Define 'Fun'.....
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Join Date: Oct 2000
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Define 'Fun'.....
Rumour has it that at a meeting of various Top Neddies, a very senior Neddy asked those present why their troops might be dissatisfied with their lot. On receipt of the answer "It's because there's no fun in the job any more" the VSN asked those present to "define fun"!.........
Any takers out there??
Any takers out there??
What a tit that VSN must be...
How to identify fun? Easy - get someone to describe every aspect of RAF life 20 years ago (NATO exchanges, RAFG, UAS summer camps, few contractors, truckie night stops, no $odding desert camping, no fitness tests, no IDT, IRT meant Instrument Rating Test, aircraft 20 years younger, life not ruled by big brother computers, almost enough people to do the job, etc etc) with the way it is today. Then write down what has been changed:
1. The good bits which have gone;
2. The $hit which has been added;
3. The Aeroplane/Star ratio;
4. Average age of aeroplanes;
5. Number of UK RAF bases;
6. Number of overseas bases
(€50 per working hour would be my consultancy fee - plus Business Class travel, 3 star hotac, €0.40 per km to use my own car.)
How to identify fun? Easy - get someone to describe every aspect of RAF life 20 years ago (NATO exchanges, RAFG, UAS summer camps, few contractors, truckie night stops, no $odding desert camping, no fitness tests, no IDT, IRT meant Instrument Rating Test, aircraft 20 years younger, life not ruled by big brother computers, almost enough people to do the job, etc etc) with the way it is today. Then write down what has been changed:
1. The good bits which have gone;
2. The $hit which has been added;
3. The Aeroplane/Star ratio;
4. Average age of aeroplanes;
5. Number of UK RAF bases;
6. Number of overseas bases
(€50 per working hour would be my consultancy fee - plus Business Class travel, 3 star hotac, €0.40 per km to use my own car.)
Join Date: Aug 2003
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I'd say welcome to the real world many industries have been like this for years, "fun" and "jobs for life" in the armed forces, emergency services, local councils, and BT etc. are only recently getting to grips with real world economics 
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If getting to grips with real world economics means that fun is not allowed then there is no hope for the world, in or out of the services. 1984 seems to rear its ugly head or a world taken over by the bean counters. Surely the best way to retain the quality of life and therefore your best people who will then give you the best return is to allow for the fun factor. Yes there is a cost but a much smaller cost than the replacement cost of those that leave.
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Boswell
I couldn't give a to$$ over civvie employment conditions, etc. Service personnel are expected to go into serious danger some times during their career, whereas civvies, generally, are not. The "fun" is what the country gives back to the young men and women who sign up to serve it.
Free Man, Not a Number
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Surely DP Harvey it is no surprise to you, that in the armed forces you have to put yourself in harms way?
And surely "fun" is what you make of it? If life is not giving you some fun, then I've understood you have two choices.
1. Work on life to give you the fun - i.e. make it happen
2. Work on yourself to accept that what is given is fun
And surely "fun" is what you make of it? If life is not giving you some fun, then I've understood you have two choices.
1. Work on life to give you the fun - i.e. make it happen
2. Work on yourself to accept that what is given is fun
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Being in the FAA is fun. Why ?
Well you get to fly some fab aircraft. Fly with some fantastic people. Sail around the world and visit interesting and exotic places. Get free health care, dental care. Free Sports and recreation. Bloomin good wage. Cheap accom. Good management (thats going to get a few replies but I'll explain later)
Good allowances (getting petrol money to go to work is a good perk). Cheap beer in the bar. and thats just a few examples of fun.
* Good management. I base this on the principle thsat I believe our leaders and mentors care about us. We have access to the highest level if required. We can complain, we can e-Mail or even telephone our leaders. Regularly we are asked our opinions on how our company does business. There are web sites explaining rules and even web sites which will explain to us the allowances and benefits we can claim for.
However, my friend has worked for Avon (the cosmetics people) for the past 3 years and has only met her boss once. She has no allowances, no access to management and looks on my pay and allowances with envy. She has no cnances of promotion without moving 200 miles and little chance of a pay increase beyond the annual 2%.
You need to remember that her company is larger and employs more people than the RN and the Army combined.
So, thats my arguement. Masny people don't enjoy service life and thats fine, they can move on. But for those of you contemplating a career in the Armed Forces then I would encourage you to join. (particularly if you fancy having a flying career)
VVHA
Well you get to fly some fab aircraft. Fly with some fantastic people. Sail around the world and visit interesting and exotic places. Get free health care, dental care. Free Sports and recreation. Bloomin good wage. Cheap accom. Good management (thats going to get a few replies but I'll explain later)
Good allowances (getting petrol money to go to work is a good perk). Cheap beer in the bar. and thats just a few examples of fun.
* Good management. I base this on the principle thsat I believe our leaders and mentors care about us. We have access to the highest level if required. We can complain, we can e-Mail or even telephone our leaders. Regularly we are asked our opinions on how our company does business. There are web sites explaining rules and even web sites which will explain to us the allowances and benefits we can claim for.
However, my friend has worked for Avon (the cosmetics people) for the past 3 years and has only met her boss once. She has no allowances, no access to management and looks on my pay and allowances with envy. She has no cnances of promotion without moving 200 miles and little chance of a pay increase beyond the annual 2%.
You need to remember that her company is larger and employs more people than the RN and the Army combined.
So, thats my arguement. Masny people don't enjoy service life and thats fine, they can move on. But for those of you contemplating a career in the Armed Forces then I would encourage you to join. (particularly if you fancy having a flying career)
VVHA
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Ah, the cut-out-and-keep vecvec/southside/hyd3fail standard reply. I must remember to join the vast queue of people transferring to the RN. ... or was it the other way round?
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Service personnel are expected to go into serious danger some times during their career, whereas civvies, generally, are not.
...that is if your own management doesn't stab you in the back first
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Let's see:
**** job with long dets and having to uproot the family practically every three years for around £30,000 (or considerably less) a year.
Or, **** job with long hours but no dets, no evil uproot for £50,000 (if youre lucky) a year.
And they have to ask why people are going in search of greener grass?
**** job with long dets and having to uproot the family practically every three years for around £30,000 (or considerably less) a year.
Or, **** job with long hours but no dets, no evil uproot for £50,000 (if youre lucky) a year.
And they have to ask why people are going in search of greener grass?
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But that'd be a flying career limited to flying helicopters off little grey ships....
Never quite knowing where the airfield is going to be when you get back to it. Always a tadge nervous, pucker factor increased, night, choppy sea, FDO is brand new, OOW turns the ship as you start your approach.....
Brilliant
No doubt the pucker factor comes from wondering whether the bit of ancient garage door maker's clattering assemblage of scrap iron will hold together long enough until the TACAN reads zero?
Have they retired Roger Waitout from HM's Grey Funnel Line yet? Always seemed to be at the other end of the wireless when we were doing those $odding awful JMC exercises which involved geting airbrone at oh-dark-whenever to stooge round in circles for hours whilst Roger Waitout and his cronies bouncing about on the briny dreamed up ever more pointless and innovative ways of defining frequency changes. Always had visions of some matelot cutting off to pusser's locker for a new crystal for the war canoe's transmitter every time a new frequency was ordered.
Have they retired Roger Waitout from HM's Grey Funnel Line yet? Always seemed to be at the other end of the wireless when we were doing those $odding awful JMC exercises which involved geting airbrone at oh-dark-whenever to stooge round in circles for hours whilst Roger Waitout and his cronies bouncing about on the briny dreamed up ever more pointless and innovative ways of defining frequency changes. Always had visions of some matelot cutting off to pusser's locker for a new crystal for the war canoe's transmitter every time a new frequency was ordered.
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Re: Define 'Fun'.....
[QUOTE=BEagle]
Have they retired Roger Waitout from HM's Grey Funnel Line yet?
Always used Roger Waitout when Norman Nimrod turned up hoping he would eventually take the hint and go away!!
E-D
Have they retired Roger Waitout from HM's Grey Funnel Line yet?
Always used Roger Waitout when Norman Nimrod turned up hoping he would eventually take the hint and go away!!
E-D
Re: Define 'Fun'.....
Fun, I remember thatIt was part of the job!
It included having the chance to fully partake in Sports, adventurous training, and all that other stuff the told you about when you were joining up(btw. which trip in the ten was my air experience flight?
).It included going to places other than those where all you can see is sand/barren rocky outcrops.
You got to see cities like Berlin,Las Vegas and a wealth of other smaller towns that you'd never visit otherwise and it wouldn't cost an arm and a leg (sometimes
).If you were having a laugh at work, it was assumed that your morale was good, not that you were goofing off.
It was the ability to learn from the old sweats in the crewroom during a game of uckers or bridge (have you even seen a four-for in the past couple of years?).
Apparently there is fun out there but it's now a V&A item and as such strictly controlled