So who's going to Korean? (threads merged)
 

Out of the pot into the fire maybe? :O

I'm thinking seriously of throwing my hat in the ring for the Feb interviews, and have heard of and spoken to so many EK colleagues who have done/about to do the same.

So who out there is moving on this? A mate is starting there very soon, but haven't really seen any hard evidence of the swarm of EK pilots that the rumour mill mentions are about to resign for pastures closer to home. Any comments?

ek
 

many people are ready lo leave ek?

It doesn't matter who. It matters how many they need.

Don't know how many but those that I do know that are there say it's very good once on the line.

When all is said is done I dare say maybe 10 or less would make the move! Remember the great saying... " better the devil you know " :)

Future Korean pilots

You're actually painful about jumping ship - rather wind your neck in and just do your job, those that are leaving do it in a way that no one else finds out, they just slip out the back door, those that shoot their mouths off never end up going!.......talk .......complain.........stay!

By all accounts Korean is better than EK for those without children except for one small fact - that instead of being hated just by your managers, you're hated by your fellow pilots too.

Good you said that. Would you not feel the same at home in your own (national) turf if Koreans came and got jobs supposed to be for the nationals of your own country? It's a natural reaction. One just needs to be on the right. Be professional, do the job, get the money and out when you have done your targets.

Happy New Year to all in aviation on the ground and up in the air!

With so many Ex-pats in the Left seat AND Right seat at Korean, it's not any different than here in the Desert. From my sources, they run an Organized and Honest business. Those two reasons alone makes you think.....Should I stay or should I go now :}

KAL AFTER EK ? Yes he did.
 

At least one guy had the guts to explain why he moved to KAL after 7 years in EK. Yeap just find and read Flight International early December release, see his picture and learn.
Check it out.

If you are type qualified, training is less than 4 months, non type rated add 3-4 weeks. Yes the pay is reduced, approximately 70% pay during training. At the end of training, you get an extra $3000 US "reward'.

If Korean, like China Airlines, did not hire expats, they would not be flying into the US. The company has little choice. Doesn't help the "local's" I suppose.

There are a lot more than ten EK pilot's on file at KAL ( well over 100), but it is anyone's guess how many will go.

For those of you taking the leap.... Good Luck!! I've got a bit of time to kill here first.

Happy 2010 to all of ya!

Jinglie'd

Instead of worrying about who's taking who's job, why don't people just worry about themselves and becoming better professionals?
Another thing to consider, if they are hiring expats it means there are not enough locals to fill the spots. If there aren't enough locals to fill the spots, what's there to complain????
Happy New Year!!!!!

VF

Fractional, a bit like all the Aussies and Kiwis who got jobs at Easyjet......were we pissed off?

Possibly varigflyer because 'Star Alliance' said employ expats!!!!! Even though enough 'Capt Kim Kan Kills' in Korea - Delta wants western captains:ok::ok:

Jinglied
 

Please check your resources before making a such remark. China Airlines was never MANDATED to hire any expats. The need to hire an expats was because not enough locals to filled the seats, PERIOD!

If what you've said was true, wouldn't it be a requirements to have at least 1 expat in the cockpit on every flight? But sorry to disappoint you because that was not the case and now the expats are being let go due to the current economic downturn. Go figure.

Guys, found this in Flight International, just some food for thought, especially further down where he states the differences between EK and KAL...:D

Jeff P. is a Boeing 777 captain with Korean Air. A South African, he has worked for several airlines including Emirates. He recently returned home as a "long-distance" expatriate pilot for the Korean flag carrier

What first got you interested in aviation?

Growing up on our family farm in KwaZulu Natal, South Africa, watching Piper Pawnee crop sprayers at work over our maize and potato crops triggered a fascination with flying. Secondly, a family friend, a neighbouring farmer who owned a Piper Tripacer, would take us for flights around the district which, as a young boy, awed me. Finally, a ride with a friend in a rented Cessna 172 during my final year at university was probably the most significant inflection point in my life as it convinced me that flying is what I wanted to do.

Where did you go from there? What is your background?

Having gained my private pilot's licence in my final year at the University of Natal in Pietermaritzburg, I studied full-time for my commercial licence at an aviation academy in Johannesburg. I joined Anglo American, flying Beechcraft King Airs and Cessna Citation business aircraft with a brand new licence and instrument rating and a total of 250h.
After two great years in corporate flying, during which time I achieved my airline transport certificate, I joined a domestic airline in South Africa, Flitestar, flying Airbus A320s before moving to the national carrier, South African Airways, where I flew Boeing 737s and 747s. This was followed by Air Mauritius (Airbus A340) and Emirates, where I achieved my airline command on the Boeing 777 and Airbus A330/A340. I am now flying 777s for Korean Air.

What prompted you to join Korean Air?

After seven years in the Middle East, my family and I wanted to return home to South Africa. My previous airline required that one had to be based in Dubai without the option of commuting. Our decision to join Korean Air was therefore based on the fact that as a commuting contract, we are able to live at home.

Describe a typical week

The foreign (expatriate) pilots with Korean Air fly 70-80h a month on average. A typical duty cycle on the 777 involves a combination of two or three trips across the Pacific to North America with 24h or 48h layovers; trips to South-East Asian destinations with an overnight layover and a short turnaround flight to Japan or China.

What do you enjoy most about working at Korean Air?

The fact that we are able to bid for, and are almost always granted, our requested days at home every month; the fact that our flying rosters very rarely change once published; good travel benefits and a clear, unambiguous (!!!) contract. The airline has solid standard operating procedures and a good safety culture.

What do you like the most about the job itself?

Flying the 777, a most enjoyable and satisfying way to earn a living. I enjoy the contrast of the airspace in which we operate - from the frozen void of the northern polar region to the most complex and busy airspaces in the world.

I also enjoy managing the challenges presented by the extreme weather conditions we face, which range from monsoon thunderstorms to the searing heat of a Middle East summer or the brutal cold of a North American or Russian winter.

Roster not stable at EK???????
When top or second top bid you don't get what you want????

SAFETY CULTURE at Korean is the best of all scoops!!!!!:=:ugh::}
They HAVE to hire a certain % of expat to be insured...:rolleyes:

Flight Int displays here what they want you to read,its only a point of view...

Pretty sure next scoop will be the CRM tradition at Korean...:oh::oh:...LOL:}
Anion Azeoo

2010,day 1,post 1...Happy New Year despite the terrible thunderstorms,scaring North Pole routes,terribly challenging Russian metric QFE system,...etc...that we,as national heroes and modern knights,have to face on a day to day basis,with very old fashioned aircrafts...:*

No, rosters at EK are not stable (anymore). And no, I don´t get what I bid for (anymore)! Despite bidding the same way since years, the more senior I get, the less bids I get awarded, even not in my 2 top bid months.
And safety culture in EK? Hm...let me think...oh yeah, of course, our ASR´s are being taken serious, there is no fatigue here and we have a non-punitive reporting culture...
Seems you are flying for another EK than I...

Korean Coming To Town?
 

Rumor has it that Korean is coming to Dubai next month to conduct walk-in interviews for two days. Anyone know the date, location, and time?? Curious minds want to know!!:ok:

... with European dual nationality, otherwise they wouldn't be employed in Europe. I'm sure none of the Korean Air expats (Aussies, Kiwis and others) have Korean nationality. Here is a little difference.:ok:I don't think you can speak for all.:=

Happy New Year!

seems like Korean got their "Captain South Africa"

and

at EK the k(b)idding system apparently works, according to our own special envoys.
Well, judging by the accent of most of the poor buggars spending x-mas on the opposite side of their native country and away from loved ones, I quite frankly think otherwise: It has become as punitive as the rest of the company attitude.

Happy new year anyway, even if spent x-thousand miles away from what you bid for in your top month.

No White Saus was not talking about EK safety culture,but rather about Korean safety culture and records,different...
Safe Flights to you.

Can't see that being true.

Firstly, Korean don't directly employ ex-pats, it goes through agencies.

Secondly, I believe they can staff there entire expat requirement soley from Emirates pilots whohave already applied.

Still, if it is the case, it would be an interesting developement.

maybe they're coming to interview all the applicants??

KAL still does the interview after the contract company have sent them their applivations. It might be cheaper to do them here at the CAE 777 sim and those that pass go for a med there. Just maybe but I don't think so.

Mr etops777, you said:

"Please check your resources before making a such remark. China Airlines was never MANDATED to hire any expats. The need to hire an expats was because not enough locals to filled the seats, PERIOD!"

Guess I hit a nerve. However, for three years (1997-1999) "Lufthansa's" Tecknik AG" was hired to upgrade the level of safety and training for China Airlines pilots and engineers. They brought the Airline's kill ratio down from 5 times the worlds average to something far more respectable. As far as I can tell, Lufthansa's employees were expat's and they changed the company. ...period....

And although KAL does require a certain percentage of expat's on the flight deck, ( as in hired) as far as I know they do not require them on every flight.

Jinglie'd

They really don't have to come to Dubai, Dubai is going to them!!

Chatting to a mate who just got back from the interview and he said most of the guy's there were emirates. They (Korean) said they are not trying to poach emirates pilots, it's the pilot who are applying to them. The main factor
being the basings, you can live where you like. it's as easy as that.

Listen up EK!!!!!:ugh:

Not going to happen.

$$$
 

With 200+ EK applications on the desk at Korean, I would think that it is cheaper to send the Korean recruitment team to Dubai, than send 200 EK guys to Korea.

How do you know ?

I don't think Korean takes expat FO's

You sign a contract as FO or Captain. That is all. Maybe easiest for you to email any agency involved with KAL and ask about the time to upgrade for FO's?

World class ailine
 

Hi Guys,

According to last third century experience Asian people learn much faster than the rest. Also in aviation! They are really working hard to improve their standards and they are quite successful in doing that.
Recent incident statistics prove that the ex-pats are causing already more incidents then the locals! Keep this in mind! KAL is not a second class job anymore; KAL has improved to a world class airline with a world class standard and a very good working environment.
During the Interview process most pilots fail on the sim (between 50 to 70%) and the day after many fail the medical test. Usually only 2 to 3 pilots out of 20 pass the interview. Keep also this in mind when you start thinking of changing your job, it´s not possible to “just passing by and take this job until I get a better one”.

The respect effect
 

It make sense for an airline in need of pilots to hire well trained type rated pilots with heavy world wide experience, looking for better "treatment" and respect (fair ticketing policy, contract and basic conditions consistency, intelligent rosters, etc...) highly motivated by the commuting way of life.

No cost for the company, only bonus by the time loyalty is the key for a mutual respect.

Making sense philosophy and logic is not accessible to everybody.

Making sense philosophy and logic is not accessible to everybody.
 

QED..............

Market trends. One either adjusts or suffers the consequences.

Qed ? Depending From Where You Are
 

QEDQuod Erat Demonstrandum (Latin: Which Was to Be Demonstrated)QEDQuantum ElectrodynamicsQEDQuite Easily DoneQEDQualitative European Drug ResearchQEDQuality Education Data, Inc.QEDQuestion Everything DoneQEDQuadcap Embeddable DatabaseQEDQuantum Effect DesignQEDQueen Elizabeth DriveQEDQueen's Economics Department (Queen's University Kingston, ON, Canada)QEDQuantum Explosion Dynamo (gaming)QEDQuantum Effects DevicesQEDQuantitative Economics DoctorateQEDQuest for Economic Development (UK)QEDQuick EditorQEDQuantum Economic DevelopmentQEDQuest Enabling Designs Ltd. (UK)QEDQuickly and Easily Done (Colloquial: Mathematical proofs)QEDQuality Engineering DirectorateQEDQuickly Ends DandruffQEDQueues Enforth Development, Inc.QEDQuest Engineering DevelopmentQEDQuality Education @ A Distance (AU)QEDQuicktime for EducationQEDQuechua, Ancash, Conchucos, Northern (SIL code, Peru)QEDQuantitative Enterprise DevelopmentQEDQuilting Engineering DivasQEDQuinn Elicits DismayQEDQualifying Educational DataQEDQuick and Easy DrawingsQEDQuality Evaluation for DismantlementQEDQuick Epicenter Determination(s) (USGS)

How do you know ?
 

Volverine, I have seen nothing in print, just going by what a friend has said who flies the 777 for Korean. It could be BS, however he is in recruitment and he is ex EK.

I stand corrected!
'
Jan 30th at the Mecure'.

Tax Man Cometh
 

Word is the folks down under have caught on to the Korean commuting deal and are now starting to "Tax" their Aussie pilots.......is the USA next?:ugh: Makes the pay worth much less.......that being said, guess being in your home country with your family EVERY MONTH is priceless!:ok: Now if I could only get some sleep!!!!! Where am I??????:{