Bush defends service record
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Bush defends service record
Asked why no evidence has been found to show he reported to duty in Alabama during the summer and fall of 1972, Bush said: "There may be no evidence, but I did report. Otherwise, I wouldn't have been honourably discharged... I did show up in Alabama."
Bush said he would "absolutely" authorise the release of any documents relating to his Guard service during that period -- "if we still have them." He said the records are kept in Colorado and have already been "scoured."
Bush acknowledged that he did not volunteer to go to Vietnam. "No, I didn't. You're right," he said.
Pressed on his feelings about that war, Bush said: "The thing about the Vietnam War that troubles me as I look back was it was a political war. We had politicians making military decisions, and it is lessons that any president must learn, and that is to set the goal and the objective and allow the military to come up with the plans to achieve that objective."
Oh my God!
The current "objective" is a little murky to .....????
Bush said he would "absolutely" authorise the release of any documents relating to his Guard service during that period -- "if we still have them." He said the records are kept in Colorado and have already been "scoured."
Bush acknowledged that he did not volunteer to go to Vietnam. "No, I didn't. You're right," he said.
Pressed on his feelings about that war, Bush said: "The thing about the Vietnam War that troubles me as I look back was it was a political war. We had politicians making military decisions, and it is lessons that any president must learn, and that is to set the goal and the objective and allow the military to come up with the plans to achieve that objective."
Oh my God!
The current "objective" is a little murky to .....????
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In the Vietnam war, Johnson's White House was determing bombing targets. There have been a lot of criticism of Bush, but I haven't heard anyone accuse him of micro-managing the war the way Johnson did.
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So what is the goal so worthy of the costs so far?
1. Do not reply WMD
2. Do not reply Terrorist links
3. Do not reply defense of human rights
OK I'm waiting.............?
1. Do not reply WMD
2. Do not reply Terrorist links
3. Do not reply defense of human rights
OK I'm waiting.............?
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He did not get the VD and scar.
But he did get into uniform. Which is more than many.
What was Slick Willi (Bill Clinton) doing whilst military age?
Busy not inhaling, methinks.
But he did get into uniform. Which is more than many.
What was Slick Willi (Bill Clinton) doing whilst military age?
Busy not inhaling, methinks.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
Kerry might be making a big mistake trying to make Vietnam a scoring point between his record and Bush's. He's dragging up the issue of his own record after his return from action, and in veteran's eyes he's tarred with the same brush as Jane Fonda. e.g. Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry. Atlanta Journal. You'll see a lot of this poster in the months to come - 
ISTR that Bush was an F-102 pilot. If so, even if he'd volunteered, would he have been sent out to Vietnam given the relatively small number of F-102s in theatre??
Clinton certainly wasn't busy earning his degree - he left Oxford without completing it...
Clinton certainly wasn't busy earning his degree - he left Oxford without completing it...
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Interesting that in the US the military record still counts for something with the electorate.
I'm not sure what influence it has on the UK electorate.
Is a good one positive or negative?
I'm not sure what influence it has on the UK electorate.
Is a good one positive or negative?
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As far as I can determine there were no F-102s or F-106s in Viet Nam. There were some F-104s and a ton of F-100s and F-105s. Then of course the F-4, lots of them things. That’s for the Air Force that is.
Con, there were a few F-102s.
The 509th FIS, 82nd FIS and 64th FIS flew them. There were about 20 in theatre in 1966. One was lost to a MiG 21 on 3 Feb 68. Last one left in May 1971.
There were, believe it or not, efforts to use the F-102 in the ground attack role...
The 509th FIS, 82nd FIS and 64th FIS flew them. There were about 20 in theatre in 1966. One was lost to a MiG 21 on 3 Feb 68. Last one left in May 1971.
There were, believe it or not, efforts to use the F-102 in the ground attack role...
F-102 in ground attack mode =
1. Launch IR AIM-4s at VC camp fires
2. Use 2.75in FFARs in missile bay door tubes
3. Fit a minigun pod on a TER, hang it on the underwing pylons used normally for fuel tanks.
(3) never advanced beyond a test-fit, but the other two were trialled. According to Air Force Times, 509th FIS destroyed 106 buildings, 16 sampans and one bridge in 199 sorties [source Wings of Fame Vol 17]. It appears from the same source that the pilots were less than convinced that the F-102 was a suitable platform for this role, but the USAF declared that it was!
1. Launch IR AIM-4s at VC camp fires
2. Use 2.75in FFARs in missile bay door tubes
3. Fit a minigun pod on a TER, hang it on the underwing pylons used normally for fuel tanks.
(3) never advanced beyond a test-fit, but the other two were trialled. According to Air Force Times, 509th FIS destroyed 106 buildings, 16 sampans and one bridge in 199 sorties [source Wings of Fame Vol 17]. It appears from the same source that the pilots were less than convinced that the F-102 was a suitable platform for this role, but the USAF declared that it was!
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Con: "Then of course the F-4, lots of them things. That’s for the Air Force that is."
May I recommend the book:
"PHANTOM OVER VIETNAM"
by John Trotti.
He was of the USMC "persuasion". Some of the best description of military flying I've read. (And the Vietnam war of course).
Best regards
May I recommend the book:
"PHANTOM OVER VIETNAM"
by John Trotti.
He was of the USMC "persuasion". Some of the best description of military flying I've read. (And the Vietnam war of course).
Best regards
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I like Vietnam - the Vietnamese are such lovely people - and I wear my Ho Chi Minh T-shirt whenever I get the chance. Back in '69 a bunch of us were once asked by a US GI why UK wasn't in Vietnam and we told him Uncle Ho hadn't asked us for any help yet. We haven't always been puppy dogs you know...
A peasant army that simply wouldn't give in. There's a lesson to be learned from that for all those who think that overwhelming force is the answer to everything.
A peasant army that simply wouldn't give in. There's a lesson to be learned from that for all those who think that overwhelming force is the answer to everything.
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Blacksheep
Yes, nothing beats a little up-manship. One of my colleagues talked to a British pilot during a beer-call in 1982. He was going on about his Falklands experience. At last the other fellow got a word in sideways:
"Ah! Now I understand. You mean the Malvinas!"
They didn't share many beers after that
Best regards
Yes, nothing beats a little up-manship. One of my colleagues talked to a British pilot during a beer-call in 1982. He was going on about his Falklands experience. At last the other fellow got a word in sideways:
"Ah! Now I understand. You mean the Malvinas!"
They didn't share many beers after that
Best regards