BEWARE...New digital speed cameras on M4
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On a slightly different note...
remember a story some years ago in one ofthe flight mags about the police in Jockland working on a RADAR trap at the side of a main road... Heard an aircraft approaching and raised the Speed gun in the direction of the a/c and got a reading of 350mph!
Aparently the speed gun went u/s in a cloud of smoke and when the police complained to the MOD, they reply received to the effect that that they were lucky to have got away with a smoking gun... Had the two ship harrier formation, which was live armed returning from the Bosnia theatre been complying with sop's they would have been looking for two more officers and a new patrol car as a HARM should have been launched towards the intrusive radar source!
Anyone out there confirm this or shed any light on it?
About the same time as the speeding 911
(130mph plus!) on the A1 near Wittering at night with no lights... Driver and passenger using new NVG's!!
remember a story some years ago in one ofthe flight mags about the police in Jockland working on a RADAR trap at the side of a main road... Heard an aircraft approaching and raised the Speed gun in the direction of the a/c and got a reading of 350mph!
Aparently the speed gun went u/s in a cloud of smoke and when the police complained to the MOD, they reply received to the effect that that they were lucky to have got away with a smoking gun... Had the two ship harrier formation, which was live armed returning from the Bosnia theatre been complying with sop's they would have been looking for two more officers and a new patrol car as a HARM should have been launched towards the intrusive radar source!
Anyone out there confirm this or shed any light on it?
About the same time as the speeding 911
(130mph plus!) on the A1 near Wittering at night with no lights... Driver and passenger using new NVG's!!
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Fifth Gear
I was watching Fifth Gear on Channel 5 tonight (mainly to letch at Vicki Butler-Henderson). They had a very good feature on anti-speed cam protection measures. All the passive detectors were judged by a tame copper as being legal as all they do is provide information, but the active laser emitter, although very effective, was not. Said tame copper explained that the laser emitter disrupts due legal process and would result in the driver having to explain to a court why he had it fitted to his vehicle.
Top tip, Fifth Gear are running a competition to win the Volvo they fitted all of the legal gadgets to. If you call 09015 33 99 55 and tell them that the answer is (a. GPS) you may win the motor with the toys. Good luck!
Top tip, Fifth Gear are running a competition to win the Volvo they fitted all of the legal gadgets to. If you call 09015 33 99 55 and tell them that the answer is (a. GPS) you may win the motor with the toys. Good luck!
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Phugoid
That story (the version I heard had A-10s in it) has been determined to be an urban myth. Read why here.
I thought radar detectors were passive receivers, but the more i think about I did do recall reading they emit a small signal to somehow clarify the signal being received. Any 40-lb brainstems out there want to explain in layman's terms??
Cheers! M2
That story (the version I heard had A-10s in it) has been determined to be an urban myth. Read why here.
I thought radar detectors were passive receivers, but the more i think about I did do recall reading they emit a small signal to somehow clarify the signal being received. Any 40-lb brainstems out there want to explain in layman's terms??
Cheers! M2
Of course there is very little to stop one from chopping in your DVLA license for - say - a Spanish one and driving on that. Insurance companies are quite happy these days to ensure you on a Pan European basis.
I suspect these automated money machine systems that policemen have been allowed to install everywhere can't be bothered with chasing anybody that requires anything administratively complicated.
The police operate with the consent of the public. If they persist with churning out hundreds of thousands of tickets a month then they risk loosing that consent with dire consequences for us all. The destruction of over 700 cameras so far indicates the way public mood is going. Proposals to install cameras to guard the cameras show how limited is the thinking of some bureacrats.
Anyway, (to give some relevance to forum) I saw a Canberra the other day - thats a military aeroplane with cameras in it.
Cheers
WWW
I suspect these automated money machine systems that policemen have been allowed to install everywhere can't be bothered with chasing anybody that requires anything administratively complicated.
The police operate with the consent of the public. If they persist with churning out hundreds of thousands of tickets a month then they risk loosing that consent with dire consequences for us all. The destruction of over 700 cameras so far indicates the way public mood is going. Proposals to install cameras to guard the cameras show how limited is the thinking of some bureacrats.
Anyway, (to give some relevance to forum) I saw a Canberra the other day - thats a military aeroplane with cameras in it.
Cheers
WWW
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Have any Pruners (car drivers) ever been nicked by front facing speed camera's?. (the sneaky ones, with the infra-red flash). I've seen quite a few of them in Norfolk and Lincolnshire.
I was wondering if there would be a possible defence in court, that they are illegal because they discriminate against car drivers, due to the fact that they can-not catch motorbikes, which are not required to have a front number plate. All they would get is a photo of a grinning biker raising a finger, as they passed the camera.
419
Wouldn't this topic be better off in Jet blast?
I was wondering if there would be a possible defence in court, that they are illegal because they discriminate against car drivers, due to the fact that they can-not catch motorbikes, which are not required to have a front number plate. All they would get is a photo of a grinning biker raising a finger, as they passed the camera.
419
Wouldn't this topic be better off in Jet blast?
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StopStart,
The view's great thanks.
Tradewind,
Until March this year I had three penalty points on my driving licence, for driving at 37mph in a 30mph speed limit. I was initially quite pi$$ed off and felt all the usual feelings "why don't they spend more time trying to catch real criminals?" etc etc. After the initial anger passed and I had time to reflect, and I've come to the conclusion that speed limits are there for a reason and that getting the points has been a good thing. I've become more aware of my speed at all times, and still am over three years since being caught. I guess it doesn't always work that way with other drivers?
I don't claim to be 100% spotlessly clean. I drive at 80mph on the motorways (most traffic cops won't be bothered if you drive safely and with decent seperation distance between you and the car in front). I certainly won't break a speed limit by more than 10-15%.....and frankly if you do, you're taking a gamble with your licence.
The view's great thanks.
Tradewind,
Until March this year I had three penalty points on my driving licence, for driving at 37mph in a 30mph speed limit. I was initially quite pi$$ed off and felt all the usual feelings "why don't they spend more time trying to catch real criminals?" etc etc. After the initial anger passed and I had time to reflect, and I've come to the conclusion that speed limits are there for a reason and that getting the points has been a good thing. I've become more aware of my speed at all times, and still am over three years since being caught. I guess it doesn't always work that way with other drivers?
I don't claim to be 100% spotlessly clean. I drive at 80mph on the motorways (most traffic cops won't be bothered if you drive safely and with decent seperation distance between you and the car in front). I certainly won't break a speed limit by more than 10-15%.....and frankly if you do, you're taking a gamble with your licence.
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I agree it is important to observe speed restrictions in built-up areas or other areas where there is a higher risk of collision. What is not acceptable is the use of speed detection devices (whether automatic or manually operated) on safe, open stretches of highway, especially during quiet periods, when the risk of collision is negligible.
Many speed cameras are simply a tax on speed. The current obsession of some chief constables with speed enforcement is absurd. Their attitude alienates the normally law-abiding majority, hindering rather than helping the fight against real crime. As for traffic officers, many are utter hypocrites, who, without lawful excuse, routinely drive in excess of the prevailing speed limit and whose driving skills are often questionable.
I have a clean licence. I regularly exceed the speed limit on motorways and dual carriageways. The secret: be alert, don't overdo it, don't be complacent and familiarise yourself with the methods and vehicles used by the traffic police and local authorities.
Many speed cameras are simply a tax on speed. The current obsession of some chief constables with speed enforcement is absurd. Their attitude alienates the normally law-abiding majority, hindering rather than helping the fight against real crime. As for traffic officers, many are utter hypocrites, who, without lawful excuse, routinely drive in excess of the prevailing speed limit and whose driving skills are often questionable.
I have a clean licence. I regularly exceed the speed limit on motorways and dual carriageways. The secret: be alert, don't overdo it, don't be complacent and familiarise yourself with the methods and vehicles used by the traffic police and local authorities.
Thanks 419 -- I was wondering how the cameras could get an image without a flash -- IR will do the job, though I doubt if there's such as a thing as IR flash.
We can look forward to some IRCM such as Heated or Cooled Plate Covers so that plate shows as white or black spot -- unless plod has IR vision, won't be able to see
You need a thermoconductive visible light transparent substance to blur the IR image -- such as water.
A more concealed option would be a heating element behind the numbers/backing, perhaps with a mask to create a differential temperature to compensate for the different radiativity of the backing and numbers.
We can look forward to some IRCM such as Heated or Cooled Plate Covers so that plate shows as white or black spot -- unless plod has IR vision, won't be able to see
You need a thermoconductive visible light transparent substance to blur the IR image -- such as water.
A more concealed option would be a heating element behind the numbers/backing, perhaps with a mask to create a differential temperature to compensate for the different radiativity of the backing and numbers.
Last edited by RatherBeFlying; 22nd Oct 2003 at 02:18.
Stoppers - didn't your QFI ever teach you to LOOK OUT!
That said, perhaps you tried a little banter along the lines of "I was only trying to prove that the long, straight tree-lined roads in la belle France weren't just so that ze Tchermans could march in the shade..." Or "If you bug.gers used mph and not kph, I wouldn't have got so confused...my, what a simply beautiful revolver you've got - do they give you the bullets as well?"
In any case, I didn't know that your Calibra was capable of such speeds - didn't you have a famous interview on TV about it being so unreliable?
That said, perhaps you tried a little banter along the lines of "I was only trying to prove that the long, straight tree-lined roads in la belle France weren't just so that ze Tchermans could march in the shade..." Or "If you bug.gers used mph and not kph, I wouldn't have got so confused...my, what a simply beautiful revolver you've got - do they give you the bullets as well?"
In any case, I didn't know that your Calibra was capable of such speeds - didn't you have a famous interview on TV about it being so unreliable?
Last edited by BEagle; 21st Oct 2003 at 22:28.
Major Mad Max, almost all radio receiving devices have a local oscillator to modulate the incoming signal (but I've forgotten why this is necessary for the moment). This circuit produces rf energy - some of which can be emitted. The principle was used by MI5 to catch Soviet agents listening to coded broadcasts - they would drive around the area in question with the equipment in a vehicle around the time Moskva Centre was known to transmit, monitoring the Soviet signal themselves as a guide. When they detected a local oscillator signal simultaneous with the Soviet broadcast, they knew someone nearby was listening.
They further developed this to include active detection, in which they would ping the target with a burst of noise on the frequency in question to see if they got a signal - used to confirm the detection at a specific spot. The project was called RAFTER and was large - they even flew airborne-RAFTER missions over London to get a general idea of where a spy was before placing the monitors on the ground to pinpoint them.
It was a Peter Wright thing, and it's all in Spycatcher anyway...I suspect strongly that Stopstart's radar detector, a receiver, was counterdetected by the same method. Also, I'm of the view that TV detector vans work on this principle.
They further developed this to include active detection, in which they would ping the target with a burst of noise on the frequency in question to see if they got a signal - used to confirm the detection at a specific spot. The project was called RAFTER and was large - they even flew airborne-RAFTER missions over London to get a general idea of where a spy was before placing the monitors on the ground to pinpoint them.
It was a Peter Wright thing, and it's all in Spycatcher anyway...I suspect strongly that Stopstart's radar detector, a receiver, was counterdetected by the same method. Also, I'm of the view that TV detector vans work on this principle.
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RatherBeeFlying,
It's not a true infra-red flash as such. What the system actually uses is infra-red sensitive film in the camera, and a "black" filter in front of the flash gun. This stops all light except infrared.
(the same set-up can be used for 35mm still photography).
419
It's not a true infra-red flash as such. What the system actually uses is infra-red sensitive film in the camera, and a "black" filter in front of the flash gun. This stops all light except infrared.
(the same set-up can be used for 35mm still photography).
419
419
So what one needs is a filter that passes visible light, but blocks the IR that passes through the black filter
So what one needs is a filter that passes visible light, but blocks the IR that passes through the black filter
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"South Wales Safety Camera Partnership"
Did someone say "a tax on speed"? Yes, apparently so if reports in today's national newspapers are anything to go by.
Source: Daily Express
This is exactly the sort of behaviour that is increasing the public's enmity towards speed traps and those who set them. If the drivers should not have been penalised, then the fines and points should have been rescinded immediately. To require everyone to question their penalty in writing is merely a crass way of pocketing thousands of pounds from innocent people.
My partner is one person who will be writing to check if her penalty still stands, but what about those who didn't happen to pick up a newspaper today? Their fines and penalties will still stand. Absolutely disgusting.
And that's not to mention all the people who will, in the intervening period, have paid increased car insurance premiums as a result of having endorsements on their licence, my partner again included. I doubt that this money will be seen again, whatever the outcome of any challenge to the penalty.
Any thoughts? Mine include:
LTP
Thousands of drivers have been wrongly convicted of speeding after a camera was put up in the wrong place, it emerged yesterday.
But officials have refused to declare an amnesty for motorists who have paid fines and had penalty points put on their licence.
Instead, each driver wrongly caught must make an individual appeal. So far 10 motorists have been let off after making a plea.
The camera was set up to enforce a 50mph speed limit at roadworks on the M4 near Newport, South Wales - but instead snapped cars 200 yards past the roadworks as they accelerated back to 70mph.
More than 2500 motorists were trapped from July last year to September this year and Ł150,000 had been paid in fines before police realised a mistake had been made. John Rowling of the Safety Camera Partnership - run by three police forces in Wales - said: "Anyone with concerns regarding their penalty on this occasion is advised to write to us and we will consider their case individually"
But officials have refused to declare an amnesty for motorists who have paid fines and had penalty points put on their licence.
Instead, each driver wrongly caught must make an individual appeal. So far 10 motorists have been let off after making a plea.
The camera was set up to enforce a 50mph speed limit at roadworks on the M4 near Newport, South Wales - but instead snapped cars 200 yards past the roadworks as they accelerated back to 70mph.
More than 2500 motorists were trapped from July last year to September this year and Ł150,000 had been paid in fines before police realised a mistake had been made. John Rowling of the Safety Camera Partnership - run by three police forces in Wales - said: "Anyone with concerns regarding their penalty on this occasion is advised to write to us and we will consider their case individually"
This is exactly the sort of behaviour that is increasing the public's enmity towards speed traps and those who set them. If the drivers should not have been penalised, then the fines and points should have been rescinded immediately. To require everyone to question their penalty in writing is merely a crass way of pocketing thousands of pounds from innocent people.
My partner is one person who will be writing to check if her penalty still stands, but what about those who didn't happen to pick up a newspaper today? Their fines and penalties will still stand. Absolutely disgusting.
And that's not to mention all the people who will, in the intervening period, have paid increased car insurance premiums as a result of having endorsements on their licence, my partner again included. I doubt that this money will be seen again, whatever the outcome of any challenge to the penalty.
Any thoughts? Mine include:
LTP
You don't know how lucky you are in UK: try putting up with our Victorian State Government, who have:
Budgeted $A450 million to be raised in speeding fines this financial year
Arbitrarily rescinded the ADR (Australian Design Rules) which mandates 10% error for speed measuring devices, and instigated a 3kph error allowance only. Which happens to be the ADR tolerance on their speed cameras
Installed fixed cameras on the newest, safest highway in the state
In the process of installing point to point photo systems, to measure a vehicle over a known distance (40 km or 400 km, on the main Melbourne - Sydney Highway) to further modify driving behaviour
Run a graphic scare campaign for many years, totally allocating driving accidents to either speed or drink: no acceptance of road conditions, driving ability, etc etc
Installed fixed speed cameras on the main arterial bridge access to Melbourne, anticipating $A1 million income per day , even though speeding and accidents are totally unrelated on the WestGate Bridge
Lowered speed limits in built up areas to 50kph, and in some places 40kph
The list goes on, but try driving at 40 kph downhill, without creeping 2-3kph up. Yesterday a number of Police Sargeants wrote to the Herald Sun adding their concern that cameras are now purely seen as revenue raising devices. Meanwhile, no copper can be bothered to enforce "normal" road laws, eg, keep to the left unless overtaking, 'cos it's too difficult to put the time into pursuing the issue if it goes to court.
Budgeted $A450 million to be raised in speeding fines this financial year
Arbitrarily rescinded the ADR (Australian Design Rules) which mandates 10% error for speed measuring devices, and instigated a 3kph error allowance only. Which happens to be the ADR tolerance on their speed cameras
Installed fixed cameras on the newest, safest highway in the state
In the process of installing point to point photo systems, to measure a vehicle over a known distance (40 km or 400 km, on the main Melbourne - Sydney Highway) to further modify driving behaviour
Run a graphic scare campaign for many years, totally allocating driving accidents to either speed or drink: no acceptance of road conditions, driving ability, etc etc
Installed fixed speed cameras on the main arterial bridge access to Melbourne, anticipating $A1 million income per day , even though speeding and accidents are totally unrelated on the WestGate Bridge
Lowered speed limits in built up areas to 50kph, and in some places 40kph
The list goes on, but try driving at 40 kph downhill, without creeping 2-3kph up. Yesterday a number of Police Sargeants wrote to the Herald Sun adding their concern that cameras are now purely seen as revenue raising devices. Meanwhile, no copper can be bothered to enforce "normal" road laws, eg, keep to the left unless overtaking, 'cos it's too difficult to put the time into pursuing the issue if it goes to court.
Got a ticket from the Bosch recently...Euro 60 with a polite note with the photo that giving the civil service camera the 'bird' could cost me another Euro 12,000.
Now wearing baseball cap and rediculous beard!
Now wearing baseball cap and rediculous beard!
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419
Why don'tcha get yourself a nice little motorbike, then?!? And just for your reading amusement, they do have "rear-pointing"
radar cameras here in the land of beer and chocolate, saw several of them going to The Netherlands a few weeks ago. Nasty!
And yes, I do have a motorcycle and yes, I do speed. I just got back from the UK and asfar as I saw, you don't have much if a speeding problem. If you want to see some reckless driving, come over here and watch the Belg!
Cheers! M2
Why don'tcha get yourself a nice little motorbike, then?!? And just for your reading amusement, they do have "rear-pointing"
radar cameras here in the land of beer and chocolate, saw several of them going to The Netherlands a few weeks ago. Nasty!And yes, I do have a motorcycle and yes, I do speed. I just got back from the UK and asfar as I saw, you don't have much if a speeding problem. If you want to see some reckless driving, come over here and watch the Belg!
Cheers! M2
Speed cameras are a fact of life, and lets face it folks, if you speed you are breaking the law and therefore don't expect sympathy from anyone.
I've seen idiots flying down the A17 until they come accross a speed camera and the slam on the brakes and cut people up to get back into the proper side of the road before they gat taken out by head on traffic. I was nearly blatted by one recently.
Having said that, I don't see the point of doing 70 on the M-whatever at 0-silly hundred in the morning without another vehicle in sight, but there it is. 75 mph and no points and really unlucky if a copper pulls you over any faster and you're asking for it.
Everyone knows that, so don't do it and don't whinge if you end up with loads of points on your licence.
Happy motoring
Doc C:
I've seen idiots flying down the A17 until they come accross a speed camera and the slam on the brakes and cut people up to get back into the proper side of the road before they gat taken out by head on traffic. I was nearly blatted by one recently.
Having said that, I don't see the point of doing 70 on the M-whatever at 0-silly hundred in the morning without another vehicle in sight, but there it is. 75 mph and no points and really unlucky if a copper pulls you over any faster and you're asking for it.
Everyone knows that, so don't do it and don't whinge if you end up with loads of points on your licence.
Happy motoring
Doc C:
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Having been for a number a years as one of those 'hated' traffic police officers, all I can add to this is that its not neessarily speed alone that is the problem. Speed coupled with a human being sitting at the wheel of his car with his twenty minute (at best) attention span whilst seated in his warm comfortable environment with all the associated distractions of in-car entertinment, mobile telephones and irksome passengers is the problem.
Humans make mistakes which usually means other people having to quite literally clear those mistakes up (when you have seen the remains of someone having attempted to cross a dual carriageway and failed, having been hit by fifteen different vehicles including lorries you will form in your mind a new definition of road kill). Knocking at someones door to tell them that you believe there son/daughter/mother/father is lying on a mortuary slab also opens your eyes to the real world.
All I can say is drive within your capabilities, the capabilities of the road, you vehicle and always try to anticipate what other road users are doing around you and how what you are doing effects them.
It is better to be late than not arrive at our destination at all.
Humans make mistakes which usually means other people having to quite literally clear those mistakes up (when you have seen the remains of someone having attempted to cross a dual carriageway and failed, having been hit by fifteen different vehicles including lorries you will form in your mind a new definition of road kill). Knocking at someones door to tell them that you believe there son/daughter/mother/father is lying on a mortuary slab also opens your eyes to the real world.
All I can say is drive within your capabilities, the capabilities of the road, you vehicle and always try to anticipate what other road users are doing around you and how what you are doing effects them.
It is better to be late than not arrive at our destination at all.
Nice to hear the view of Road Plod. Some good prose on 'defensive driving' - but I note that he didn't defend these bŁoody cameras. The ones which I consider exceptionally dangerous are those placed on straight single carriageway roads where it used to be safe to overtake the 55 mph truck in front of you by 'mirror, signal, manoeuvre' - drivers would keep their eyes on the road ahead, accelerating briskly to minimise their exposure on the 'wrong side' before pulling back in to the 'correct' side and continuing at 60 mph. But now, wary of Plodcams they overtake at 60 mph, so that the time spent on the wrong side is considerably increased - where it might once have involved a speed difference of 15-20 mph, it's now only 5 mph - so they spend perhaps 4 times as long on the 'wrong' side....
If you want examples, just drive down the A40 from Burford to Gloucester....where once it was safe to overtake, these ba$tard things now make it very dangerous.
Mind how you go Sir....
If you want examples, just drive down the A40 from Burford to Gloucester....where once it was safe to overtake, these ba$tard things now make it very dangerous.
Mind how you go Sir....