Freeze On Navy Promotions For 5 Years
Nixor ut Ledo
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Freeze On Navy Promotions For 5 Years
Headline item on Radio 4 this morning. What the bl**dy hell is the UK government up to??
A 5 year freeze on promotions will do wonders for morale. Or perhaps that's the intention. Get rid of the people above Lt Cdr 'cos they've not got any ships left to deal with.
A 5 year freeze on promotions will do wonders for morale. Or perhaps that's the intention. Get rid of the people above Lt Cdr 'cos they've not got any ships left to deal with.
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The Telegraph says it is not just admirals.
Quote "An official Navy document passed to this newspaper states that all promotions to the rank of Lieutenant Commander or above will be halted until 2012."
Quote "An official Navy document passed to this newspaper states that all promotions to the rank of Lieutenant Commander or above will be halted until 2012."
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Link to article:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../06/navy06.xml
Not sure what the current position is in the RN. Whilst the RAF has always (AFAIK) promoted to Sqn Ldr (Lt Cdr/Maj) competitively, my understanding is that some elements of the other Services have promoted to this rank automatically based on time served.
It will be interesting to see precisely what the official line is on this, and whether it spreads to the other Services. If so, then I would think you can say goodbye to an awful lot of lieutenants and equivalents. In my world, these are the people we are short of.
A bunch of us were discussing some of the current options (scare stories!) yesterday, and came to the conclusion that at least some of what is currently appearing in the media may be related to the annual spending rounds - almost as if the Service Chiefs are engaging in brinkmanship to see who can frighten the politicians most!
STH
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../06/navy06.xml
Not sure what the current position is in the RN. Whilst the RAF has always (AFAIK) promoted to Sqn Ldr (Lt Cdr/Maj) competitively, my understanding is that some elements of the other Services have promoted to this rank automatically based on time served.
It will be interesting to see precisely what the official line is on this, and whether it spreads to the other Services. If so, then I would think you can say goodbye to an awful lot of lieutenants and equivalents. In my world, these are the people we are short of.
A bunch of us were discussing some of the current options (scare stories!) yesterday, and came to the conclusion that at least some of what is currently appearing in the media may be related to the annual spending rounds - almost as if the Service Chiefs are engaging in brinkmanship to see who can frighten the politicians most!
STH
Last edited by SirToppamHat; 6th Jan 2007 at 08:59.
Chaps
This months Navy News has an abbreviated section on this lifted from the RN Intranet. If you read it, it makes clear that this paving the way for a large reduction in personnel - most likely to 20,000 matelots plus RM by 2015.
This months Navy News has an abbreviated section on this lifted from the RN Intranet. If you read it, it makes clear that this paving the way for a large reduction in personnel - most likely to 20,000 matelots plus RM by 2015.
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My trade stopped recruiting for 2 years in the early 80’s. The consequence of this was felt for many years after that, and although time healed, it was a stupid policy based upon logic that defied me.
This announcement is worthy of an April 1st joke. The consequences will be felt for many years to come and will promote (pardon the pun) an exodus of PVR, cross service transfer, and indeed international transfer with almost immediate effect. Inevitably it will be the guys (& girls) that you would want to go to war with that will leave; leaving behind……well you can guess the rest!
I guess our antipodean friends will be rubbing their hands in glee and the expertise pool now available with minimal training costs.
Assuming that nothing happens by accident, this may well be a cynical way of avoiding redundancy payments. Sympathies lay with those that no longer have their expected career path, for I know exactly what that feels like.
This announcement is worthy of an April 1st joke. The consequences will be felt for many years to come and will promote (pardon the pun) an exodus of PVR, cross service transfer, and indeed international transfer with almost immediate effect. Inevitably it will be the guys (& girls) that you would want to go to war with that will leave; leaving behind……well you can guess the rest!
I guess our antipodean friends will be rubbing their hands in glee and the expertise pool now available with minimal training costs.
Assuming that nothing happens by accident, this may well be a cynical way of avoiding redundancy payments. Sympathies lay with those that no longer have their expected career path, for I know exactly what that feels like.
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Not sure where all this leads, who does, but see also:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6236345.stm
Recruitment age for Army raised.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6236345.stm
Recruitment age for Army raised.
I take my hat of to this government. They have managed to achieve what Hitler tried and failed to do - the systematic destruction of the armed forces and undermining the will to fight of those who remain.
I have no doubts in my own mind that the devestation being wreaked at the moment will have much further reaching impacts than that inflicted in 1940 during the retreat at Dunkirk; back then it took a few years of solid graft to get the forces back into some sort of fighting shape. This time, it will take a generation or more. Assuming that we do ever recover.
Congratulations Tony, George et al - if Adolf were still around, he'd be sending a big box of Iron Crosses to Downing St & MOD.
I have no doubts in my own mind that the devestation being wreaked at the moment will have much further reaching impacts than that inflicted in 1940 during the retreat at Dunkirk; back then it took a few years of solid graft to get the forces back into some sort of fighting shape. This time, it will take a generation or more. Assuming that we do ever recover.
Congratulations Tony, George et al - if Adolf were still around, he'd be sending a big box of Iron Crosses to Downing St & MOD.
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just wonder if this has anything to do with Gordon Brown. Blair is desperately seeking a legacy in the ME, when we all know his legacy is that illegal war. Which brings us to Gordon, is he trying to sort out his final act as Chancellor, to decimate the Armed Forces he so clearly dislikes? Can't wait for him to takeover as PM.....
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This was brought up in briefings about 6 months ago as part of another new directive/strategy. It is generally known that there are massive cuts ahead for the RN, particularly when it comes to the shore support areas. Civilianisation is the way ahead as far as they are concerned.
It's not a complete freeze, it's a "reduction". There will still be promotions to cover wastage, but that's not really much of a boost to the poor buggers waiting to move upwards.
It's not strictly constructive dismissal, as promotion is not a "given". No company guarantees you promotion, it's all still based on selection to meet the requirments. ARRSE tends to go off on these "sue them/hit them/kill them" rants on a regular basis without really knowing the background. There are a couple of quite clever legalese people on their, but they don't come out to play very often, mainly because they tend to end up winding people up with their attitudes. A shame, because ARRSE would benefit from a steadying legal hand at times.
Anyway, there will be cuts. The Civil Service went through it, and now the Headquarters staffs will be put to the sword of cost-cutting as well. Be aware that during the briefings it was intimated that the dark blue were not the only ones about to take cuts (I have forgotten the figures), this has only come out as an RN story because of the Galaxy publication. You might want to dig upwards (or sidewards) to get the information as it will be relating to you!
It's not a complete freeze, it's a "reduction". There will still be promotions to cover wastage, but that's not really much of a boost to the poor buggers waiting to move upwards.
It's not strictly constructive dismissal, as promotion is not a "given". No company guarantees you promotion, it's all still based on selection to meet the requirments. ARRSE tends to go off on these "sue them/hit them/kill them" rants on a regular basis without really knowing the background. There are a couple of quite clever legalese people on their, but they don't come out to play very often, mainly because they tend to end up winding people up with their attitudes. A shame, because ARRSE would benefit from a steadying legal hand at times.
Anyway, there will be cuts. The Civil Service went through it, and now the Headquarters staffs will be put to the sword of cost-cutting as well. Be aware that during the briefings it was intimated that the dark blue were not the only ones about to take cuts (I have forgotten the figures), this has only come out as an RN story because of the Galaxy publication. You might want to dig upwards (or sidewards) to get the information as it will be relating to you!
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I think that cuts are in order - particularly in the 'tail'. Last time i looked we had approximately 50 commands, DD/FF/NAS, which could and should be filled by a Commander. At the same time we had 900 commanders. Doesn't add up to me. Can't really see why we need more than one admiral and one dockyard for 35,000 people and 45 surface ships.
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Link to article:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../06/navy06.xml
Not sure what the current position is in the RN. Whilst the RAF has always (AFAIK) promoted to Sqn Ldr (Lt Cdr/Maj) competitively, my understanding is that some elements of the other Services have promoted to this rank automatically based on time served.
STH
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.../06/navy06.xml
Not sure what the current position is in the RN. Whilst the RAF has always (AFAIK) promoted to Sqn Ldr (Lt Cdr/Maj) competitively, my understanding is that some elements of the other Services have promoted to this rank automatically based on time served.
STH
Promotion in Army/RM/RN is based on merit and selection but it is not the big jump that moving from Flt Lt to Sqn Ldr entails. 95% of people who hang around and put up with the housing long enough will be selected. The next rung up is the big hurdle for Army/RM/RN.
"And will this be mirrored in a similar freeze on promotions for the myriad civilian pen pushers and trouser- seat polishers who lurk gollum-like in the MoD?"
Sorry to prevent someone else enjoying a rant at the CS, but the answer is a resounding YES. Obviously its difficult to directly compare the 2 systems, because of differing recruitment practise. Suffice to say that there is a general freeze on creation of new posts, and its actually very difficult to authorise advertising for replacements - many posts are now gapped. There is still some promotion / recruitment for attrition, but far less than you'd think.
Sorry to prevent someone else enjoying a rant at the CS, but the answer is a resounding YES. Obviously its difficult to directly compare the 2 systems, because of differing recruitment practise. Suffice to say that there is a general freeze on creation of new posts, and its actually very difficult to authorise advertising for replacements - many posts are now gapped. There is still some promotion / recruitment for attrition, but far less than you'd think.
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BL - only if they joined before the introduction of the 3TC and if GL; they would therefore be on reserved rights (ie all Lt GL promoted to Lt Cdr at 8 years seniority - even if completly useless). Post FTC all promotion is by merit - a far better system IMHO.
There is not a freeze on promotion, just a reduction to address a perceived imbalance - whether the consequences will be as severe as the recruiting reduction 10-12 years ago (now leading to a black hole in certain levels of Lt seniority) we wll have to see.
IMO it might (stress just might) force out some of the dead wood who are hanging around for a juicy pension. This will be good for the service as a whole. Agree the aforementioned literary ex Lt is outspoken however his book contains some interesting stuff about the way Defence is run.
Why not just add 1p to income tax, use this additional revenue to give this country a Navy, Army and Air Force to be proud of, well equipped with well paid, well housed, well looked after therefore motivated people. As someone mentioned in the ToryGraph today the Government should think about focussing on its primary purpose - The Nation's defence. Getting involved overseas is another argument however I guess if we want to hold onto the seat on the UN Security Council maybe we need to, maybe we dont ........
Soon there will be nothing left, just as potential adversaries overseas reach their zenith - then we will be in the poo.
Oggin
There is not a freeze on promotion, just a reduction to address a perceived imbalance - whether the consequences will be as severe as the recruiting reduction 10-12 years ago (now leading to a black hole in certain levels of Lt seniority) we wll have to see.
IMO it might (stress just might) force out some of the dead wood who are hanging around for a juicy pension. This will be good for the service as a whole. Agree the aforementioned literary ex Lt is outspoken however his book contains some interesting stuff about the way Defence is run.
Why not just add 1p to income tax, use this additional revenue to give this country a Navy, Army and Air Force to be proud of, well equipped with well paid, well housed, well looked after therefore motivated people. As someone mentioned in the ToryGraph today the Government should think about focussing on its primary purpose - The Nation's defence. Getting involved overseas is another argument however I guess if we want to hold onto the seat on the UN Security Council maybe we need to, maybe we dont ........
Soon there will be nothing left, just as potential adversaries overseas reach their zenith - then we will be in the poo.
Oggin
