FRI Announcement
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Once again a complete cock up goes by the way side, heaven forbid we own up to the fact that MCM have got the sums wrong. I implore puzzle palace to show where the excess of Gazelle and Lynx pilots are? All I see is undermanned Squadrons wherever I go and am frankly hugely dissappointed at the lack of gusto to fight our case. A senior Officer told me last year that NCO's were very lucky to have had it at all, which indirectly tells its own tale.
Well done all whom wear a Light Blue beret and think the garden remains Rosey, now get your head out of the compost and have a look around! I am convinced that the time barred AH outflow will demonstrate just how badly you have got it wrong. That alligned with the reduction in Lynx crews due to AH CTT and its effect on those few that remain, (Not the great wealth of them that seem to be sitting idly somewhere) causing them to rotate more and more increasingly on Telic will Im sure cause an equal defecit in Lynx manning.
I could have got this all wrong as I don't have the luxury of seeing the figures written on paper but I suspect that in a year or two's time the Corps will once again be offering FRI and telephoning retired pilots trying to entice them back, only to repeat this fiasco once more.
Well done all whom wear a Light Blue beret and think the garden remains Rosey, now get your head out of the compost and have a look around! I am convinced that the time barred AH outflow will demonstrate just how badly you have got it wrong. That alligned with the reduction in Lynx crews due to AH CTT and its effect on those few that remain, (Not the great wealth of them that seem to be sitting idly somewhere) causing them to rotate more and more increasingly on Telic will Im sure cause an equal defecit in Lynx manning.
I could have got this all wrong as I don't have the luxury of seeing the figures written on paper but I suspect that in a year or two's time the Corps will once again be offering FRI and telephoning retired pilots trying to entice them back, only to repeat this fiasco once more.
Join Date: Jun 2004
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Sorry,
Deleted this post - I now recognise that the words contained in it are/were totally useless and therefore stop whining and either shut up or get out.
So lets now see if I have the courage to either try and transfer or join the many in giving civvie flying a go - or maybe I will be allowed back to Lynx or Islander.
Deleted this post - I now recognise that the words contained in it are/were totally useless and therefore stop whining and either shut up or get out.
So lets now see if I have the courage to either try and transfer or join the many in giving civvie flying a go - or maybe I will be allowed back to Lynx or Islander.
Last edited by Front Seater; 4th Mar 2007 at 06:05.
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And there I was thinking the following:
RN officer aircrew get the option for PA spine + 50K FRI
RAF officer aircrew pilots get the option for PA spine +50k FRI
RN 'Senior Officer' pilots get the option for FRI at IPP and FRI after 5 years
Silly me,
Of course - us Army aviators should just have the option for PA spine and if we ever become a 'Senior Officer' (i.e. Major or above) we get to try and sort out the $hit that is currently going on - possibly sat in the same JHC HQ opposite a a fellow RN 'senior officer' that has just got paid 50k (on top of his previous 5 years 50k) for doing exactly the same the job.
Of course Serf, I see exactly what you are saying - either soldier on stagging on in Afghanistan (or training for Afghanistan) and then doing nothing (of an aviation nature) when back at Wattisham because all of the spares/aircraft have run out or try and transfer to another Service and then you have got the options of PA spine and FRI and the real win is that if you really want to transfer and still want a career out of the cockpit, then if you are good enough against your peers, then you could get a double wammy.
Potentially 100k for AAC officer to transfer and try and 'make a career of the RN' to Senior officer level or remain in the Army still work the same MoD Main Building, PJHQ and high demand Staff jobs for an added increase of 0%.
RN officer aircrew get the option for PA spine + 50K FRI
RAF officer aircrew pilots get the option for PA spine +50k FRI
RN 'Senior Officer' pilots get the option for FRI at IPP and FRI after 5 years
Silly me,
Of course - us Army aviators should just have the option for PA spine and if we ever become a 'Senior Officer' (i.e. Major or above) we get to try and sort out the $hit that is currently going on - possibly sat in the same JHC HQ opposite a a fellow RN 'senior officer' that has just got paid 50k (on top of his previous 5 years 50k) for doing exactly the same the job.
Of course Serf, I see exactly what you are saying - either soldier on stagging on in Afghanistan (or training for Afghanistan) and then doing nothing (of an aviation nature) when back at Wattisham because all of the spares/aircraft have run out or try and transfer to another Service and then you have got the options of PA spine and FRI and the real win is that if you really want to transfer and still want a career out of the cockpit, then if you are good enough against your peers, then you could get a double wammy.
Potentially 100k for AAC officer to transfer and try and 'make a career of the RN' to Senior officer level or remain in the Army still work the same MoD Main Building, PJHQ and high demand Staff jobs for an added increase of 0%.
Did you join for the money?
If so then poor choice.
And if not, how come it's such a big issue?
Stop being greedy!
There was no FRI in the origional contract
If so then poor choice.
And if not, how come it's such a big issue?
Stop being greedy!
There was no FRI in the origional contract
What is happening now is people are leaving because they have done the time expected of them. Why would they extend their contracts if they are going to do twice the amount of work for no incentive? The flight I'm with has / had 8 pilots. 7 are finishing off the ATPL package. None are staying in. We fly Gaz. and the AAC has no more Gaz pilots around.....go figure.
Join Date: Jan 2001
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Don't get me wrong Timex, I think this is one of the most divisive bits of rubbish ever to come down the chain of command.
I took mine and spent it, but it made absolutely no difference to my staying in or leaving.
People did not join to make money, and money unless it really is a silly amount, will not make them stay.
The real problem is the erosion of fun in the military.
If they want retention, they need to kill off the fun police not throw small amounts of money at the problem. (£100,000 over 5 yrs = not much per year after tax)
All this does is annoy people by causing a split.
I took mine and spent it, but it made absolutely no difference to my staying in or leaving.
People did not join to make money, and money unless it really is a silly amount, will not make them stay.
The real problem is the erosion of fun in the military.
If they want retention, they need to kill off the fun police not throw small amounts of money at the problem. (£100,000 over 5 yrs = not much per year after tax)
All this does is annoy people by causing a split.
Front Seater, you seem to have made the mistake that those above you give a $hit about you - they dont - so look out for yourself, you may think you are indespensible, you're not. (I used to think the same, saw the light and left)
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Serf,
And on that we do agree - it is sad but true. I have always been educated in the forces to look after those under you, earn respect, lead - but I now get the feeling that I am reading a pre-WWII training manual in a Mr Chumley Warner accent and those professional ideals and associated ethos has long gone.
Is it really everyman for himself thses days? One thing that the military has always been over civvie street is selfless - (not selfish!) - selfless. Times are changing I fear.
And on that we do agree - it is sad but true. I have always been educated in the forces to look after those under you, earn respect, lead - but I now get the feeling that I am reading a pre-WWII training manual in a Mr Chumley Warner accent and those professional ideals and associated ethos has long gone.
Is it really everyman for himself thses days? One thing that the military has always been over civvie street is selfless - (not selfish!) - selfless. Times are changing I fear.
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
DAAVn's point is that the Corps can not be held to ransom by those who threaten to leave unless things change. A sound principle, but the threat to leave is simply the effect, not the cause. It would be interesting to know if anyone on Falaise Road was actually looking at the reasons for some of these "whinges" and not just putting it down to SNCO/WO chips on shoulders, as is usually the case. That said, making any comparison between Army Aviation Terms of Service and the other 2 services is like a red rag to a bull to Non-Aviation Senior Army Officers who have never accepted (and never will) that piloting an Army aircraft is in any way a professional activity. As these are the individuals who drive the AFPRB, the chances of any alignement between the services is low, so it's not just DAAVn who doesn't accept there is a problem. And don't expect anyone in Light or Dark blue to help on this one, any public displays of the AAC eating their own young are met with with delight, while the RAF and RN start planning where to put all the Apaches.
And by the way, leaving the AAC at ANY level is like taking your hand out of a bucket of water - there's a few ripples at first, and then pretty soon it's like it was never there.
And by the way, leaving the AAC at ANY level is like taking your hand out of a bucket of water - there's a few ripples at first, and then pretty soon it's like it was never there.
Join Date: Jan 2000
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I cannot imagine how this FRI has not been offered to AAC pilots given the current climate. Has history got nothing to teach us? 
At a time when op tempo is as high as it has ever been, the second batch of AH time-bars are about to run out at the same time that many of those (soon to be out of time bar AH pilots are being forced to move Wattashambles) lads are at thier 22 year point and AAvn think there isn't a shortage of pilots.
Look how many of the origional AH pilots (mostly QHI's I know) are still in green. There are more that are about to or have left than are still serving. Indeed another is on his way at the end of this month, and I look forward to buying him a pint.
Coupled with the time bar ending, post op tour reality will make many look closely at if they want to continue to serve, pressure from loved ones not to go back on ops will cause many to call it a day at the 22 years point.
I think that a big mistake has been made, and it won't be easy to correct.
OVC
At a time when op tempo is as high as it has ever been, the second batch of AH time-bars are about to run out at the same time that many of those (soon to be out of time bar AH pilots are being forced to move Wattashambles) lads are at thier 22 year point and AAvn think there isn't a shortage of pilots.
Look how many of the origional AH pilots (mostly QHI's I know) are still in green. There are more that are about to or have left than are still serving. Indeed another is on his way at the end of this month, and I look forward to buying him a pint.
Coupled with the time bar ending, post op tour reality will make many look closely at if they want to continue to serve, pressure from loved ones not to go back on ops will cause many to call it a day at the 22 years point.
I think that a big mistake has been made, and it won't be easy to correct.
OVC
Anzio Dinner
1. Mess Dress in dry cleaners for removal of multiple mud stains.
2. Mess wellies for a complete reburshiment.
3. Toilet on sleasy jet Cat 5'd on return trip.
4. Unfit to drive at 1800hrs the folloing day, had to get head down.
Fantastic!
1. Mess Dress in dry cleaners for removal of multiple mud stains.
2. Mess wellies for a complete reburshiment.
3. Toilet on sleasy jet Cat 5'd on return trip.
4. Unfit to drive at 1800hrs the folloing day, had to get head down.
Fantastic!
