VC for Iraq
Alba Gu Brath
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Merseyside
Age: 55
Posts: 738
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The debate about saluting the VC holder is also taking place on the Army Rumour website. It has been claimed on there that it is a myth that began with Monty during WWII. It was his personal opinion that VC holders hould be saluted fo their bravery and, when presenting the medal, he would immediately shake the recipients right hand to prevent said person from saluting.
Anybody in possesion of further information? IMHO Monty had it right!
Anybody in possesion of further information? IMHO Monty had it right!
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Middle East
Posts: 78
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Salute
From what I understand, a Congressional Medal of Honour holder is saluted by everyone from Chairman of the the Joint Chiefs down. I am unaware of such a protocol existing in the UK Armed Forces....which is a shame, to be honest.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pte Beharry fully deserves his VC, and his courage, coolness under fire and subequent modesty is an inspiration.
The next thought may be controversial but here goes.The context in which the Medal was won is surely rather unfortunate,. If I read the citation right, six Warriors carrying the world's most professional troops were routed and put to flight by a gang of insurgent miltia equipped with 40-year old weaponry. It seems as if driving armour through built-up areas is just not practical while RPG-7's are so plentiful.( I wonder, had the CO not been incapacited, if the troops would have been able to dismount and counter-attack, or would they have had to get out fast, as happened?) How many VC's have been won in the context of a retreat? I hasten to add that none of this takes anything from Beharry's conduct, especially pulling men from his burning vehicle while hurt and under fire.
The next thought may be controversial but here goes.The context in which the Medal was won is surely rather unfortunate,. If I read the citation right, six Warriors carrying the world's most professional troops were routed and put to flight by a gang of insurgent miltia equipped with 40-year old weaponry. It seems as if driving armour through built-up areas is just not practical while RPG-7's are so plentiful.( I wonder, had the CO not been incapacited, if the troops would have been able to dismount and counter-attack, or would they have had to get out fast, as happened?) How many VC's have been won in the context of a retreat? I hasten to add that none of this takes anything from Beharry's conduct, especially pulling men from his burning vehicle while hurt and under fire.
gravity victim,
Try watching the film "Blackhawk down."
Try watching the film "Blackhawk down."
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Good points, duly taken. I have the films of both A Bridge Too Far and Blackhawk Down (and have read a good history of Rourke's Drif) - and appreciate that courage and sacrifice are undiminished by the background situation. I guess that it just seemed to me very sad and wrong that superbly trained and well-equipped troops found themselves so wrong-footed by a murderous rabble in trackie bottoms and flipflops. But then there was Vietnam.....
gravity victim,
Read the words of the Cpl quoted earlier on the site, he describes a dismounted bayonet charge and what he did to the insurgents when he got there, not pleasant stuff but I was rather struck by the guys claim that the insurgents were so shocked, they expected them to trade shots at a distance as you see so many of these clowns in the Middle East do on the TV news, they were NOT expecting a full blown flnking manouvre followed by a bayonet charge!
As for superbly equipped and well trained troops, as the same equally well trained guys found in the Falklands, and the US in Somalia, it matters not a jot what your opponent wears or looks like, he may look like the ultimate Chavscum and have the tactical awareness of a hedgehog, but if he has a gun and he hits you, you die.
Read the words of the Cpl quoted earlier on the site, he describes a dismounted bayonet charge and what he did to the insurgents when he got there, not pleasant stuff but I was rather struck by the guys claim that the insurgents were so shocked, they expected them to trade shots at a distance as you see so many of these clowns in the Middle East do on the TV news, they were NOT expecting a full blown flnking manouvre followed by a bayonet charge!
As for superbly equipped and well trained troops, as the same equally well trained guys found in the Falklands, and the US in Somalia, it matters not a jot what your opponent wears or looks like, he may look like the ultimate Chavscum and have the tactical awareness of a hedgehog, but if he has a gun and he hits you, you die.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: England
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Operational Honours List
At a recent seminar, I met one of the recipients of the DSO, who is on the same honours list as the VC chappie. He is an International Relations student at Cambridge at the moment and a fine party animal. He has a good turn of phrase and since the annoucement of the award, academics and fellow students have been very quick to praise him. A foreign student who is critical of US and UK involvment in Iraq (I am, but generally keep it to myself) was roundly condemned for a vicious diatribe against the military that he launched on the cam.ac system.
Observers, and ppruners in particular, still view universities as a hotbed of anti-military attitudes. In my exposure here, and at other academic institutions, I have found it to be a rare opinion indeed.
CC
Observers, and ppruners in particular, still view universities as a hotbed of anti-military attitudes. In my exposure here, and at other academic institutions, I have found it to be a rare opinion indeed.
CC
In keeping with appreciating our heroes....
Here is a link to a multi-media account of the action that led to the US Army awarding the Congressional Medal of Honor to SFC Paul Ray Smith for combat action in Iraq. SFC Smith represents the wonderful NCO's that are the backbone of every good army.
http://www.army.mil/medalofhonor/battlescape/index.html
http://www.army.mil/medalofhonor/battlescape/index.html
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 171
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Citation for Sgt Smith's CMOH
Sgt. 1st Class Paul Ray Smith will receive the Medal of Honor posthumously during a White House ceremony April 4, 2005. The official citation will be made available after the White House Presentation.
Baghdad Airport, April 4, 2003.
On April 4, 2003, the 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, attacked to seize Objective Lions, the Baghdad International Airport. As part of the Brigade scheme of maneuver, Task Force 2-7 Infantry was tasked to establish a blocking position against a brigade-sized counterattack on the main entrance to the airfield. Task Force 2-7 had been fighting for three consecutive days and had moved through the night before reaching the blocking position. Morale was high, but Soldiers were experiencing fatigue. B Company, 3rd Battalion, 69th Armored Regiment (Knight) was in the east-most position oriented along the main avenue of approach ready for the main enemy counterattack. A Company, 2nd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment (Rage) was attacking to the southeast of the Highway.
The main entrance to the airfield was a four-lane highway with a median to separate incoming and outgoing traffic. Large masonry walls with towers approximately 100 meters apart bound the highway. On the morning of April 4, 2003, more than 100 soldiers from the Task Force 2-7 Forward Aid Station, mortars, scouts and portions of B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion were in the median behind the forward most blocking positions. The B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion 2nd Platoon Leader was on a reconnaissance mission with the B Company, Task Force 2-7 Infantry Commander. During his absence, 2nd Platoon received the mission to construct an Enemy Prisoner of War holding area. Sgt. 1st Class Smith was in charge of 2nd Platoon.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith assessed the best location to be behind the masonry wall bounding the highway. Two guard towers along the wall were ideally situated to provide overwatch to the holding area. An M9 armored combat earthmover (ACE) knocked a hole in the wall to create an opening to a large courtyard with a louvered metal gate on the north side. With the help of a squad leader and team leader, Sgt. 1st Class Smith checked the far side of the courtyard for enemy, found none, and posted two guards. From the guard post at the gate small groupings of buildings were 100-200 meters to the northeast. To the northwest, a large white building with a white dome was visible. The location seemed perfect as the courtyard was along the northern flank of the blocking position and enemy actions to this point were mostly from the east.
While an engineer squad began to clear debris in the courtyard, one of the guards saw 10-15 enemy soldiers with small arms, 60mm mortars, and rocket-propelled grenades (RPG). These were the lead elements of an organized company-sized force making a deliberate attack on the flank of Task Force 2-7. Sgt. 1st Class Smith came to the position and identified 25-50 more soldiers moving into prepared fighting positions. Sgt. 1st Class Smith instructed a squad leader to get a nearby Bradley Fighting Vehicle for support. While waiting for the Bradley, Sgt. 1st Class Smith had members of 2nd platoon retrieve AT-4 weapons and form a skirmish line outside the gate. By this time, the number of enemy identified rose to 100 soldiers, now a confirmed company-sized attack. Three of B Company’s M113A3 armored personnel carriers (APC) oriented .50-cal. machineguns toward the opening in the wall and the surrounding guard towers, now occupied by enemy soldiers.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions to organize a defense against the deliberate attack were not only effective, but inspired the B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion Soldiers. He then began to lead by example. As the Bradley arrived on site and moved through the hole in the wall toward the gate, Sgt. 1st Class Smith ran to the gate wall and threw a fragmentation grenade at the enemy. He then took two Soldiers forward to join the guards and directed their engagement of the enemy with small arms. The enemy continued to fire rifles, RPGs, and 60mm mortars at the Soldiers on the street and within the courtyard. Enemy soldiers began moving along the buildings on the north side of the clearing to get into position to climb into the towers. Sgt. 1st Class Smith called for an APC to move forward to provide additional fire support. Sgt. 1st Class Smith then fired an AT-4 at the enemy while directing his fire team assembled near the front line of the engagement area.
Running low on ammunition and having taken RPG hits, the Bradley withdrew to reload. The lead APC in the area received a direct hit from a mortar, wounding the three occupants. The enemy attack was at its strongest point and every action counted. Not only were the wounded Soldiers threatened but also more than 100 Soldiers from B Company, the Task Force Aid Station, and the Mortar Platoon were at risk.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith ordered one of his Soldiers to back the damaged APC back into the courtyard after the wounded men had been evacuated. Knowing the APC ’s .50-Cal. machinegun was the largest weapon between the enemy and the friendly position, Sgt. 1st Class Smith immediately assumed the track commander’s position behind the weapon, and told a soldier who accompanied him to “feed me ammunition whenever you hear the gun get quiet.” Sgt. 1st Class Smith fired on the advancing enemy from the unprotected position atop the APC and expended at least three boxes of ammunition before being mortally wounded by enemy fire. The enemy attack was defeated. Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions saved the lives of at least 100 Soldiers, caused the failure of a deliberate enemy attack hours after 1st Brigade seized the Baghdad Airport, and resulted in an estimated 20-50 enemy soldiers killed. His actions inspired his platoon, his Company, the 11th Engineer Battalion and Task Force 2-7 Infantry.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions to lead Soldiers in direct contact with a numerically superior enemy--to personally engage the enemy with a fragmentation grenade, AT-4, and individual weapon, to ultimately assume the track commander’s position to fire the .50-Cal. machinegun through at least three boxes of ammunition before being mortally wounded--demonstrates conspicuous gallantry above and beyond the call of duty. His actions prevented a penetration in the Task Force 2-7 sector, defended the aid station, mortars, and scouts, and allowed the evacuation of Soldiers wounded by indirect enemy fire.
Baghdad Airport, April 4, 2003.
On April 4, 2003, the 1st Brigade Combat Team, 3rd Infantry Division, attacked to seize Objective Lions, the Baghdad International Airport. As part of the Brigade scheme of maneuver, Task Force 2-7 Infantry was tasked to establish a blocking position against a brigade-sized counterattack on the main entrance to the airfield. Task Force 2-7 had been fighting for three consecutive days and had moved through the night before reaching the blocking position. Morale was high, but Soldiers were experiencing fatigue. B Company, 3rd Battalion, 69th Armored Regiment (Knight) was in the east-most position oriented along the main avenue of approach ready for the main enemy counterattack. A Company, 2nd Battalion, 7th Infantry Regiment (Rage) was attacking to the southeast of the Highway.
The main entrance to the airfield was a four-lane highway with a median to separate incoming and outgoing traffic. Large masonry walls with towers approximately 100 meters apart bound the highway. On the morning of April 4, 2003, more than 100 soldiers from the Task Force 2-7 Forward Aid Station, mortars, scouts and portions of B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion were in the median behind the forward most blocking positions. The B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion 2nd Platoon Leader was on a reconnaissance mission with the B Company, Task Force 2-7 Infantry Commander. During his absence, 2nd Platoon received the mission to construct an Enemy Prisoner of War holding area. Sgt. 1st Class Smith was in charge of 2nd Platoon.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith assessed the best location to be behind the masonry wall bounding the highway. Two guard towers along the wall were ideally situated to provide overwatch to the holding area. An M9 armored combat earthmover (ACE) knocked a hole in the wall to create an opening to a large courtyard with a louvered metal gate on the north side. With the help of a squad leader and team leader, Sgt. 1st Class Smith checked the far side of the courtyard for enemy, found none, and posted two guards. From the guard post at the gate small groupings of buildings were 100-200 meters to the northeast. To the northwest, a large white building with a white dome was visible. The location seemed perfect as the courtyard was along the northern flank of the blocking position and enemy actions to this point were mostly from the east.
While an engineer squad began to clear debris in the courtyard, one of the guards saw 10-15 enemy soldiers with small arms, 60mm mortars, and rocket-propelled grenades (RPG). These were the lead elements of an organized company-sized force making a deliberate attack on the flank of Task Force 2-7. Sgt. 1st Class Smith came to the position and identified 25-50 more soldiers moving into prepared fighting positions. Sgt. 1st Class Smith instructed a squad leader to get a nearby Bradley Fighting Vehicle for support. While waiting for the Bradley, Sgt. 1st Class Smith had members of 2nd platoon retrieve AT-4 weapons and form a skirmish line outside the gate. By this time, the number of enemy identified rose to 100 soldiers, now a confirmed company-sized attack. Three of B Company’s M113A3 armored personnel carriers (APC) oriented .50-cal. machineguns toward the opening in the wall and the surrounding guard towers, now occupied by enemy soldiers.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions to organize a defense against the deliberate attack were not only effective, but inspired the B Company, 11th Engineer Battalion Soldiers. He then began to lead by example. As the Bradley arrived on site and moved through the hole in the wall toward the gate, Sgt. 1st Class Smith ran to the gate wall and threw a fragmentation grenade at the enemy. He then took two Soldiers forward to join the guards and directed their engagement of the enemy with small arms. The enemy continued to fire rifles, RPGs, and 60mm mortars at the Soldiers on the street and within the courtyard. Enemy soldiers began moving along the buildings on the north side of the clearing to get into position to climb into the towers. Sgt. 1st Class Smith called for an APC to move forward to provide additional fire support. Sgt. 1st Class Smith then fired an AT-4 at the enemy while directing his fire team assembled near the front line of the engagement area.
Running low on ammunition and having taken RPG hits, the Bradley withdrew to reload. The lead APC in the area received a direct hit from a mortar, wounding the three occupants. The enemy attack was at its strongest point and every action counted. Not only were the wounded Soldiers threatened but also more than 100 Soldiers from B Company, the Task Force Aid Station, and the Mortar Platoon were at risk.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith ordered one of his Soldiers to back the damaged APC back into the courtyard after the wounded men had been evacuated. Knowing the APC ’s .50-Cal. machinegun was the largest weapon between the enemy and the friendly position, Sgt. 1st Class Smith immediately assumed the track commander’s position behind the weapon, and told a soldier who accompanied him to “feed me ammunition whenever you hear the gun get quiet.” Sgt. 1st Class Smith fired on the advancing enemy from the unprotected position atop the APC and expended at least three boxes of ammunition before being mortally wounded by enemy fire. The enemy attack was defeated. Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions saved the lives of at least 100 Soldiers, caused the failure of a deliberate enemy attack hours after 1st Brigade seized the Baghdad Airport, and resulted in an estimated 20-50 enemy soldiers killed. His actions inspired his platoon, his Company, the 11th Engineer Battalion and Task Force 2-7 Infantry.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith’s actions to lead Soldiers in direct contact with a numerically superior enemy--to personally engage the enemy with a fragmentation grenade, AT-4, and individual weapon, to ultimately assume the track commander’s position to fire the .50-Cal. machinegun through at least three boxes of ammunition before being mortally wounded--demonstrates conspicuous gallantry above and beyond the call of duty. His actions prevented a penetration in the Task Force 2-7 sector, defended the aid station, mortars, and scouts, and allowed the evacuation of Soldiers wounded by indirect enemy fire.
Sgt. 1st Class Smith's actions in gaining the CMOH are not too disimilar to that of a certain Audie Murphy some 60 years before, only unlike Audie Murphy he wasn't destined to live to become a Hollywood 'hero' as well.....
