A Dams raid question...
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A Dams raid question...
Just a quickie,
A nephew is writing an essay for his school on the night of the 16/17 may '43 and the famous Dams raid...
Does anyone know where I can locate for him, on the web, the approximate timings for the raids and the unfortunate losses of the aircraft and crew? I have tried googleing but can't seem to find anything at all...
If anyone can assist, it might just save me from a trip to the Lawrence room....
Thanks, Champers....
A nephew is writing an essay for his school on the night of the 16/17 may '43 and the famous Dams raid...
Does anyone know where I can locate for him, on the web, the approximate timings for the raids and the unfortunate losses of the aircraft and crew? I have tried googleing but can't seem to find anything at all...
If anyone can assist, it might just save me from a trip to the Lawrence room....
Thanks, Champers....
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Red On, Green On
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http://www.dambusters.org.uk/
Fascinating read about Mr Gibson. I didn't know that he flew on the wing of a lot of the guys as they approached the dams to draw fire.
Fascinating read about Mr Gibson. I didn't know that he flew on the wing of a lot of the guys as they approached the dams to draw fire.
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slightly beyond the scope of the essay, could I heartily recommend Guy Gibson's book "Enemy Coast Ahead"? A cracking read from many points of view - not least to see how little the attitude of RAF aircrew has changed...
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Dams Raid
Champers,
I guess if you are in the far north west it may be a bit superfluous but there is some good stuff at the Brooklands Museum, esp Barnes Wallis (if not on the internet then an old fashioned letter may yeild results, they are v helpful).
Also try a google earth sat pic of the dams now, when I flew over them you could still see the patches.
rgds
SMK
I guess if you are in the far north west it may be a bit superfluous but there is some good stuff at the Brooklands Museum, esp Barnes Wallis (if not on the internet then an old fashioned letter may yeild results, they are v helpful).
Also try a google earth sat pic of the dams now, when I flew over them you could still see the patches.
rgds
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Also try a google earth sat pic of the dams now, when I flew over them you could still see the patches
The damage to the wall of the Eder Dam is clearly evident, even in 2005 when I took this picture - they're still working on it too!! Note the lack of sluices/arches about 1/3rd of the way down the dam wall towards the lefthand side, and the different coloured bricks (red) used in the upper arches in the same area. Note the castle in the background - Schloss Waldeck, which was used on the run-in to the target.
Great picture, TT!
I remember that castle well! On the 40th anniversary I was flying HM's mighty Phantom (not very well) and, for once, happened to be in the right place at the right time!
So we flew past the castle, down to 250 ft, across the dam, then climbed out. Seemed like fun, so did it again. Then another jet joined us, so we did a pairs flypast... I recall that there were people waving (I think
) from the castle. Then home for tea at Gutersloh.
Mentioned it to the SNAVO when we were chatting later and he went white. He dug out something called 'Manuel de vol a basse altitude' (not something we air defenders had bothered with before) and pointed out that we weren't supposed to use the dams as a turning point or overfly them at low level.
"Good job we didn't tell him about saying hello to the Moehne Dam on the way home, then!" I remarked to my nav after he'd gone.
But no-one ever complained!
I remember that castle well! On the 40th anniversary I was flying HM's mighty Phantom (not very well) and, for once, happened to be in the right place at the right time!
So we flew past the castle, down to 250 ft, across the dam, then climbed out. Seemed like fun, so did it again. Then another jet joined us, so we did a pairs flypast... I recall that there were people waving (I think
) from the castle. Then home for tea at Gutersloh.Mentioned it to the SNAVO when we were chatting later and he went white. He dug out something called 'Manuel de vol a basse altitude' (not something we air defenders had bothered with before) and pointed out that we weren't supposed to use the dams as a turning point or overfly them at low level.
"Good job we didn't tell him about saying hello to the Moehne Dam on the way home, then!" I remarked to my nav after he'd gone.
But no-one ever complained!
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This gives dates, times, crews and reports. You should find everything you need in this one place.
http://www.dambusters.org.uk/docs/recordbook.pdf
http://www.dambusters.org.uk/docs/recordbook.pdf
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Moehne Dam
I've got a couple of pictures of the Moehne Dam that also show where the breach occurred, I'll post them later tonight.
The thing that struck me in comparing the Moehne and Eder attacks is that - defensive aspects aside - the Eder was the more difficult to hit, given the topography surrounding it, which, amongst other things, meant that the breach occurred off-centre as shown in my photo above.
Standing on the wall of the Eder for the first time on 17 May 1993, I could only wonder how a successful attack was achieved exactly 50 years ago to the day (night,) at 60 feet, in the dark, and with basic (by today's standards) navigation equipment.
The thing that struck me in comparing the Moehne and Eder attacks is that - defensive aspects aside - the Eder was the more difficult to hit, given the topography surrounding it, which, amongst other things, meant that the breach occurred off-centre as shown in my photo above.
Standing on the wall of the Eder for the first time on 17 May 1993, I could only wonder how a successful attack was achieved exactly 50 years ago to the day (night,) at 60 feet, in the dark, and with basic (by today's standards) navigation equipment.
good chip shop at the northern end of the Mohne as I remember. Went for a quick blat up on a Sunday afternoon on my mates K150 along with bazillions of other motorads.Thread Starter
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All I can say is thank you all very much!
I passed on the link to this page and I now keep receiving texts, not in yoof speak I must add, from Sam my nephew, saying how brilliant the people on Pprune are to help him with his project.
Once again a big thank you, there is so much more information here than I could ever have hoped for. You have helped to a young lad very very happy!!
I passed on the link to this page and I now keep receiving texts, not in yoof speak I must add, from Sam my nephew, saying how brilliant the people on Pprune are to help him with his project.
Once again a big thank you, there is so much more information here than I could ever have hoped for. You have helped to a young lad very very happy!!
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Elvington [Yorkshire Aviation Museum] Has a dedicated building to the Dams Raid.[Including the "Alternative" Bombsights...which are "Hands On"]
watp,iktch
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Moehne Dam
As promised earlier:
The area where the breach occurred is clearly visible between the towers (the lighter grey area.) At least one of the towers had a defensive gun on top of it.
View from below - perhaps the duck offers some scale to the image!
Ennepe Dam, one of the secondary targets for the raid.
Finally:
Sorpe Dam graphic, perhaps showing why it was more difficult to breach than the other 2 primary targets, being of a different construction type. Mention is made of the Dams raid in the 4th paragraph:
The area where the breach occurred is clearly visible between the towers (the lighter grey area.) At least one of the towers had a defensive gun on top of it.
View from below - perhaps the duck offers some scale to the image!
Ennepe Dam, one of the secondary targets for the raid.
Finally:
Sorpe Dam graphic, perhaps showing why it was more difficult to breach than the other 2 primary targets, being of a different construction type. Mention is made of the Dams raid in the 4th paragraph:
During the Second World War the Dam was significantly damaged by air strikes, and was prone to leaks. These leaks have since been eliminated through several extensive restructuring measures
Last edited by Trumpet_trousers; 21st May 2008 at 12:19.
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A Friend of mine is the Nephew of David Maltby, Dambuster.
His brother has just published a book detailing the Raid from David's perspective and is a very good read. It also tries to evaluate what is fact and what is RAF PR.
Please see this webiste for details:
http://www.breakingthedams.com/
His brother has just published a book detailing the Raid from David's perspective and is a very good read. It also tries to evaluate what is fact and what is RAF PR.
Please see this webiste for details:
http://www.breakingthedams.com/