COJONES NEEDED FOR CAS
ATG:_
If there were one message from the threads that you mention, it would be that the CAS, and the rest of the RAF High Command for that matter, do indeed need the appendages mentioned by the OP. Nothing in that campaign would stand in the way of a straight forward matter of airmanship such as this is, or even a full blown operational sortie against a determined and well equipped enemy. All this matter needs is leadership. All the scandal of UK Military Airworthiness needs is leadership. We are I'm afraid, in violent agreement!
He's probably been reading the threads about airworthyness and realised that unless an independent MAA sign off on the airframe it's not going anywhere. Welcome to the future of the RAF.
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No idea. I picked the story up from the history & nostalgia thread and thought it deserved a look by the people that matter in the hopes that either the decision can be changed in time or that CAS is embarrassed enough to put his knitting away and show some proper leadership.
One perhaps should ask how this decision reached CAS (if it even has)? I'd imagine that everyone from Sqn Cdr, Stn Cdr, Force Cdr and AOC Gp has probably wrung their hands of it - leaving CAS as the 'last resort'. Put yourself in his shoes; if the Truckie 'expert' DH chain has refused to authorise it why should a non-expert SH pilot agree to it? The DH chain is built upon using SQEP in key positions - if they've said 'too much risk' then why should he overrule his 'experts'?
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I had assumed that CAS had made the decision wearing his other hat as CinC Air Command (despite there being a 2* AOC 2 Gp and a 3* D Com Ops below him in the chain of command). However it seems that on Air Safety matters there is a completely separate chain, which runs from Stn Cdr (as Delivery Duty Holder
) to the Operational Duty Holder (who dat?) and then directly to CAS as 'Senior Duty Holder'!!! The mind boggles. 
) to the Operational Duty Holder (who dat?) and then directly to CAS as 'Senior Duty Holder'!!! The mind boggles.
The DH chain is built upon using SQEP in key positions...
CAS - JFDI!!!
Last edited by BEagle; 28th Jul 2013 at 18:42.
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Why not wait until > 20 kts of wind from the right direction is forecast? That would surely reduce the risk.
However, I also was a helicopter pilot and haven't flown an aeroplane since the JP - other than a Chipmunk!
However, I also was a helicopter pilot and haven't flown an aeroplane since the JP - other than a Chipmunk!
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I love the comments on here. 500N, why doesn't he have them practice!! Do you seriously think that he wouldn't have thought of that??!!
Jeez
I'm amazed that the niaivety on PPRuNe!! It's great. Like the most senior RAF officer wouldn't have thought if all that's been written on here.
Haha!!
Jeez
I'm amazed that the niaivety on PPRuNe!! It's great. Like the most senior RAF officer wouldn't have thought if all that's been written on here.
Haha!!
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Well, there you go. Its not just me thinking it, that the paucity of true leadership in public service has reached the highest echelons of the military... its not just the police, the politicos or the NHS, its across the board.
The rot started during Options For Change and has only got worse since.
I dont suppose these guys are all Common Purpose Graduates as well are they?
The rot started during Options For Change and has only got worse since.
I dont suppose these guys are all Common Purpose Graduates as well are they?
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betty
All the discussion up to that point was on the concern the runway
was too short.
If that was his concern, my comment was not to practice
but to show it could be done.
All the discussion up to that point was on the concern the runway
was too short.
If that was his concern, my comment was not to practice
but to show it could be done.
I watched 10s land at Belize, and turn off at the mid-point access to the parking area. What was that - about 3000'??
I know they had pax and freight onboard - I assume they also had diversion fuel to get them to the Land Of Better Hotels And Much Better Rates.
So I assume they were not at minimum weight.
As mentioned previously, a bit of wind down the strip, and light weight...........
Shame.
It is a lovely aircraft, and has served the RAF well.
It does deserve its place in the RAF Museum.
I know they had pax and freight onboard - I assume they also had diversion fuel to get them to the Land Of Better Hotels And Much Better Rates.
So I assume they were not at minimum weight.
As mentioned previously, a bit of wind down the strip, and light weight...........
Shame.
It is a lovely aircraft, and has served the RAF well.
It does deserve its place in the RAF Museum.
I would put money on 808 being kept at Bruntingthorpe and used as a fast taxi down the runway aircraft on the open days and also used for corporate events as was 471. PM me for details of VC10 limited edition Malt Whisky, still some left!!
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I love the comments on here. 500N, why doesn't he have them practice!! Do you seriously think that he wouldn't have thought of that??!!
Jeez
I'm amazed that the niaivety on PPRuNe!! It's great. Like the most senior RAF officer wouldn't have thought if all that's been written on here.
Haha!!
Jeez
I'm amazed that the niaivety on PPRuNe!! It's great. Like the most senior RAF officer wouldn't have thought if all that's been written on here.
Haha!!
Truly laughable - but hey it is a rumour network.As for CAS making a policy decision on the basis of reading PPrune - that's the same foolishness that expects the Daily Mail to write a technically correct air incident report - please
Look there's a witch.
Last edited by TomJoad; 28th Jul 2013 at 18:18.
Gentleman Aviator
A VC10 did a low approach and overshoot at Cosford a couple of weeks ago.
I guess the crew report would have been part of the decision-making process.
And CAS only took over on Wednesday! Give him a break. And whilst the decision went to him, (CYA by those below), I bet it was a rock solid "Ooh no sir, unless you say so", from about Group Captain upwards.
And as the Pres of the B of I for the Mull Chinook - when he was a wg cdr - I guess he has his own views on Airworthiness and Senior Officers.
I think he's a good bloke.
I guess the crew report would have been part of the decision-making process.
And CAS only took over on Wednesday! Give him a break. And whilst the decision went to him, (CYA by those below), I bet it was a rock solid "Ooh no sir, unless you say so", from about Group Captain upwards.
And as the Pres of the B of I for the Mull Chinook - when he was a wg cdr - I guess he has his own views on Airworthiness and Senior Officers.
I think he's a good bloke.
Last edited by teeteringhead; 28th Jul 2013 at 18:49.
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A VC10 did a low approach and overshoot at Cosford a couple of weeks ago.
I guess the crew report would have been part of the decision-making process.
And CAS only took over on Wednesday! Give him a break. And whilst the decision went to him, (CYA by those below), I bet it was a rock solid "Ooh no sir, unless you say so", from about Group Captain upwards.
And as the Pres of the B of I for the Mull Chinook - when he was a wg cdr - I guess he has his own views on Airworthiness and Senior Officers.
I think he's a good bloke.
I guess the crew report would have been part of the decision-making process.
And CAS only took over on Wednesday! Give him a break. And whilst the decision went to him, (CYA by those below), I bet it was a rock solid "Ooh no sir, unless you say so", from about Group Captain upwards.
And as the Pres of the B of I for the Mull Chinook - when he was a wg cdr - I guess he has his own views on Airworthiness and Senior Officers.
I think he's a good bloke.
Last edited by TomJoad; 28th Jul 2013 at 20:01.
If it only had 300ft to spare, then imagine the consequences of a failure of a thrust reverser, spoilers or brakes. In a VC-10 that old the risk also has to be weighed for the crew.
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I would suggest the new CAS has far bigger cojones than many of the posters here. Any of the naysayers ever flown with/for him on SH?
Last edited by Cows getting bigger; 28th Jul 2013 at 20:11.