Does Cpl Clegg get exonerated now?
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Does Cpl Clegg get exonerated now?
Given the news that NO individuals will face charges over the shooting of an innocent man at Stockwell Underground Station; is it not time that Cpl Clegg of the Parachute Regt is formally exonerated for carrying out his duty at a VCP in N Ireland?
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Surely Cpl Clegg,s conviction was quashed and he was prommoted to full Cpl. I think you would be bettter putting this on ARRSE.
More of an army thing this one........................
More of an army thing this one........................
Perhaps it is of interest to military aviators because of the wider implications: the flurry of law suits against military folk just trying to do their jobs in very trying circumstances?
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An absolute shambles. The Police cocked it up from start to finish and the idiots with the guns lost control IMHO. SEVEN bullets? Not only should there be charges but some of those in so called charge should be sacked as well.
British Police Service, what a joke.
British Police Service, what a joke.
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Easy sat here chatting about it, isn't it? Not quite so easy when your comms is rubbish and you are having to decide whether or not someone is going to blow up a train load of people is it?
As for 7 bullets, how many would you use if you had to make absolutely sure the bloke was dead and couldn't operate any devices?
My thoughts are with the family, but also with the plods that did the deed, it was not their decision, but it will live with them for ever...
As for 7 bullets, how many would you use if you had to make absolutely sure the bloke was dead and couldn't operate any devices?
My thoughts are with the family, but also with the plods that did the deed, it was not their decision, but it will live with them for ever...
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A suicide bomber with no bag/backpack, bulky clothes etc. The mistake was made and compounded way before the comms went.
7 bullets is a total loss of self control, period. Go to jail, do not pass go.
My thoughts are with the family as well. I hope they hound the police through every Civil court in the land.
7 bullets is a total loss of self control, period. Go to jail, do not pass go.
My thoughts are with the family as well. I hope they hound the police through every Civil court in the land.
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Think I would be fairly hyped up if I was standing next to someone that I thought might blow me up any second. I'll give the shooter the benefit, but someone needs sacking higher up...
Yes, the Police have an unenviable job to do, sometimes under enormous pressure. But, when a private soldier shoots a man at a check point in Iraq he has an army of human rights lawyers hounding him into court. The police have chosen to operate a shoot to kill policy, there was, it seems, reasonable doubt that the man was a terrorist, the comms equipment was bad, the training sounds inadequate, there was doubt amongst those there that he was a suspect and yet, they allowed him to enter a train deep underground where their comms were of no use and pumped 7 bullets into his head. He was innocent. Someone should be held to account. Whitewash.
Nunc est bibendum
Originally Posted by BellEndBob
7 bullets is a total loss of self control, period. Go to jail, do not pass go.
.
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Gotta love the Monday morning coaches!
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Cpl Clegg opened fire when a stolen vehicle crashed through the VCP at high speed injuring some of the soldiers. If he wasn't supposed to open fire then what on earth was the purpose of that, or any other, VCP? As it turned out the occupants were young "joyriders". It was the same CPS that prosecuted him that has decided against prosecutions in this case.
Consistancy?
Consistancy?
So Keg, are you advocating a shoot to kill policy for anyone suspected of being a druggie? Or maybe anyone who looks vaguely Islamic?
That's not the England I signed up to protect and it's not the England that I want to live in.
That's not the England I signed up to protect and it's not the England that I want to live in.
Nunc est bibendum
Geez Max, talk about taking comments out of context. One contributor says that seven bullets is excessive in order to render someone no longer a danger. I'm saying that seven bullets may be absolutely necessary.
I am NOT commenting on the decision making process that goes through a cops mind when deciding whether or not to use deadly force. I am NOT commenting on any other decisions that were made that day. I AM commenting on the fact that once that decision has been made to stop someone (using that deadly force) then nothing is 'excessive'. You keep going until the threat is stopped- or at least that was what I was taught many years ago during my weapons training. The ONLY point I was making is that people can come back from a couple of shots to the head.
Anything else you'd like to take out of context?
I am NOT commenting on the decision making process that goes through a cops mind when deciding whether or not to use deadly force. I am NOT commenting on any other decisions that were made that day. I AM commenting on the fact that once that decision has been made to stop someone (using that deadly force) then nothing is 'excessive'. You keep going until the threat is stopped- or at least that was what I was taught many years ago during my weapons training. The ONLY point I was making is that people can come back from a couple of shots to the head.
Anything else you'd like to take out of context?
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CPS - "Why did you fire 7 rounds into the suspect?"
Copper - "Because my pistol jammed".
It does seem strange when troops who served in Iraq have their identities splashed across the press and are hounded by the CPS over an alleged murder that had no body, no witnesses and no motive whereas a few coppers who definately need to read up the white card ROE's 'get away' with the cold-blooded murder of an innocent by-stander in a London tube station.
No I wasn't there at the tube station but I've been on top cover in Iraq a in a couple of hairy situations where the first concern that popped into my head was "will I be dragged over the coals if I have to use my weapon here?"
Copper - "Because my pistol jammed".
It does seem strange when troops who served in Iraq have their identities splashed across the press and are hounded by the CPS over an alleged murder that had no body, no witnesses and no motive whereas a few coppers who definately need to read up the white card ROE's 'get away' with the cold-blooded murder of an innocent by-stander in a London tube station.
No I wasn't there at the tube station but I've been on top cover in Iraq a in a couple of hairy situations where the first concern that popped into my head was "will I be dragged over the coals if I have to use my weapon here?"
Jean Charles de Menezes may not have been the terrorist that the police believed he was, but if he had not been an ILLEGAL OCCUPANT of the UK, and had gone home when his 6 month visit Visa had expired, he would still be alive.
Maybe, he was unlucky, but he was still a criminal.
Thankfully, I wasn't in the same position as the cops who had to make the (Right) decision, with no possibly no chance of making a second decision if it had gone wrong.
The sooner the UK gets tough on Terrorists and other criminals the better.
The current state of the Law in the UK is, IMHO, not worth defending.
And the answer to the original question, Lee Clegg should be totally exonerated and, like many criminals, be given a handsome payout by HMG.
Maybe, he was unlucky, but he was still a criminal.
Thankfully, I wasn't in the same position as the cops who had to make the (Right) decision, with no possibly no chance of making a second decision if it had gone wrong.
The sooner the UK gets tough on Terrorists and other criminals the better.
The current state of the
Law in the UK is, IMHO, not worth defending.And the answer to the original question, Lee Clegg should be totally exonerated and, like many criminals, be given a handsome payout by HMG.
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Originally Posted by ZH875
Jean Charles de Menezes may not have been the terrorist that the police believed he was, but if he had not been an ILLEGAL OCCUPANT of the UK, and had gone home when his 6 month visit Visa had expired, he would still be alive.
Maybe, he was unlucky, but he was still a criminal.
Thankfully, I wasn't in the same position as the cops who had to make the (Right) decision, with no possibly no chance of making a second decision if it had gone wrong.
The sooner the UK gets tough on Terrorists and other criminals the better.
The current state of the Law in the UK is, IMHO, not worth defending.
Maybe, he was unlucky, but he was still a criminal.
Thankfully, I wasn't in the same position as the cops who had to make the (Right) decision, with no possibly no chance of making a second decision if it had gone wrong.
The sooner the UK gets tough on Terrorists and other criminals the better.
The current state of the
Law in the UK is, IMHO, not worth defending.Hmmm, Judge Dredd will soon be upon us....
Originally Posted by The Helpful Stacker
So being shot dead is a fitting punishment for over-staying your student visa?
Hmmm, Judge Dredd will soon be upon us....
Hmmm, Judge Dredd will soon be upon us....
Maybe we can start ethnic cleansing, by getting rid of rogue asylum seekers and
Muppets at the same time.