Jailed Flt Lt
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Met him a couple of times, a complete chimp & V.vain!
I know the E3 guys aren't doing much on Operations at the moment & are trying to justify their existence but bloody hell lads!!!
I know the E3 guys aren't doing much on Operations at the moment & are trying to justify their existence but bloody hell lads!!!
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Gutted as I am to see an old friend fall like this, I think it's fair to say that most of those who know him realise that there were always, shall we say, some issues in his life that were bound to resolve themselves one way or the other. I don't know how he'll cope with prison, but I hope he leaves with a slightly more realistic perspective on his life, his abilities, and his capacity for causing himself damage. He's been dealt with fairly, and I hope he's given a fair chance by everyone to sort his life out when he's released.
Last edited by tablet_eraser; 19th Feb 2008 at 21:38.
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Rude Kid
As always, if you don't know the details (and I don't) - you probably don't need to. FOI it if you're desperate.
If nothing else I have to feel deeply sorry for Dave's parents. Especially if, given the family connections, this gets bigger than the Wiltshire Gazette and Herald. If he took some of us for a ride I'm assuming he must have taken them for a world tour, and this will have been an horrendous shock.
As always, if you don't know the details (and I don't) - you probably don't need to. FOI it if you're desperate.
If nothing else I have to feel deeply sorry for Dave's parents. Especially if, given the family connections, this gets bigger than the Wiltshire Gazette and Herald. If he took some of us for a ride I'm assuming he must have taken them for a world tour, and this will have been an horrendous shock.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Spotter FC, if you Google I am afraid you will see many references to the Scotsman. Now it is in the nationals . . .
Sounds as though some psychiatric treatment might be more useful for this bloke than chokey, to me.
That might seem terribly wet and liberal, but from a civvy perspective, he hasn't done much to deserve jail (when you see what people do and then get a bit of community service), and while he may be a pratt (reading between the lines of some posts) and perhaps even a walt, he did earn his commission, and he did go to Iraq to serve us.
I find it very hard to condemn anyone who has done that, because I'll never have to.
And how very sad for his parents, his prospective in-laws and his wife to be. If she still is.....
That might seem terribly wet and liberal, but from a civvy perspective, he hasn't done much to deserve jail (when you see what people do and then get a bit of community service), and while he may be a pratt (reading between the lines of some posts) and perhaps even a walt, he did earn his commission, and he did go to Iraq to serve us.
I find it very hard to condemn anyone who has done that, because I'll never have to.
And how very sad for his parents, his prospective in-laws and his wife to be. If she still is.....
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I'd agree overall but the thing is, Jacko, we're supposed to be professionals.
Walting as an all-arms qualed bloke in the mess at happy hour is one thing but going there in that sort of post, when in truth he wasn't what he said he was, could've got himself, or worse other people killed.
From that perspective, I'm not suprised they took it pretty seriously.
Walting as an all-arms qualed bloke in the mess at happy hour is one thing but going there in that sort of post, when in truth he wasn't what he said he was, could've got himself, or worse other people killed.
From that perspective, I'm not suprised they took it pretty seriously.
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Tablet Eraser
I don't know the poor guy, but I was impressed by your post. I hope he gets help to sort his problems out when he comes out of jail. More than one family affected by his actions.
TIGS 2
Fully agree with your comments. Having worked for the Air Cdre I have found him to be a firm but fair leader who was highly respected by his staff.
I don't know the poor guy, but I was impressed by your post. I hope he gets help to sort his problems out when he comes out of jail. More than one family affected by his actions.
TIGS 2
Fully agree with your comments. Having worked for the Air Cdre I have found him to be a firm but fair leader who was highly respected by his staff.
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Having been out rather a long time now, I am intrigued at the concept of needing a set of certificates to go to war ? Can anyone explain what those certificates would be ?
I remember during GW1 the number of Regiment chaps who would lie, steal cheat and sell their grandmother for a sniff of the action, allegedly including a Squadron commander who took his entire field squadron on unauthorised walkabout.
As for professionals, well no one knows how they will perform on the two way range until their first time out, and a number of TA soldiers including an Edinburgh Bus Driver/TA loggie with an MC, testify that training and certificates are no guarantee. I would be interested to understand how this chap actually performed in his seven months in Iraq before attempting to judge him.
Remember that WWII was won by the amateurs and eccentrics after the professionals had been left on the beaches of Dunkirk and Singapore
On the face of it What a shame that their appears to be no room for eccentrics any more.
I remember during GW1 the number of Regiment chaps who would lie, steal cheat and sell their grandmother for a sniff of the action, allegedly including a Squadron commander who took his entire field squadron on unauthorised walkabout.
As for professionals, well no one knows how they will perform on the two way range until their first time out, and a number of TA soldiers including an Edinburgh Bus Driver/TA loggie with an MC, testify that training and certificates are no guarantee. I would be interested to understand how this chap actually performed in his seven months in Iraq before attempting to judge him.
Remember that WWII was won by the amateurs and eccentrics after the professionals had been left on the beaches of Dunkirk and Singapore
On the face of it What a shame that their appears to be no room for eccentrics any more.
Eccentrics and liars are different
RMAC - I take your point that the unconventional military mind is an asset (something I have been trying to convince my superiors for years 
) but the difference in this case was the ex-Officer in question was a liar and a cheat - not judicious fraud for the greater good - but for his self-aggrandizement. Inter alia he uttered documents and he retained ammunition without lawful intent (although I had a similar experience trying to return US-issued ammo after HERRICK; the difference is that I percevered to have it taken safely!).
The certificates required show that you are weapons trained and qualified (on spec ific weapons systems); have done the appropriate Theatre reinforcement training (eg minimum fitness level, ambush drills, suicide attacks, basic trauma care, CAC etc). Whilst these are no guarantee of an individual's performance under fire, at least they show that s/he has been trained.
Bottom line - how could we in the military ever trust this man's judgement and honesty...
) but the difference in this case was the ex-Officer in question was a liar and a cheat - not judicious fraud for the greater good - but for his self-aggrandizement. Inter alia he uttered documents and he retained ammunition without lawful intent (although I had a similar experience trying to return US-issued ammo after HERRICK; the difference is that I percevered to have it taken safely!). The certificates required show that you are weapons trained and qualified (on spec ific weapons systems); have done the appropriate Theatre reinforcement training (eg minimum fitness level, ambush drills, suicide attacks, basic trauma care, CAC etc). Whilst these are no guarantee of an individual's performance under fire, at least they show that s/he has been trained.
Bottom line - how could we in the military ever trust this man's judgement and honesty...
Last edited by Whenurhappy; 20th Feb 2008 at 08:53. Reason: typos