UK Forces "Very Stretched"
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From: the northern riviera
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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UK Forces "Very Stretched"
BBC: British forces 'very stretched'
Britain's armed forces are "very stretched" by operations in Afghanistan and Iraq, the chief of the defence staff has told MPs. Air chief marshal Sir Jock Stirrup told the defence committee there was "not much more left in the locker". Commitments had been greater and gone on longer than planned, he told MPs. "We are able to sustain what we are doing at the moment but in the not too distant future we need something to change," he added.
Sir Jock said he had been encouraged by recent announcements on troop withdrawals in Iraq. But even if withdrawals continued as expected, Britain would not be able to fight another war for "some years" because of the impact operations in Iraq and Afghanistan have had on training.
"If we are able to reduce the operational tempo, as we hope and intend to, over the next 18 months - and we achieved the first very slight loosening of the screw just recently - then we should be in a position to reinstate some of this training. But quite clearly we are not going to be in the business of engaging in large-scale, high-end war fighting operations for some years to come. Because not only do we need to conclude what we are currently doing, or at least bring the levels down, we will need to train a new generation of people."
All three armed forces were short of manpower, said Sir Jock, and personnel were being kept away from their home bases for longer, without leave, than recommended. If operations continued at the current level for longer than expected, there would have to be a major rethink, he added.
"We will either at some stage, in the not too distant future, need to reduce the overall level of commitment, or we are going to think about the overall force structure." The armed forces could cope with redeployment to Afghanistan, but there was "not much more left in the locker," he told MPs. "We do have other capacity for certain emergencies but it's pretty limited," he added.
He also suggested Britain would have to increase defence spending.
Britain was likely to face high demands on its armed forces in the years ahead because of continuing global instability and that was going to "need the right level of investment," said Sir Jock. Asked if he believed Britain would have to spend a greater share of its national income on defence, a smiling Sir Jock said: "You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment."
He said the government would decide in the next 12 months on future military spending priorities, and it would become clear then whether there was a need for a more wide-ranging defence review...........
Britain's armed forces are "very stretched" by operations in Afghanistan and Iraq, the chief of the defence staff has told MPs. Air chief marshal Sir Jock Stirrup told the defence committee there was "not much more left in the locker". Commitments had been greater and gone on longer than planned, he told MPs. "We are able to sustain what we are doing at the moment but in the not too distant future we need something to change," he added.
Sir Jock said he had been encouraged by recent announcements on troop withdrawals in Iraq. But even if withdrawals continued as expected, Britain would not be able to fight another war for "some years" because of the impact operations in Iraq and Afghanistan have had on training.
"If we are able to reduce the operational tempo, as we hope and intend to, over the next 18 months - and we achieved the first very slight loosening of the screw just recently - then we should be in a position to reinstate some of this training. But quite clearly we are not going to be in the business of engaging in large-scale, high-end war fighting operations for some years to come. Because not only do we need to conclude what we are currently doing, or at least bring the levels down, we will need to train a new generation of people."
All three armed forces were short of manpower, said Sir Jock, and personnel were being kept away from their home bases for longer, without leave, than recommended. If operations continued at the current level for longer than expected, there would have to be a major rethink, he added.
"We will either at some stage, in the not too distant future, need to reduce the overall level of commitment, or we are going to think about the overall force structure." The armed forces could cope with redeployment to Afghanistan, but there was "not much more left in the locker," he told MPs. "We do have other capacity for certain emergencies but it's pretty limited," he added.
He also suggested Britain would have to increase defence spending.
Britain was likely to face high demands on its armed forces in the years ahead because of continuing global instability and that was going to "need the right level of investment," said Sir Jock. Asked if he believed Britain would have to spend a greater share of its national income on defence, a smiling Sir Jock said: "You might very well think that. I couldn't possibly comment."
He said the government would decide in the next 12 months on future military spending priorities, and it would become clear then whether there was a need for a more wide-ranging defence review...........
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From: Scotland
He did say "Yes".
The 'you might think that ...' formula comes from Francis Urquhart (F.U. - Geddit?) in the drama "House of Cards".
It's a bit of a wittier way of saying yes in such circumstances: CDS asks for bigger Defence Vote, Bears Sh1t in Woods, Pope Heidbutts Runway - take your pick.
The 'you might think that ...' formula comes from Francis Urquhart (F.U. - Geddit?) in the drama "House of Cards".
It's a bit of a wittier way of saying yes in such circumstances: CDS asks for bigger Defence Vote, Bears Sh1t in Woods, Pope Heidbutts Runway - take your pick.
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From: GONE BY 2012
Not sure about stretched - more like breaking point.
315 operational days away in last 24 months - 6 months planned this year having completed 6 weeks already.
Airframes that are late from servicing-falling apart, inadequate kit, no training, poor pay rise, crap housing, no managed career path etc etc....
ATPL in back pocket with 2 years to do - don't think I'll be staying irrespective of Defence spending.
CDS - tell them how it is FFS!!!
315 operational days away in last 24 months - 6 months planned this year having completed 6 weeks already.
Airframes that are late from servicing-falling apart, inadequate kit, no training, poor pay rise, crap housing, no managed career path etc etc....
ATPL in back pocket with 2 years to do - don't think I'll be staying irrespective of Defence spending.
CDS - tell them how it is FFS!!!
Joined: May 1999
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From: Quite near 'An aerodrome somewhere in England'
The applied strain already applied has now stretched the UK's Armed Forces beyond the elastic limit.
And we know what happens when strain continues to be applied beyond that point........
....fracture!
And we know what happens when strain continues to be applied beyond that point........
....fracture!
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From: Cambs
An Teallach, well said, Yes, is precisely what he said!
Whatever we all think about our seniors I still have the (misguided?) confidence that what they say in public is not always what is being said behind closed doors!
Do we really want the head of the Armed Forces bleating about our precise weaknesses in an open forum where it's instantly available to anybody with a www connection worldwide? Do we really want our morale being stamped on even more by the blokes at the top constantly whingeing too?
Perhaps I'm wrong but I think a statement like this lets intelligent people read between the lines and to me makes it a little clearer exactly what they might be saying behind closed doors - which I hope is a little more frank!
Or perhaps I'm just naive!
Whatever we all think about our seniors I still have the (misguided?) confidence that what they say in public is not always what is being said behind closed doors!
Do we really want the head of the Armed Forces bleating about our precise weaknesses in an open forum where it's instantly available to anybody with a www connection worldwide? Do we really want our morale being stamped on even more by the blokes at the top constantly whingeing too?
Perhaps I'm wrong but I think a statement like this lets intelligent people read between the lines and to me makes it a little clearer exactly what they might be saying behind closed doors - which I hope is a little more frank!
Or perhaps I'm just naive!
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From: the northern riviera
Quote; "Commitments had been greater and gone on longer than planned"
Sounds like some people in the 'Ivory Towers' have never heard of the 5 P's. Did they really think we'd storm into Baghdad or Kabul then all be home in time for tea and medals??
Sounds like some people in the 'Ivory Towers' have never heard of the 5 P's. Did they really think we'd storm into Baghdad or Kabul then all be home in time for tea and medals??
Joined: Oct 2005
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From: UK
Well its about time
Is this what we have been waiting for ladies and gents
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6423003.stm
Will it do us any good?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6423003.stm
Will it do us any good?
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From: The Flatlands
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1770
Some more meat on the bones, and a few interesting details. Sir Jock finally raises his head above the parapet.
Some more meat on the bones, and a few interesting details. Sir Jock finally raises his head above the parapet.