New 'holding generation'??

[edsdeadbaby]

yet another rumour.....

apparently there is a possibility of valley taking on 3 saudi arabian courses soon. thought it must be a joke, but i've now heard it from more than one source.

just wanted to know if anyone could confirm or dispel this.

thanks

EDB


P.S nice work apo dried plum, i know who you are!

[brakedwell]

Could be history repeating itself! I lost my Hunter course in 1957 after Duncan Sandes axe resulted in all Chivenor courses being filled by the Indian Air Force. Spent the next 17 years in Transport/Air Support Command and enjoying it thoroughly.

[Phoney Tony]

During the 80s I held for a while it is very sad to see that it still happens to the same degree.

Now older I have seen why there is a problem.

The Strategic Manning Empire, The Recruiters, The Trainers and STC do not interface as they should.

The problem is difficult to ensure we end up with the right number of people at the front line when the lead time is often several years and the numbers who actually make it to the front line is difficult to predict. Delays in MRA4 and TypeHoon do not help. However, if the strategic man power people did their job properly things would get better.

I was at a meeting, not that long ago, where sqns who operate with Flt Engs stated their concerns that the Flt Eng Trg was to cease within months and as far as we all could see the requirment for Flt Engs was going to continue for some time.

The man from PMA said we (Sqn Operators) should raise the problem through our Gp Staffs.

Kind of bottom up I thought!

[MovinWings]

Holding for guys going through training is clearly not good; It saps morale, generally is wasted time and although sometimes enjoyable ...... largely reactive on the part of the RAF, and pointless on the part of the individual.

However, how about those many front line junior pilots, trained and eager to progress onto a 2nd tour, who will be lucky to have a cockpit at all! The potential reduction of the F3 fleet, in conjunction with the early exit of the Jaguar is certainly going to solve any pilot shortage we may have had in the past!

Has anyone out there in pprune-land got some experience / ideas for what to do with all the surplus JO FJ mates about to be wrecking the last few mess bars we have? Some ideas I have heard: Degrees for those who don't have them, Masters for those who do, GCSEs for Jag mates...... JOCC extra courses including ISS if you haven't done it, 'Leadership' deployments with the Army & Navy(They'd love that!).

It is certainly going to be a difficult period over the next couple of years, but please spare a thought for the guys who have 'Made It' but will not be given the chance to develop...... This in my view, is a worse 'crime' than chaps having to hold while in training.

MW

[scientia in alto]

Holding - Just a shame op fresco came a little to early for the new generation, although the boys and girls could be put to good use working out a strategy on

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3498369.stm

Last Tuesday, Argentine President Nestor Kirchner's chief of staff said his country still had a right to the islands.

or just designing a more attractive advert for the RAF instead of the one we have at the moment, Oh S*D it send tham all on Adv. Trg. to the Caribbean

SIA

[seymour faneigh]

overseas holiday?

On hold between BFJT and AFT at the mo...Held with the Army in Germany prior to BFJT,quite a good experience.Not much in the way of work,but cheap beer,cheap cars,lots of opportunity to travel around Europe and, other holders prior to me even made the Gulf and Oman.Also managed to clock up 20hrs+ hawk time!If you do have your "wings" and can find a UAS with a decent boss who will budget a convex you can fly AEF cadets on the tutor.Always nice to keep your hand in.Failing any of those I'll see you on a sailing exped in the caribbean........One way of looking at a hold,you could be getting paid exactly the same and being shot at! Try to enjoy the down time.....

[JNo]

Even with wings I doubt you'd have anywhere near the amount of hours to fly for an AEF (been told you need 1000hrs).

I'm holding at Boscombe for Shawbs and we've now got 6 of us holding here - 3 for Valley. They do get a few trips but there is fairly stiff competition for them. Bit nicer on the Rotes side of things, only holding for 4 months.

[Wholigan]

To fly cadets with an AEF, you need to have held military wings and have a minimum of 500 hours first pilot.

[seymour faneigh]

AEF flying

Apologies for duff advice earlier...Meant to say, you can fly AEF but only if the PAX is 18+.(not a bad thing)! Still a few hours is better than none.

[godsavethequeen]

!

STOP PRESS!!!!
I have been reading this thread with much anticipation, now i have finally had my hold and valley dates finalised!!!!

Wait for it...................

i am holding on a FJ base so its not all bad news except for the fact that my valley course doesnt start till MARCH 05!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hope u guys arn't affected so baddly!!!!!
cheers

[5Uniform]

Who has released your dates?

Mine were finalised until last week when I was told to "...hold until further notice, we will call you up when we want you..."

Great! Although when the question was asked about time scales i was told to ring back in 3 weeks and I would know more.

I asked about AT but I have been informed that if I am out of the country when I am called forward they will just call the next person on the list and I will go to the back of the que!

So, sit and wait doing nothing...until further notice!

[Werty]

AEF flying

See-more-Fanny, I don't know where you got the thing about being able to fly 18+ cadets around. My understanding is that to fly passengers you either have to be AEF qualified (500+ hours 1st pilot) or be a QFI.

Can anyone explain how the holds betwixt Linton and Valley have got so long in such a short space of time? I know of people who finished Linton in early 2003 and didn't hold at all before going to Valley - just took a few weeks holiday and then went straight there. I thought I was hard done by with 3 months. Apparently not....

Chins up boys - It's worth the wait.



Hawk is very very nice..!

[Frogbox]

The batsmans 'Holding ...........

[5 Forward 6 Back]

godsavethequeen, presumably you're on Linton's current senior course then?

Wish someone could write down a list of all the Valley courses currently allocated, who's on them, and when they're due to start.

Why don't react like we did when the Tucanos all broke a few years ago? You can send me training abroad if it gets me moving through the training system a bit faster...

[Werty]

... the Bowler's Willy?

[APO Dried Plum]

Flash,
Had a similar experience, I finally got my joining instructions to refresh a couple of weeks ago. On looking for the 'enclosed refresher timetable' I found a nice sheet of blank A4 white paper. Either someone at Linton's got a sense of humour or they just f!*ked up. Anyway 2 days later I got the 'your course has been cancelled we'll be in touch' letter!!!

5fwd6 back - No chance! I think if anyone had any idea what courses were going on when they would publish something. I get the idea that the guys Innsworth aren't too sure what's going on themselves.

Ah well. Roll on the summer.

Rgds Plum

[5 Forward 6 Back]

Plum,

Ah well. I'm sure I can probably figure out how many people have left Linton recently and aren't yet at Valley... so I'll be able to see them pass through refreshers and work it out myself.

Wish someone would come and tell us just finishing what the hell's going on....!

Where'd you hold? Any good?

[Frogbox]

Well done Werty. Thought I'd inject some humour in this otherwise inane thread.