No, you're right, I'm in the Army (I don't think we have fast jets??? - I'll check). I'm not bad at circuits though....
Besides, I'd rather fly on operations than travel the world on exercise and wear flying suits at airshows.
You miss the point old bean. The frustrations are not with self-justification of the Typhoon display team per se. It's that priorities with procurement are so clearly misplaced.
No-one is suggesting the demise of the FJ world. But so much money for so little capability when the rest of us are stagging on and off non-stop op tours in less than capable helicopters that cost far more (but not £125 million) than the very capable Blackhawks you're in formation with - is more than a little frustrating.
Sorry, to be clear operations do not include Q/exercises in the States or saying you can go 'to the Falklands'.
Besides, I'd rather fly on operations than travel the world on exercise and wear flying suits at airshows.
You miss the point old bean. The frustrations are not with self-justification of the Typhoon display team per se. It's that priorities with procurement are so clearly misplaced.
No-one is suggesting the demise of the FJ world. But so much money for so little capability when the rest of us are stagging on and off non-stop op tours in less than capable helicopters that cost far more (but not £125 million) than the very capable Blackhawks you're in formation with - is more than a little frustrating.
Sorry, to be clear operations do not include Q/exercises in the States or saying you can go 'to the Falklands'.
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Uk
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"No-one is suggesting the demise of the FJ world. But so much money for so little capability when the rest of us are stagging on and off non-stop op tours in less than capable helicopters that cost far more (but not £125 million) than the very capable Blackhawks you're in formation with - is more than a little frustrating."
well as Land control the budget for SH i suggest you point the finger of blame closer to home!
well as Land control the budget for SH i suggest you point the finger of blame closer to home!
Audax, thank heavens there are some people with commonsense still posting on PPRuNe! So many comments from kids and wannabees these days.....
As a taxpayer, I'm delighted that the astonishingly expensive EuropHoon has achieved such results in such a short time. Hopefully it will soon be deployed to operational theatres in support of ground forces and will subsequently vapourise the odiferous mediaeval throwbacks of the Taleban with consummate ease.
Yes, the UK's transport aircraft and helicopters are getting utterly shagged out. But good to know that EuropHoon will soon be doing the business.
As a taxpayer, I'm delighted that the astonishingly expensive EuropHoon has achieved such results in such a short time. Hopefully it will soon be deployed to operational theatres in support of ground forces and will subsequently vapourise the odiferous mediaeval throwbacks of the Taleban with consummate ease.
Yes, the UK's transport aircraft and helicopters are getting utterly shagged out. But good to know that EuropHoon will soon be doing the business.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Temporarily missing from the Joe Louis Arena
Posts: 2,131
Received 27 Likes
on
16 Posts
It's that priorities with procurement are so clearly misplaced.
When was the contract signed for the procurement of the Typhoon?
Was it,
a) In 1998, a little bit before the current problems in the Middle East kicked in?
b) 1945, its the reason the Germans surrendered dontchaknow?
c) Jellyfish?
Its been repeated many, many times both here and Arrse that unfortunately (or fortunately depending on how you look at it) the terms of the initial contract for Typhoon were so watertight that to reduce our production total would cost us almost as much in penalties as to just take delivery of the aircraft.
What has also been said many times is that rather than cheap sniping at an aircraft that is a much needed replacement for the sadly departed Jaguar, the soon to depart Tornado F3 and no doubt a portion of the GR4 fleet, the shots should be aimed squarely at the government for putting the military into a situation where it is operating well above the limits of the defence assumptions made not that many years ago but without any real additional funding to carry these tasks out.
Of course you could just resort to default "bin the Typhoon and spend the money we won't have saved due to penalty clauses on knacker old Mil-8's" until the cows come home, which will keep the government happy as it diverts the attentions away from its poor funding of our armed forces towards a bit of good old cap badge bickering.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: St Annes
Age: 68
Posts: 638
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Not having a pop here, but one thing about the news release did make me chuckle a wee bit -
- I couldn't help but find this definition of 'rush' a teensy bit amusing.
Dave
But whether we rush out to Theatre in two years, three years or five years, well that is for others to decide. We offer choice."
Dave
Red On, Green On
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Between the woods and the water
Age: 24
Posts: 6,487
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
But whether we rush out to Theatre in two years, three years or five years, well that is for others to decide. We offer choice."
ck me - I can remember in Spring 1982 coming up off a Tube train to ground level and seeing chalkboards say "All members of the Royal Marines and Parachute Regt re-called from leave" That's what we call rush.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Kent
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well done chaps. Ignore the knockers. You have finally delivered an aircraft that is relevant to today's operations as well as tomorrow's. Expensive insurance premium perhaps, insufficient number of Naval aviators definately, but forget the snide cowardly personal attacks above.
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 142
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"When was the contract signed for the procurement of the Typhoon?
Was it,
a) In 1998, a little bit before the current problems in the Middle East kicked in?
b) 1945, its the reason the Germans surrendered dontchaknow?
c) Jellyfish?"
Much as it pains me to agree with a storeman, THS's point is valid. However, can we use the same excuse for JSF? With overstretch being so severe, surely we must focus our procurement on the assets we NEED to meet our commitments (AT, SH, ISTAR etc) rather than the status symbols we WANT.
N Joe
Was it,
a) In 1998, a little bit before the current problems in the Middle East kicked in?
b) 1945, its the reason the Germans surrendered dontchaknow?
c) Jellyfish?"
Much as it pains me to agree with a storeman, THS's point is valid. However, can we use the same excuse for JSF? With overstretch being so severe, surely we must focus our procurement on the assets we NEED to meet our commitments (AT, SH, ISTAR etc) rather than the status symbols we WANT.
N Joe
£125 m?
Utter, utter, total and utter Bollocks from the usual coalition of the witless.
Tranche 1 jets flyaway price was £45 m. Tranche 2 was £42.4 m.
Even programme cost (including all of the R&D, sims, support contracts et al) is just over £19 Bn, which, divided by the 232 we're contracted to buy is a shade over £80 m per jet.
To get to a unit programme cost of £125 we'd have to slash the purchase to 152 jets (cancel Tranche 3 but still pay for it) or experience inflation that would make Michael Foot or Dennis Healey blush.
Utter, utter, total and utter Bollocks from the usual coalition of the witless.
Tranche 1 jets flyaway price was £45 m. Tranche 2 was £42.4 m.
Even programme cost (including all of the R&D, sims, support contracts et al) is just over £19 Bn, which, divided by the 232 we're contracted to buy is a shade over £80 m per jet.
To get to a unit programme cost of £125 we'd have to slash the purchase to 152 jets (cancel Tranche 3 but still pay for it) or experience inflation that would make Michael Foot or Dennis Healey blush.
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Jackonicko you tit... So I'm from the
Ok, well, if you really want to know...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/03/30/eurofighter_now_with_bombs/
That's at best of course. I'm sure that isn’t true though.
Given that we yesterday passed 100 dead in Afghanistan your appalling FJ self grandiose is, as ever, tedious.
I will therefore resort to emergency banter.
This is isn't just your 'flying club' gentlemen....
coalition of the witless.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/03/30/eurofighter_now_with_bombs/
If all 232 are delivered, the cost to the taxpayer per Typhoon in RAF service would be an eye-watering £140m. Understandably, there is speculation that the partner nations may decide to cancel the third tranche of orders. That would result in the UK getting 144 jets and save perhaps £2bn from the total British bill, leaving individual Typhoons price-tagged at £125m each
That's at best of course. I'm sure that isn’t true though.
Given that we yesterday passed 100 dead in Afghanistan your appalling FJ self grandiose is, as ever, tedious.
I will therefore resort to emergency banter.
This is isn't just your 'flying club' gentlemen....
Last edited by Pongochap; 9th Jun 2008 at 23:24.
Pongochap, with the greatest respect, that was written by Lewis Page.
Page was right. It isn't true. Page's understanding of air power generally, let alone individual aircraft procurement programmes, ranks alongside Harold Shipman's understanding of the correct protocols in geriatric care... His basic premise that there is something wrong with procurement is fair enough, but his analysis is often based on ground somewhat shakier than the San Andreas Fault.
Although the figures are open to interpretation and debate, the highest figure given by a credible source is £62m per aircraft (this was the NAO) although this figure was arrived at by a different accounting method to the one they'd used before (and since?) which gives figures more akin to Jacko's.
Anyway, to my original point - I believe that Stu Atha's comments may be missing an 'or' between 'Rush out to theatre' and 'in two years'
Page was right. It isn't true. Page's understanding of air power generally, let alone individual aircraft procurement programmes, ranks alongside Harold Shipman's understanding of the correct protocols in geriatric care... His basic premise that there is something wrong with procurement is fair enough, but his analysis is often based on ground somewhat shakier than the San Andreas Fault.
Although the figures are open to interpretation and debate, the highest figure given by a credible source is £62m per aircraft (this was the NAO) although this figure was arrived at by a different accounting method to the one they'd used before (and since?) which gives figures more akin to Jacko's.
Anyway, to my original point - I believe that Stu Atha's comments may be missing an 'or' between 'Rush out to theatre' and 'in two years'
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 33,056
Received 2,931 Likes
on
1,250 Posts
Deliverance
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 354
Truckie, have you stopped taking those meds? And 2 Chinooks for 125 mil, not when we buy them!
Last edited by Deliverance : Yesterday at 19:31.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 354
Truckie, have you stopped taking those meds? And 2 Chinooks for 125 mil, not when we buy them!
Last edited by Deliverance : Yesterday at 19:31.
