Cold War white elephant (Merged)

[Art Field]

Kolibear, you most certainly can. Indeed you can hear them from some distance away. I wonder what effect it has on the crews ears in the long term.

Incidently Tonkenna, if there was tanker support there seem to be a lot of pointy jobs up there to do the job. Was everybody trying to get in on the act?.

[Gainesy]

I wonder what effect it has on the crews ears in the long term.

Probably the same as the Shacklebomber. "Eh? Half past two."

When I flew in it, they briefed me to try not to stare at the props, put you in a trance. Very comfortable beast and the in-flight rations were a gazillion per cent better than the RAF's White Horror Box, with a lot of the fresh content grown/raised on the base's farm.

Bit of a Greenpeace quandary then.

[Wycombe]

I'd imagine the noise made by a Bear would be similar to that of the AN-22 freighter, as I think they have the same massive engines and contra-rotatating props.

If anyone has ever heard the deep resonating drone of the AN-22, it is a sound like no other, very distinctive.

[VitaminGee]

What's the difference between a Bear and a Bison?

You can't wash your hands in a Bear.

[I know the drill - hat, coat, door, TAXIIII!]

[DEL Mode]

Is There Room In A Typhoon Cockpit For A Camera?

Or was it all done with Photoshop?

Good Job The Pilot Did Not Drop His Map

[Modern Elmo]

With more than 90 per cent of Britain's trade travelling by sea

With more than 90 per cent of Britain's trade travelling by sea the country's economy would be extremely vulnerable to the submarines, which are hard to detect.

What trade is that, rough trade on cruise ships? What hard goods does the EU provinz formerly known as UK export nowadays, anyhow?

Lt-Cdr Robin Burns, an analyst from the laboratory, said: "Just one torpedo will do an awful amount of damage to our shipping and economy."

It might help the British economy if the Rooskies torpedoed ships bringing in east Asian imports. Oh, I meant cars and electronics and so on, not preocious loverly Asians.

[Liobian]

I recall reading somewhere that you can hear an overflying Bear from inside a submerged submarine !!!: ooh:

[MReyn24050]

A flight in a Bear!
http://www.aviapedia.com/videos/bomb...-95_Engels.wmv

[TEEEJ]

DoubleZero wrote:

"Aren't Backfires, Blackjacks etc a bit more worrying, if resurrected"

They never went away. The Backfires don't have the probes for refuelling under treaty conditions. The Backfire would need to refuel quite a bit to get down near the UK.

The Blackjacks never went away either. The Russians eventually got the Ukrainian Air Force Blackjacks back and placed them in their inventory. The Blackjacks that were in partial build are/were being completed. At least one modernised Blackjack has entered service in the last couple of years with more to be completed.

The Russians flew two Blackjacks down off the east coast of the UK back in Feb 2001. F.3s were sent up to do the intercept. No nice piccies due to it being winter pitch black. The Blackjacks also did sorties last year into North American ADIZ.

Those Bear Hs are all new-build airframes from the 80s. The last one came off the production line in the early 1990s. Lots of money put into the fleet of Blackjacks and Bear Hs over the years and in their weapons too. The Russians have been working on new long-range ALCMs such as the Kh-101.

The Bear H can carry the ALCMs in the bomb-bay on a rotary launcher. It can also carry the weapons on pylons. At one point the Tu-95MS carried the designations Tu-95MS6 and Tu-95MS16 under treaty conditions. This has now been dropped and all can technically carry 16 of the AS-15 Kent ALCMs.

[TEEEJ]

Arclite01 wrote

Question - So how far do they have to penetrate UKADR before we actually decide - that is far enough and stop them (Shoot down) ?

They can legally go up to the 12nm limit. No one is going to shoot one of those Bear Hs down under peace-time conditions. The Bear Hs is a stand-off air-launched cruise missile carrier able to launch from thousands of kms away.

[M609]

"Aren't Backfires, Blackjacks etc a bit more worrying, if resurrected"

...and they have ventured past the North Cape a lot the last month. (At least the Backfires)
The Backfires are not that uncommon in the North.

[PlasticCabDriver]

The Backfires don't have the probes for refuelling under treaty conditions

Whether under treaty or not, looks like a refuel probe to me:

[M609]

The ones not on the scrapheap does not

Taken last week north of Norway

[PlasticCabDriver]

Although I appreciate it is from Wiki:

As built, the Tu-22M has provision for a retractable in-flight refueling probe in the upper part of the nose. This was allegedly removed as a result of the SALT negotiations, although it can be easily reinstated if needed,

[Squirrel 41]

B vs C

Teej is quite right, they can come to 12nm - as we can go to their 12 nm limit.

(Anorak on...)

And wiki is probably right - but the difference in the photos is that the knackered one with the probe is a Tu-22M(2, I think) - BACKFIRE-A/B and the one M609 has kindly put up is Tu-22M3 BaCKFIRE-C, minus probe in accordance with treaty obligations (CFE, maybe?)

(Anorak off... and breath!)

S41

[TEEEJ]

PCD wrote:

Whether under treaty or not, looks like a refuel probe to me:

That is 'Red53' pictured at Riga, Lithuania. It is a Tu-22M1 Backfire A. This was one of a handful of pilot production aircraft built before the main production Tu-22M2s Backfire Bs entered service in the 1970s. The airframe was part of a Soviet technical school and left there after the Russians pulled out of the Baltic States.

The only type in service with the Russian Air Force/Navy are the Tu-22M3s Backfire Cs. The only other variant in service are a handful of Backfire Ds (Tu-22MR) built for recce. Easy to recognise the Backfire A/B from the C/D as the C/D has the raked air-intakes. The Ukranians have retired all of their fleet.

The Russians would have to tear up SALT/START/SORT etc if they wanted to re-instate the Backfire Cs with an air-refuelling capability.

[GOLF_BRAVO_ZULU]

The Russians might argue that the US has already torn up "SALT/START/SORT" by the intention to field an anti ballistic missile system. The ABM will be a force multiplier for residual Blue forces, even if that isn't the intention.

[Jetex Jim]

"Tony Blair said the cold war was over....... some of us didn't believe it."

Cold war my a***se, for my money its a case that now the RAF finally has its new toy the Russians are just seeing how many they can flush, how soon they show up, how long they can hang around before running home to the tanker...
And thus build a picture of just how good this new one is, and a lot of the interest there may be for purely commercial reasons, they having a few competitive products of their own on sale. What better way to test the authenticity of those sales brochure claims for availabilty etc.
Oh and by the way make a note of these frequencies and RF power levels Dimitri, just in case we ever do get serious.