RFI: Phantom crash, 1435 Flt late 1980s
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RFI: Phantom crash, 1435 Flt late 1980s
Dear All,
I'd appreciate some detail from the accident report relating to the above a/c. Please can anyone help?
The a/c crashed in the sea off the Falklands sometime in the late 1980s. I do not have the serial number, but I believe that she was called "Charity". Unfortunately both crew perished in the incident.
All help greatly appreciated,
Spim
I'd appreciate some detail from the accident report relating to the above a/c. Please can anyone help?
The a/c crashed in the sea off the Falklands sometime in the late 1980s. I do not have the serial number, but I believe that she was called "Charity". Unfortunately both crew perished in the incident.
All help greatly appreciated,
Spim
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I think it was in 1989 (may be 1990) and most of the following is vague recollection. The navigator was a chap called CJ Weightman, I don't recall the pilot's name. I think the BOI summised that they became disorientated in cloud some time after tanking. The crash site was thought to be somewhere 50nm North of the Islands. Looking back on those times, the Falklands F4 force was very much a place for 'warriors' with fairly relaxed adherance to rules. I'm not saying that these guys broke the rules, I'm just saying that the environment and ethos was far different from today.I'm sure someone else will drop in with more detail.
Sorry I can't help much more. CJ was a gent and someone I shared many beers with.
Sorry I can't help much more. CJ was a gent and someone I shared many beers with.
I believe the pilot was nicknamed 'Mongo', and was a Fg Off named Ian (can't remember the surname). As an aside, if you are ever lucky enough to be invited into the Goose at MPA, you'll notice the wall opposite the entrance has a mural that is half-finished - Mongo was apparently working on this at the time of his accident, and it has been left half-completed out of respect - it was going to read 'Death Before Socially Acceptable Behaviour'...
Can't quite recall the details of the accident, though I have read the report, but concur with the 'disorientation in cloud' already mentioned.
RIP dudes
Can't quite recall the details of the accident, though I have read the report, but concur with the 'disorientation in cloud' already mentioned.
RIP dudes
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The Pilot's nickname was Mongo. One of mu most enduring memories of Mongo was watching him getting horse whipped on the rump in a 19(F) Sqn liaison beer call in 'The Bird Room' in Wildenrath tower.
Bless him, he really got a good whipping and his Mrs had some questions for him about the marks on his rump.
I have a copy of the last publication of the RAF Wildenrath Station Magazine in which tributes to Mongo and Ceej were published. I will see if that can provide some more details.
Bless him, he really got a good whipping and his Mrs had some questions for him about the marks on his rump.
I have a copy of the last publication of the RAF Wildenrath Station Magazine in which tributes to Mongo and Ceej were published. I will see if that can provide some more details.
Found the online copy of the Accident Report:
http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/E86CA...21_30oct91.pdf
Frodo
http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/E86CA...21_30oct91.pdf
Frodo
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Gents,
Thanks for all the information - really helpful.
I think that "Mongo" may have been Flt Lt Ian Halden. Anyone got any other stories about him?
RIP CJ and Mongo.
Cheers,
Spim
Thanks for all the information - really helpful.
I think that "Mongo" may have been Flt Lt Ian Halden. Anyone got any other stories about him?
RIP CJ and Mongo.
Cheers,
Spim
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Just by way of afterthought....
It is interesting that the MOD cited the probable cause of the accident as "loss of control due to incorrect aircraft handling", even though they never recovered enough of the debris to reach a definite conclusion.
Bearing in mind the Chinook in Scotland and the shocking way in which that case was handled, it seems that the MOD would rather villify its own brave and highly trained people, than accept that a piece of equipment is fallible
It is interesting that the MOD cited the probable cause of the accident as "loss of control due to incorrect aircraft handling", even though they never recovered enough of the debris to reach a definite conclusion.
Bearing in mind the Chinook in Scotland and the shocking way in which that case was handled, it seems that the MOD would rather villify its own brave and highly trained people, than accept that a piece of equipment is fallible
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The Very Last Zulu - RAF Wildenrath Stn Magazine
Dated December 1991 - Front Cover photo of 'B' XT899 in the all over blue scheme (with, I am assuming 'Z' of 92 Sqn, peeling away) with the picture listed inside as:
Flying Officer Ian Halden in action. Made by Flight Lieutenant CJ Weightman
Included in the 19(F) Sqn news is the following:
Flight Lieutenant C J Weightman and Flying Officer I M Halden
On Thursday 14 November 1991 at St Thomas C of E Church, RAF Wildenrath, a Service of Thanksgiving was held for the lives of Flight Lieutenant Chris Weightman and Flying Officer Ian Halden, known to their friends as "CJ" and "Mongo" respectively.
Mongo and CJ, pilot and navigator from 19(F) Squadron were lost in an accident whilst flying a routine training mission over the South Atlantic, serving on a Squadron roulement to 1435 Flight in the Falkland Islands.
Ian Halden and C J Weightman were without doubt two of 19(F) Squadron's finest characters with a zest for life that was paralleled both professionally and socially. They were accomplished sportsmen and excellent company, whatever the occassion.
The sense of loss felt by the Squadron is equally shared by groundcrew and aircrew alike; an indication of their standing. Furthermore, it is a tribute to the impact that "the Ceej" and "Mongo" made on people they met that representatives of the United States and Belgian Air Forces were present at the Thanksgiving.
CJ, a batchelor, and Mongo, married to L*****, did more than touch other people's lives; they made a deep impression on all who met them and were loved by those who had learned to know them.
They will be sadly missed.
The article is then followed with individual career citations of them both. I will happily type them out on this thread if people so desire.
Flying Officer Ian Halden in action. Made by Flight Lieutenant CJ Weightman
Included in the 19(F) Sqn news is the following:
Flight Lieutenant C J Weightman and Flying Officer I M Halden
On Thursday 14 November 1991 at St Thomas C of E Church, RAF Wildenrath, a Service of Thanksgiving was held for the lives of Flight Lieutenant Chris Weightman and Flying Officer Ian Halden, known to their friends as "CJ" and "Mongo" respectively.
Mongo and CJ, pilot and navigator from 19(F) Squadron were lost in an accident whilst flying a routine training mission over the South Atlantic, serving on a Squadron roulement to 1435 Flight in the Falkland Islands.
Ian Halden and C J Weightman were without doubt two of 19(F) Squadron's finest characters with a zest for life that was paralleled both professionally and socially. They were accomplished sportsmen and excellent company, whatever the occassion.
The sense of loss felt by the Squadron is equally shared by groundcrew and aircrew alike; an indication of their standing. Furthermore, it is a tribute to the impact that "the Ceej" and "Mongo" made on people they met that representatives of the United States and Belgian Air Forces were present at the Thanksgiving.
CJ, a batchelor, and Mongo, married to L*****, did more than touch other people's lives; they made a deep impression on all who met them and were loved by those who had learned to know them.
They will be sadly missed.
The article is then followed with individual career citations of them both. I will happily type them out on this thread if people so desire.
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This is bizarre, just reading out of interest and all of a sudden realised, I was on a CCF camp at RAF Wildenrath in the late 80's and have a signed squadron print with both of these guys signatures on it. I remember because Mongo signed it twice.
Sorry to hear of the future of those guys RIP.
Sorry to hear of the future of those guys RIP.
flungdung
The CFIT accident was in the Autumn of 83 - I remember it well 'cos I went through training with both of the guys involved and 24 hours later I ended up rapidly heading "down South" as a direct result of the accident 
.
Flt Lts John Gostick ( aka Spog) and Geoff Bell, much missed. RIP chaps.
. Flt Lts John Gostick ( aka Spog) and Geoff Bell, much missed. RIP chaps.
Following the CFIT at Mt Osborne (I was at Kellys at the time on wokkas) didn't the Scottish Group Captain (as was) and IMHO over-promoted at that rank, christ knows how he got to where is now, tos*er, made his best ever gaff at the front door of Mrs *****back in Uk...........with his best ever insensitive remark.........What a t*at--he still makes me f*cking angry.
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Mongo, and CJ were both just the best mates and Fellas a Sqn could ever have. Simple. An enduringly sad loss, which is still comemorated every year by 1435 Flt and MPA. There is an annual fly past, and wreath ceremony, at which there is rarely a 'dry eye'.
Truely Touching, and valid.
RIP
Advo
Truely Touching, and valid.
RIP
Advo
It's always the good guys who go first.
I was on 92 with Geoff Bell in the early '80's. A thoroughly nice chap who was genuinely interested in everyone's story, no matter how mundane.
RIP indeed.
I was on 92 with Geoff Bell in the early '80's. A thoroughly nice chap who was genuinely interested in everyone's story, no matter how mundane.
RIP indeed.
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Maybe I shouldn't take issue with London Mil's description of the Falklands F4 force at post No 2 so that it does not get any more prominence. However, the allegation of
is a long way from the truth and a slur on the characters around the F4 at the time.
The
was a cross-section of the whole F4 force at the time and it was thoroughly professional with a great bunch of guys who knew the difference between those rules made for the obedience of fools and those made for wise men.
Wish the present day Service was just the same.
fairly relaxed adherance to rules
The
Falklands F4 force
Wish the present day Service was just the same.
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soddim, I think you have described the environment far better than my feeble first attempt. Merv Payne was the Boss when I went to the FI and 23 Sqn was just a 'great bunch of guys'. People like CJ, Billie Bartle, Chuckles (RIP) etc really made life far more memorable. Nasty Nigel (OC Ops) had a view that the boys were wreckless and did all he could to control their 'spirit', miserably failing in the process. I remember one crew getting held back for a week (dets used to be 6 weeks?)due to an inappropriate Firey Cross. They were actually quite pleased with this as it gave them more opportunity to have some fun!
I wouldn't want this thread to drift into a slanging match and apologise for any wrong message put across in my first post. I truly loved those days and completely agree with your last line. Things have changed and, in the process, much of the fun has disappeared.
I wouldn't want this thread to drift into a slanging match and apologise for any wrong message put across in my first post. I truly loved those days and completely agree with your last line. Things have changed and, in the process, much of the fun has disappeared.