Peterborough Down the Memory Hole?
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Ever heard of NMS? 
My banter might be lame (situation no change there then), but things have gone downhill - no wonder we cover up when we get shouted at nowadays. But aside from the subjective, do you have any objective examples of stackers leading or actually closing with and engaging with the enemy, such as those 'management twaddle' types you mentioned? As I recall, supply sqns were the most introspective, bull**** driven, paper shuffling, jealously guarded empires on any station that I served at.
By comparison, most flying types that I ever knew seemed refreshingly normal, humble, respectful and polite.
My banter might be lame (situation no change there then), but things have gone downhill - no wonder we cover up when we get shouted at nowadays. But aside from the subjective, do you have any objective examples of stackers leading or actually closing with and engaging with the enemy, such as those 'management twaddle' types you mentioned? As I recall, supply sqns were the most introspective, bull**** driven, paper shuffling, jealously guarded empires on any station that I served at.
By comparison, most flying types that I ever knew seemed refreshingly normal, humble, respectful and polite.
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Your use of the phrase 'Supply Sqn' is quite indicative of how out-of-date your perceptions are! The vast majority of such organisations are now called Logistics Sqns, and are far more focussed nowadays on supplying rather than storing. In any event, as a taxpayer you should be glad that public assets are indeed jealously guarded, with rigorous processes in place and clear audit trails to ensure that fraud, theft, misappropriation and loss is minimised.
As to 'objective examples of stackers leading or actually closing with and engaging with the enemy', perhaps our friends from TSW or UKMAMS (not to mention the 'stackers' embedded within SF) would care to contribute.
And for as much as I'd like to, I'm not going to bite at your last comment!
As to 'objective examples of stackers leading or actually closing with and engaging with the enemy', perhaps our friends from TSW or UKMAMS (not to mention the 'stackers' embedded within SF) would care to contribute.
And for as much as I'd like to, I'm not going to bite at your last comment!
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noregrets - AI R has been outside the wire for quite some time now and has the favourite historical view of duvet technicians we expect from the nut-manglers of old. He probably doesn;t even know that most OC Eng Wg were re-branded OC Fwd.
Then again - if we're talking Engineer - haven't we contracted that out?
Then again - if we're talking Engineer - haven't we contracted that out?
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NoRegretters,
Sure, they were logs units even as far back as my day. I suppose though, that as long as the people within the system are better served as a result of renaming and as long as its not just some (perish the thought
) profile enhancing corporate rebranding exercise in self gratification for some middle manager, then I’m sure its all for the best. But overall, I do agree with you about the need for clarity and best civilian practice .. so with that in mind, I wonder how the old Collyweston Industrial Estate is these days? Any news on when the the new General Manager might be expected?
Hinecappers,
Duvets? DUVETS?? In my day, we called ‘em Continental Quilts. My, things HAVE improved. What a difference a name makes. But I don't need to tell a Logistic Procurement and Delivery Executive that!
(I hate to be the one to have to tell you this, but I’m not an ex engineer - merely a long past his sell by date, ex Rock. Anyway, now that we’ve cleared that up.. let’s carry on your point about the ingress of civilianisation within respective trade groups.)
Sure, they were logs units even as far back as my day. I suppose though, that as long as the people within the system are better served as a result of renaming and as long as its not just some (perish the thought
) profile enhancing corporate rebranding exercise in self gratification for some middle manager, then I’m sure its all for the best. But overall, I do agree with you about the need for clarity and best civilian practice .. so with that in mind, I wonder how the old Collyweston Industrial Estate is these days? Any news on when the the new General Manager might be expected?Hinecappers,
Duvets? DUVETS?? In my day, we called ‘em Continental Quilts. My, things HAVE improved. What a difference a name makes. But I don't need to tell a Logistic Procurement and Delivery Executive that!
(I hate to be the one to have to tell you this, but I’m not an ex engineer - merely a long past his sell by date, ex Rock. Anyway, now that we’ve cleared that up.. let’s carry on your point about the ingress of civilianisation within respective trade groups.)
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Noregrets
I must question you assertion that Logistic Sqns are more focussed on supplying than storing.
Supplying what? Spares for aircraft? I don't think so, ever since we went over to the "just in time" "only stocking items for immediate use" regime, aircraft are sat on the ground for days until the "logistics chain" can provide. At least in the old days when you were down to the last few on the shelf you ordered some more! Nowadays the system waits until there's none on the shelf and then orders, KEEPING AIRCRAFT ON THE GROUND. With the present op tempo the system only just has enough for ops and not the aircraft back in Blighty leading to crews getting the minimum and quite often less than the minimum flying training.
I must question you assertion that Logistic Sqns are more focussed on supplying than storing.
Supplying what? Spares for aircraft? I don't think so, ever since we went over to the "just in time" "only stocking items for immediate use" regime, aircraft are sat on the ground for days until the "logistics chain" can provide. At least in the old days when you were down to the last few on the shelf you ordered some more! Nowadays the system waits until there's none on the shelf and then orders, KEEPING AIRCRAFT ON THE GROUND. With the present op tempo the system only just has enough for ops and not the aircraft back in Blighty leading to crews getting the minimum and quite often less than the minimum flying training.
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wiwo,
You really need to get with the programme and redefine your understanding of the complex relationships and the various synergies at play here. The modern Air Force (gulp, I almost mentioned Support Command) has adapted, it has evolved.. IT HAS MOVED ON!
You really need to get with the programme and redefine your understanding of the complex relationships and the various synergies at play here. The modern Air Force (gulp, I almost mentioned Support Command) has adapted, it has evolved.. IT HAS MOVED ON!
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WIWO
The stackers are only trying to keep the pitiful quantity of spares turning around - those quantities specified by the Engineering Authorities and ratified by the IPTs - which are largely staffed by Engineers and not Logisticians.
AI R - my bad - need to ensure the Regiment are included in any shoe-wetting competition here. They have done so well from modern changes then - re-branding with the RAFP and calling it 'Force Protection', giving Rapier to the Arty and forming the basis of the Joint Service Sniff Test Regiment. I'd be sitting quietly in the corner with that sort of legacy serving me.
Back to uniform chat anyway - does everyone have all their badges on all their kit? EAW velcro bits for all?
The stackers are only trying to keep the pitiful quantity of spares turning around - those quantities specified by the Engineering Authorities and ratified by the IPTs - which are largely staffed by Engineers and not Logisticians.
AI R - my bad - need to ensure the Regiment are included in any shoe-wetting competition here. They have done so well from modern changes then - re-branding with the RAFP and calling it 'Force Protection', giving Rapier to the Arty and forming the basis of the Joint Service Sniff Test Regiment. I'd be sitting quietly in the corner with that sort of legacy serving me.
Back to uniform chat anyway - does everyone have all their badges on all their kit? EAW velcro bits for all?
Getting back to the subject of Peterborough, or rather, Peterboroughistan, a fellow PPRuNer sent me a series of photos showing the level of support from the local population shown towards the deceased CF personnel recently repatriated to CFB Trenton and thence to Toronto.
Here is one of the photos:
Here is one of the photos:
The caption reads "Between Trenton and Toronto, there are 50 bridges. All were occupied by police officers, ambulance personnel, firefighters and above all by ordinary people".
There is a city of Peterborough in Ontario, not all that far from Trenton. I somehow get the feeling that it would have shown a rather different attitude towards service personnel than its namesake in Cambridgeshire.
There is a city of Peterborough in Ontario, not all that far from Trenton. I somehow get the feeling that it would have shown a rather different attitude towards service personnel than its namesake in Cambridgeshire.
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Hinesters,
Rapier was reliquished because the RAF simply didn't have the need for it anymore.. you know, the type of thinking which applied when it decided to apply a similar level of military need across the Supply Branch before practically civilianising it, lock stock and barrel. It was you who was going on about rebranding, not me. The closest the scuffers ever came to joining forces with us was only temp talk thankfully, and pre SD814
. That I suppose, would be like TSW raising its game to join forces with the RLC?
With regards to legacy, I would imagine that the SRDG has done the RAF proud of late, most recently the last GBAD sqn has returned and only disbanded last week. Still, not to worry and I don't want to destract you with all this manly talk of Reggie stuff when I'm sure you have a pot plant and an upset victimised serviceman or two to attend to. So, to matters of greater import - are my boots in yet?
Rapier was reliquished because the RAF simply didn't have the need for it anymore.. you know, the type of thinking which applied when it decided to apply a similar level of military need across the Supply Branch before practically civilianising it, lock stock and barrel. It was you who was going on about rebranding, not me. The closest the scuffers ever came to joining forces with us was only temp talk thankfully, and pre SD814
. That I suppose, would be like TSW raising its game to join forces with the RLC?With regards to legacy, I would imagine that the SRDG has done the RAF proud of late, most recently the last GBAD sqn has returned and only disbanded last week. Still, not to worry and I don't want to destract you with all this manly talk of Reggie stuff when I'm sure you have a pot plant and an upset victimised serviceman or two to attend to. So, to matters of greater import - are my boots in yet?
Al R -
Good news - they've finally got a pair of boots in your size!
Bad news - you can't have them because someone might need them....
PS - Glad to note that the Rock humour we aircrew types used to experience during GDT....ODT....CCS....(insert latest TLA) is still alive and kicking!
Good news - they've finally got a pair of boots in your size!
Bad news - you can't have them because someone might need them....
PS - Glad to note that the Rock humour we aircrew types used to experience during GDT....ODT....CCS....(insert latest TLA) is still alive and kicking!
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Beagle, when you joined up you didn't need 1250s - you both knew each other, Hunter wasn't an aircraft, it was a trade and Hercules wasn't.. well, you get the drift.
A little before the young shaver Hinecap's time maybe, but remember FOFAD? "F#ck off, fire at Donnington". Nowadays it'd be; WYLTFOACSFWHAIAILYTAOATQSBTEAARBTIWALSBEANLACUAP - "Would you like to fill out a customer satisfaction form, we have an inability I'm afraid and I'd like you to accept our apologies. Those quantities specified by the Engineering Authorities and ratified by the IPTs - which are largely staffed by Engineers and not Logisticians, are causing us a problem.".
Still, its good to know that its the spanner boys throwing their spanner in the works this time, and not just some dodgy fuse box. You know what they say - where there's blame, there's an ACR cop out in there somewhere.
A little before the young shaver Hinecap's time maybe, but remember FOFAD? "F#ck off, fire at Donnington". Nowadays it'd be; WYLTFOACSFWHAIAILYTAOATQSBTEAARBTIWALSBEANLACUAP - "Would you like to fill out a customer satisfaction form, we have an inability I'm afraid and I'd like you to accept our apologies. Those quantities specified by the Engineering Authorities and ratified by the IPTs - which are largely staffed by Engineers and not Logisticians, are causing us a problem.".
Still, its good to know that its the spanner boys throwing their spanner in the works this time, and not just some dodgy fuse box. You know what they say - where there's blame, there's an ACR cop out in there somewhere.
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Let's get Peterborough into perspective shall we! To my knowledge, there has been one isolated display of hostility towards the R A F uniform, two passers by scared them off.
The rat faced CO of Wittering, came to Peterborough last week, to meet the Deputy Mayor. Upon leaving the Town Hall, she was photographed on the steps, in uniform.
Had I been there and had the pressence of mind, I might have hollered.....YOU THERE! Get that uniform off. BITCH!
The residents of Peterborough have a high regard for the R A F and always will have.
The rat faced CO of Wittering, came to Peterborough last week, to meet the Deputy Mayor. Upon leaving the Town Hall, she was photographed on the steps, in uniform.
Had I been there and had the pressence of mind, I might have hollered.....YOU THERE! Get that uniform off. BITCH!
The residents of Peterborough have a high regard for the R A F and always will have.
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I am reminded of Alec King, at the Depot.. aeons back. One summer's evening, in the gathering gloom, he caught sight of some wretch short cutting it across his beloved parade square. He stabbed his pace stick into the half light and bellowed 'AIRMAN!!', at which point the half cut airman turned, squinted and before he could stop himself, screamed back 'Station Warrant Officer!'.
This is interesting.. kind of.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7300626.stm
http://tothebest.army.mod.uk/Pages/default.aspx
I don't want to second guess any longer about the rights and wrongs of what the Wittering Creche manager decided that fateful day, when she re-roled the RAF as the Cambridgeshire Clandestine Corporation, but it seems the army at least, is actively fighting back. Almost 90% of the public wants to see uniforms on the streets again, and while I know that isn't where the ultimate decision lies, we should be reflecting that 'brand loyalty' back too. We owe it to those we defend, to be seen by them.
This is interesting.. kind of.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7300626.stm
http://tothebest.army.mod.uk/Pages/default.aspx
I don't want to second guess any longer about the rights and wrongs of what the Wittering Creche manager decided that fateful day, when she re-roled the RAF as the Cambridgeshire Clandestine Corporation, but it seems the army at least, is actively fighting back. Almost 90% of the public wants to see uniforms on the streets again, and while I know that isn't where the ultimate decision lies, we should be reflecting that 'brand loyalty' back too. We owe it to those we defend, to be seen by them.
Avitor, whilst you might harbour strong views, the rather offensive prose of your post would benefit from some editing, I feel.
Dancing with the devil, going with the flow... it's all a game to me.
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Gross over reaction from the CO to an isolated incident IMHO. As a result relations with the local community have been damaged due to the fact 99% fully support the local RAF station personel and their right to wear uniform in public so have been made to feel wrongly accused. It has been a very saddening experience for all concerned.
So then, what was her motive in going public?
VFE.
So then, what was her motive in going public?
VFE.
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BEagle - seconded.
Avitor - you're out of order. Personal insults like 'rat faced' and 'bitch' have no place here, regardless of what you might think about the situation. Recommend you delete your last posting asap before it's done for you.
Avitor - you're out of order. Personal insults like 'rat faced' and 'bitch' have no place here, regardless of what you might think about the situation. Recommend you delete your last posting asap before it's done for you.
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B Eagle.....
Avitor, whilst you might harbour strong views, the rather offensive prose of your post would benefit from some editing, I feel.
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I see! As the CO insisted the uniform ban stays, I am sorry, I cannot find it within me to moderate my post, unless I am requested to by the forum moderators. HTH.
Avitor, whilst you might harbour strong views, the rather offensive prose of your post would benefit from some editing, I feel.
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I see! As the CO insisted the uniform ban stays, I am sorry, I cannot find it within me to moderate my post, unless I am requested to by the forum moderators. HTH.
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noregrets
Avitor - you're out of order. Personal insults like 'rat faced' and 'bitch' have no place here, regardless of what you might think about the situation. Recommend you delete your last posting asap before it's done for you.
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I am a resident of Peterborough, would you consider the hurt I feel after the comments from the CO of Wittering?
Threre are two schools of thought here, the rallying round one and the face value one.
Avitor - you're out of order. Personal insults like 'rat faced' and 'bitch' have no place here, regardless of what you might think about the situation. Recommend you delete your last posting asap before it's done for you.
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I am a resident of Peterborough, would you consider the hurt I feel after the comments from the CO of Wittering?
Threre are two schools of thought here, the rallying round one and the face value one.
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vf,
She didn't go public with it - some airman did, by phoning the local radio station and complaining about being ordered to cover up. In the CO's defence, I can't imagine for one moment she would have thought the reaction would have been quite this strong. I can imagine that one nurse being victimised might be an uncomfortable and upsetting experience, but (sigh) this is going over old ground so I'm not going to suggest that it was all a bit of a gross over reaction. But putting it into context, I can't for one moment imagine Ro (or any stacker for that matter) ordering 8 blankets for a shelf, when they might only ever need 3.
She didn't go public with it - some airman did, by phoning the local radio station and complaining about being ordered to cover up. In the CO's defence, I can't imagine for one moment she would have thought the reaction would have been quite this strong. I can imagine that one nurse being victimised might be an uncomfortable and upsetting experience, but (sigh) this is going over old ground so I'm not going to suggest that it was all a bit of a gross over reaction. But putting it into context, I can't for one moment imagine Ro (or any stacker for that matter) ordering 8 blankets for a shelf, when they might only ever need 3.
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Avitor - the Stn Cdr at Wittering didn't make any comments to spark this whole thing off - she took advice from security services about the safety and wellbeing of troops under her care. It was an internal matter. Get off your Peterborough high horse - it isn't exactly outside the camp gates and I'm still not going to go there with my uniform on. Crappy town full of rat-faced residents. It does have an oriental supermarket tho - got to see positive where it exists.