New RAF Recruitment Ad.
Cunning Artificer
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Aiming at the right target...
QuidProQuo hit the nail on the head. I once used to wonder why anyone would join the RAF to be a mess steward or a storekeeper and believed the service was all about aeroplanes. As I got some time in, I came to realise that it takes all sorts to make an RAF, or an Army or a Navy for that matter, but everyone is important in their own way. Pilots mostly recruit themselves; it's the more mundane jobs that need to be "sold" by the recruiters.
Aircrew ought to know better than most, the importance of aiming at the right target .
**************************
Through difficulties to the cinema
Aircrew ought to know better than most, the importance of aiming at the right target .
**************************
Through difficulties to the cinema
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BEagle, is that the TA advert where the loner is running around in the park with a football? The slogan was "You need the TA"
Every time my friends and I saw it we used to say "I need the TA like a kick up the A
e"
The regular army adverts from a year or two ago were good; the ones that concentrated on a single character who was a communications engineer, or whatever. They looked like they'd been made by someone in the service and not some **** in the city.
Every time my friends and I saw it we used to say "I need the TA like a kick up the A
e"The regular army adverts from a year or two ago were good; the ones that concentrated on a single character who was a communications engineer, or whatever. They looked like they'd been made by someone in the service and not some **** in the city.
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Saw the bl@@dy ****e thing last night.
spent 90% of the time thinking "what is this b@@lox advertising" and the last 10% thinking "what a load of cr@p that was"
Had zero relevance, zero impact, zero attraction and zero message = 100% failure.
Ahh! - I think I've got it. Were trying to recrute more bl@@ding zeros.
Who ever agreed to that as a recruiting ad should PVR immediately and get a job at the f@@king supermarket
Oooh, its nearly enough to make you swear
Didn't some ex-F4 senior bod actually PVR and then do his time on the tills at some shop or other before taking over management of a large retail organisation? Can't recall who/what/when.....
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Ahem Gentlemen,
This ad makes perfect sense to me, although I detest it and the message that it is attempting to convey.
The bottom line is the RAF is in the game of portraying itself as a caring sharing organisation where everybodies contribution, and you the individual, are valued.
Unfortunately the ad paints a rather unsavoury picture of a fighting service. Remember Aircrew recruit themselves, I know I have to work with a whole Sqn of them every day in my little Sqn Ops section. It's the non commissioned trades and the ground branches that are the focus of all this advertising.
For me the the quality of recruit is abysmal, military discipline and ethos is an anathema to all but the smallest minority. The majority of junior SAC's in the Service today, in my opinion, are frankly a waste of skin. But what makes it worse is that people in authority and who are directly responsible for setting the standard - don't! They simply lack the moral courage and instead treat young airmen in the same manner as yoofs at the local yoof club. A recent comment that came from my trade training establishment (FOTF - TG9 FOA/FOA ATC) was that the recruits are coming from Halton as ill disciplined and showing no respect for rank or authority, strange really as Shawbury is a training establishment and therefore is able to instill these attributes, instead all the staff do is bleat!
Therefore that little job is now left up to people like me on the front line. I have recently had to deal with a particularly awkward SAC who was not only stupid and lazy, but frankly dangerous. Right up to the very end bloggs still didn't get it! Trouble is the replacement is no better, full of sh!te!
No surprise then that I've PVR'd, cannot be bothered anymore with people who regard the RAF as a gravy trainand that life as a whole owes them a living. Teamwork, miliatry ethos, comradeship, pride et al where is it in today's RAF?
This ad makes perfect sense to me, although I detest it and the message that it is attempting to convey.
The bottom line is the RAF is in the game of portraying itself as a caring sharing organisation where everybodies contribution, and you the individual, are valued.
Unfortunately the ad paints a rather unsavoury picture of a fighting service. Remember Aircrew recruit themselves, I know I have to work with a whole Sqn of them every day in my little Sqn Ops section. It's the non commissioned trades and the ground branches that are the focus of all this advertising.
For me the the quality of recruit is abysmal, military discipline and ethos is an anathema to all but the smallest minority. The majority of junior SAC's in the Service today, in my opinion, are frankly a waste of skin. But what makes it worse is that people in authority and who are directly responsible for setting the standard - don't! They simply lack the moral courage and instead treat young airmen in the same manner as yoofs at the local yoof club. A recent comment that came from my trade training establishment (FOTF - TG9 FOA/FOA ATC) was that the recruits are coming from Halton as ill disciplined and showing no respect for rank or authority, strange really as Shawbury is a training establishment and therefore is able to instill these attributes, instead all the staff do is bleat!
Therefore that little job is now left up to people like me on the front line. I have recently had to deal with a particularly awkward SAC who was not only stupid and lazy, but frankly dangerous. Right up to the very end bloggs still didn't get it! Trouble is the replacement is no better, full of sh!te!
No surprise then that I've PVR'd, cannot be bothered anymore with people who regard the RAF as a gravy trainand that life as a whole owes them a living. Teamwork, miliatry ethos, comradeship, pride et al where is it in today's RAF?
Why do we bother
DH98, you have hit the nail on the head with the biggest hammer.
The same is true of the 'yoofs' who pass through Cosford. There, the instructors must be pleasant, polite, must not shout, and most of all must not fail anyone for anything. as they do not have enough of the 'yoofs' wanting to enter.
Them that do want to work on the sqn are happy to do so, but do not want to have to do the work of 2 people all the time.
Cosford even issue recruits with a 'lovey' chit, which lays down all the nice ways of being treated and how they can ring the Orderly Officer on the number on the 'lovey' if they feel that they have been 'mistreated' by anyone.
Tis different to the way I was shouted and cajouled into doing things for the service during my training, and I still remember all the right things done for the right reason, but can hardly remember all teh wrong things.
P45's to all in 2004.
The same is true of the 'yoofs' who pass through Cosford. There, the instructors must be pleasant, polite, must not shout, and most of all must not fail anyone for anything. as they do not have enough of the 'yoofs' wanting to enter.
Them that do want to work on the sqn are happy to do so, but do not want to have to do the work of 2 people all the time.
Cosford even issue recruits with a 'lovey' chit,
which lays down all the nice ways of being treated and how they can ring the Orderly Officer on the number on the 'lovey' if they feel that they have been 'mistreated' by anyone.Tis different to the way I was shouted and cajouled into doing things for the service during my training, and I still remember all the right things done for the right reason, but can hardly remember all teh wrong things.
P45's to all in 2004.
I have to agree with the last two posts. Coming from a background in the RM, i was absolutely astounded at the lack of discipline and the level of standards in the RAF. I accept that they are two very different forces trying to achieve different things but the basic level of military discipline in the RAF is low, if not none existent.
The RM isnt 24/7 balling and shouting and once training is over can be quite relaxed providing you stay on the right side of the line. If you mess up you soon pay for it!
I have experienced people turning up late in the RAF, a negligent discharge on a range both with no repercussions, not even a b@*@*cking. At Fairford two years ago i was unfortunate enought to 'volunteer' for the security force! We had several AC's and LAC's from Halton and Cosford and some of them were very keen to back chat and even try to refuse to do some tasks until i had a quiet word and pointed out how things work in the military! Admittedly the majority were very hard working but it shouldn't happen at that early stage of their careers.
I can see what the ad was trying to achieve but i don't think it an attention grabber for its target audience.
The RM isnt 24/7 balling and shouting and once training is over can be quite relaxed providing you stay on the right side of the line. If you mess up you soon pay for it!
I have experienced people turning up late in the RAF, a negligent discharge on a range both with no repercussions, not even a b@*@*cking. At Fairford two years ago i was unfortunate enought to 'volunteer' for the security force! We had several AC's and LAC's from Halton and Cosford and some of them were very keen to back chat and even try to refuse to do some tasks until i had a quiet word and pointed out how things work in the military! Admittedly the majority were very hard working but it shouldn't happen at that early stage of their careers.
I can see what the ad was trying to achieve but i don't think it an attention grabber for its target audience.
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Much as the quality of some of our new entrants bothers me, I find equally troubling the, "I'm old school" mentality of some of our more experienced people. Whether we like it or not, today's recruit is a different animal from his predecessor, as was the generation of recruits before him. We can either stick our heads in the sand and hope that the youth of today will suddenly metamorphose into the youth of twenty years ago or we can adapt our training methods, with a realistic prospect of retaining RAF recruits for more than 24 hours. If young people are generally more confident, more questioning and more suspicious of authority than they used to be, that is something we need to manage (and even turn to our advantage).
In today's litigious society, I'm sure many supervisors are genuinely fearful of enforcing discipline and, when they do decide to take things "all the way", frankly, there often isn't much backing from above. Take, for example, the many PPRuners (a large number of whom are presumably longer in tooth, rank and authority than many supervisors of junior airmen and women) who appear to revel in any subverting of the disciplinary process and seem only too happy to see someone "beating the system".
In today's litigious society, I'm sure many supervisors are genuinely fearful of enforcing discipline and, when they do decide to take things "all the way", frankly, there often isn't much backing from above. Take, for example, the many PPRuners (a large number of whom are presumably longer in tooth, rank and authority than many supervisors of junior airmen and women) who appear to revel in any subverting of the disciplinary process and seem only too happy to see someone "beating the system".
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Set the scene.........
10 year old boy, flying kite on the cliff top:
RNZAF ad...................... "do you remember as a young boy, when you looked up into the sky with joy and the sky filled with thunder as the jets flew by.............."
2 x A4's flash past low and 'fast' down the beach.
Serving personnel: "Wicked - great ad"
PC pratt in Airstaff "Ad is patently sexist" BOY on cliff BOY in script, pilots all BOYS..........
Great advert, with lots of flying clips, cut - and replaced with blanket stackers and adminos typing up next meal request......... bah humbug
Disappointed yes, surprised no!
RNZAF ad...................... "do you remember as a young boy, when you looked up into the sky with joy and the sky filled with thunder as the jets flew by.............."
2 x A4's flash past low and 'fast' down the beach.
Serving personnel: "Wicked - great ad"
PC pratt in Airstaff "Ad is patently sexist" BOY on cliff BOY in script, pilots all BOYS..........
Great advert, with lots of flying clips, cut - and replaced with blanket stackers and adminos typing up next meal request......... bah humbug
Disappointed yes, surprised no!
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What a complete load of tosh!
Glad I didn't join on the basis of that ad; I'd want my money back!
Have no idea who's the agency responsible, but they need to get back to some more punchy stuff, methinks.
Glad I didn't join on the basis of that ad; I'd want my money back!
Have no idea who's the agency responsible, but they need to get back to some more punchy stuff, methinks.
New Zealand jets?
Felix,
What sort of ads do they run in NZ now that there are no more jets?
Are they just showing a bored old man flying kites, looking at the warbirds flying over?
What sort of ads do they run in NZ now that there are no more jets?
Are they just showing a bored old man flying kites, looking at the warbirds flying over?
TAC Int Bloke
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I'm with Scud-u-like, recruits have changed since 1982 when I joined up. They are smarter, better educated and not prepared to take 'the crap' we put up with. Yes, they can be a handful and have to be treated with respect. I for one am glad to see the 'National service' ethos that was still around when I joined of ‘Shut-up, face the front and don’t ask questions’ dieing out. I think those of you who speak disparagingly of the youngsters are doing the vast majority a disservice.
Watch it winged wonder....it's a long walk home!........I was an SAC once, who do you think fixes the Tonkas/Wokkas/Alberts? Cooks your meals, makes sure you get paid etc?
Would I be correct in assuming you're a RAF Reg Mr Can?
' F in Guins' make lousy infantry, Rocks make lousy Techies, Traficers, Adminers or Armours- each to their own,
‘A quiet talking-to’ doesn’t necessarily have to be performed at 100db in the individual’s face causing embarrassment and loss of self-worth as long as he/she knows they’ve screwed up and have learnt their lesson. Most of the ‘Rocks’ I have encountered on GDT seem to have realised this. Again, would it be OK to yell at a Sqn Ldr as you would an LAC?
Is it worth trashing someone’s career over a momentary lapse? And if the ND was performed by aircrew would you still want their head? Or perhaps, if you are a ‘Rock’, you’ve never heard tails of Regiment ‘indiscretions’ that were hushed up?
Yes, and if the individual is constantly doing late it’s a problem, however, how many times have YOU been late? Asked someone to cover for you or knocked off early – because you can? It’s hypocritical charging an SAC for being ten mins late while the SNCOs and the Officers make their own rules up. (And I’m guilty as charged on the last count) I thought the whole system worked on a bit of 'flex' now and again.
Same place it’s always been, you’re just getting older. I too say from time-to-time that things are getting worse, recruits are of a lower standard, training isn’t what it was etc – and then I remember they’re just different.
Sorry, this is turning into a bit of a rant defending ‘my guys’ but they are the future of the mob, not us.
‘And the children that you spit on…..’
Regards
-nick
The majority of junior SAC's in the Service today, in my opinion, are frankly a waste of skin.
Coming from a background in the RM, I was absolutely astounded at the lack of discipline and the level of standards in the RAF.
' F in Guins' make lousy infantry, Rocks make lousy Techies, Traficers, Adminers or Armours- each to their own,
a negligent discharge on a range both with no repercussions, not even a b@*@*cking.
Is it worth trashing someone’s career over a momentary lapse? And if the ND was performed by aircrew would you still want their head? Or perhaps, if you are a ‘Rock’, you’ve never heard tails of Regiment ‘indiscretions’ that were hushed up?
I have experienced people turning up late in the RAF
Teamwork, military ethos, comradeship, pride et al where is it in today's RAF?
Sorry, this is turning into a bit of a rant defending ‘my guys’ but they are the future of the mob, not us.
‘And the children that you spit on…..’
Regards
-nick
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Scud and Maple.
Don't misunderstand my sentiments, when I joined in 1982 I was a product of my age, and certainly didn't respond to the type of treatment that was meted out at the time. I look back at the rules and regs in place then and shake my head in derision. Now as a SNCO and IC a mixed Barrack Block I look at how things are very different from my day and applaud it with vigour.
No my beef is with the simple lack of willingness and ability to do a job well, teamwork, Service ethos and so on. The average SAC is certainly no better educated but is certainly less socially aware or responsible. The utter selfishness and insular outlook displayed by many is astonishing, I know, I have to deal with it every day. However it is up to people like us to guide and nurture the next generation on, so that they get their turn long after we've moved on.
The main problems I encounter are stupidity, overconfidence, indolence and a total lack of military bearing. Now call me old fashioned but military bearing is fundemental and is what sets me aside from my civilian counterparts. It is not just my excellence at my primary task but also my miiltary skills and what all that means. These are attributes that I expect from my airmen, what I get instead are civilians in uniform. ND's on a range are unacceptable, I have no quarms with bloggs being ripped a new @rse if he screws up, next time he might kill! Lateness is rare and easily dealt with, and yes there is a huge amount of flex in the system to cope with this, so what?
I am acutely aware that the needs for each service differs, and consequently so does the type of individual we target as potential recruits. The RAF has always prided itself on it's somewhat anarchic outlook, nevertheless there are certain characteristics that are common to all three sevices that are timeless and fundemental. That gentlemen is what's missing, nothing b@ll breaking.
Don't misunderstand my sentiments, when I joined in 1982 I was a product of my age, and certainly didn't respond to the type of treatment that was meted out at the time. I look back at the rules and regs in place then and shake my head in derision. Now as a SNCO and IC a mixed Barrack Block I look at how things are very different from my day and applaud it with vigour.
No my beef is with the simple lack of willingness and ability to do a job well, teamwork, Service ethos and so on. The average SAC is certainly no better educated but is certainly less socially aware or responsible. The utter selfishness and insular outlook displayed by many is astonishing, I know, I have to deal with it every day. However it is up to people like us to guide and nurture the next generation on, so that they get their turn long after we've moved on.
The main problems I encounter are stupidity, overconfidence, indolence and a total lack of military bearing. Now call me old fashioned but military bearing is fundemental and is what sets me aside from my civilian counterparts. It is not just my excellence at my primary task but also my miiltary skills and what all that means. These are attributes that I expect from my airmen, what I get instead are civilians in uniform. ND's on a range are unacceptable, I have no quarms with bloggs being ripped a new @rse if he screws up, next time he might kill! Lateness is rare and easily dealt with, and yes there is a huge amount of flex in the system to cope with this, so what?
I am acutely aware that the needs for each service differs, and consequently so does the type of individual we target as potential recruits. The RAF has always prided itself on it's somewhat anarchic outlook, nevertheless there are certain characteristics that are common to all three sevices that are timeless and fundemental. That gentlemen is what's missing, nothing b@ll breaking.
My basic problem with the ad is two fold 1, It does not mention any of the career paths available and 2, IMHO it also bears no resemblance to the reality that I have know for the past 20+ years. The RAF does not value it's personnel in the way portrayed in the ad and if you think otherwise I want your job! because I'll bet you don't have one like mine
Don't get me started on SAC's .................... too late although I don't believe it is entireley thier fault as for the most part we get a fair x-representation of society. What most people who join up don't realise is, just what they are capable of. As for discipline it is every NCO & Officers responsibility not just the training establishment staff. If you've ever looked the other way then you have in a small way contributed to a decline in standards (yes I'm guilty too).
The RAF should never have messed with the technical trades way of recruiting and the given career paths that used to exist. I mean when a techie leaves training he has not earned a formal qualification. The qualifications were one of the major selling points of joining all three services at one time.
The ad still sucks
Don't get me started on SAC's .................... too late although I don't believe it is entireley thier fault as for the most part we get a fair x-representation of society. What most people who join up don't realise is, just what they are capable of. As for discipline it is every NCO & Officers responsibility not just the training establishment staff. If you've ever looked the other way then you have in a small way contributed to a decline in standards (yes I'm guilty too).
The RAF should never have messed with the technical trades way of recruiting and the given career paths that used to exist. I mean when a techie leaves training he has not earned a formal qualification. The qualifications were one of the major selling points of joining all three services at one time.
The ad still sucks
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Maple 01,
Can't tell from your profile how long you've been in (assuming you are in) but "coming from a backgreound in the RM = Would I be correct in assuming you're a RAF Reg Mr Can?" shows a lack of general service knowledge. Ever heard of the Royal Marines?
I agree with those who think we've become too "luvvy". We're a fighting force and have to work differently to civilians. Admittedly, it would help if we got a decent bit of leadership from the top.
Can't tell from your profile how long you've been in (assuming you are in) but "coming from a backgreound in the RM = Would I be correct in assuming you're a RAF Reg Mr Can?" shows a lack of general service knowledge. Ever heard of the Royal Marines?
I agree with those who think we've become too "luvvy". We're a fighting force and have to work differently to civilians. Admittedly, it would help if we got a decent bit of leadership from the top.
TAC Int Bloke
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Can't tell from your profile how long you've been in (assuming you are in)
but "coming from a background in the RM = Would I be correct in assuming you're a RAF Reg Mr Can?" shows a lack of general service knowledge. Ever heard of the Royal Marines?
Why would a RM have many dealings with the RAF unless he'd changed service? Just a supposition of course, but we do get a few re-treads in from time-to-time. Unless Mr Can was involved in the Ash fiasco. If he hasn't 'cross-dressed' then perhaps his views hold little water (see? Naval reference....)
I agree with those who think we've become too "luvvy". We're a fighting force and have to work differently to civilians.
Admittedly, it would help if we got a decent bit of leadership from the top.
The main problems I encounter are stupidity, overconfidence, indolence and a total lack of military bearing.
The RAF has always prided itself on it's somewhat anarchic outlook,
Perhaps it's not that society is out of step, but us.
One of my old bosses said the RAF had to be brought kicking and screaming into the 1960s
regards
-nick
Ali Barber, thanks a lot you were right.
Maple, 5 years as a Royal Marines Commando and I am now RAF Aircrew. I was not trying to put down SACs LACs etc (I'm married to one from your trade group!) I fully appreciate just how hard people work in all the trade groups and how they generally get the rough end of the stick. I did point out that the majority are very hard workers and are an asset to the RAF. Finally both the ND and the lateness were Aircrew and in the training system still!
I joined the RAF for two reasons, one because I wanted to fly and two because the RAF in my experience got treated better and had better facilites etc. The point I was trying to make was that in the military there should be some discipline. Especially during training.
I'm definitely do not advocate nose to nose 100db dressing downs. However if you are late for work without good reason then why not be taken aside and shown the error of your ways, a quiet warning first time and more for persistent offenders. As for NDs I dont care who it is, ND and be charged for it, if I NDd I would expect just that.
P.S. The advert is still c**p! And the cross dressing is just a rumour!
Maple, 5 years as a Royal Marines Commando and I am now RAF Aircrew. I was not trying to put down SACs LACs etc (I'm married to one from your trade group!) I fully appreciate just how hard people work in all the trade groups and how they generally get the rough end of the stick. I did point out that the majority are very hard workers and are an asset to the RAF. Finally both the ND and the lateness were Aircrew and in the training system still!
I joined the RAF for two reasons, one because I wanted to fly and two because the RAF in my experience got treated better and had better facilites etc. The point I was trying to make was that in the military there should be some discipline. Especially during training.
I'm definitely do not advocate nose to nose 100db dressing downs. However if you are late for work without good reason then why not be taken aside and shown the error of your ways, a quiet warning first time and more for persistent offenders. As for NDs I dont care who it is, ND and be charged for it, if I NDd I would expect just that.
P.S. The advert is still c**p! And the cross dressing is just a rumour!
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Anyone heard the ad the RAF is running on local radio? Caught it on Galaxy FM in the north east. Just as lame as the tv advert. Couldn't even tell you what the content of the advert is. After the third or fourth time you hear it you still don't reallise it's the RAF until the last sentence ('Rise above the Rest' is it?). In my opinion, not likely to inspire anyone to join up.