Jazeera Airways
 

Hi Evry1

Any one could be kind enough toshed some light on jazeera Airways.

Who they are and what r there plans.
I had an offer from them.
Any info will b highly appreciated :ok:

Jazeera Airways, the new, privately owned airline of Kuwait, has placed a firm order with Airbus for four A320s and taken options on four more, becoming a new customer.

It plans to begin services in February 2005 with two leased Airbus A320s, serving key business and leisure destinations throughout the Middle East. Initial destinations include Dubai, Bahrain, Amman, Damascus, Beirut and Egypt, with further expansion planned to include cities in the Indian subcontinent. Deliveries of the ordered aircraft will begin in October 2005.

Each of Jazeera’s A320s will seat 165 passengers in an single-class layout. A choice of engines has yet to be made.

“Jazeera Airways will deliver value for money products and services, and our passengers will enjoy the superb reliability and comfort that the Airbus A320 will offer,” says Jazeera Airways Chairman and CEO, Marwan Boodai.

Has any body been offered any jobs at all.if I am not wrong they will be starting there ops in Oct.
Whats their pay like whats their career plan for pilots.

Any info would be highly regarded ;)

You had an offer from them? Then why didn't you ask about terms and conditions at the interview? Just to give you, and others contemplating an interview with another carrier, it sort of goes like this.

Company: "Thank you for coming, do you have any further questions?"

Candidate: "Thank you for inviting me and yes, I do have a couple of questions. I wonder if you could let me know about the remuneration package and promotion prospects? Also, as a relatively new carrier in the Middle East domestic market, what are your growth plans, future destinations etc. and your fleet procurement plans?"

jazzera
 

they are advertising again on todays flt int jobs page re the basic job specs they have been looking now for over a 6 weeks or so and with little luck, mind you who wants to work in kuwait, i was there for 2 years with waste a space (bae) what a dump.

WARNING FOR JAZEERA-AIRWAYS - total lies on F/Os from GulfAir and others
 

I survived to escape from Kuwait but I can only warn all other First Officers who plan to join them or want even to go for interview. They are GREAT CONSCIOUS LIARs !!

I was in the office of the VPO when somebody called and he explained, that Jazeera is looking for at least 10 F/Os to be upgraded after a short time.

Please, don’t do the same mistake as I or we did! You will stuck there!!

It is a total lie, that they need anybody to be upgraded. F/Os who are there since the beginning are stuck. Jazeera is not fulfilling any promise and you have bad or better said none facilities except to work there.

You pay for uniform, you pay for parking - about 40US$ monthly - you pay for adequate housing at least 1.750 US$, there is no extra-payment for flight-time, just for a sector you will earn 23US$ that is all.

If they say they will increase the salary - you should not believe. Number one the senior vice president said that he will not allow any increasing since Air Arabia had some increases after three years, and number two this is very focusing: they have totally wrong numbers of the present paid salary in the Gulf-area. I was applying with a lot of other companies in the area and when I compared my very actual figures to the list they have, nothing is correct. They say the list is from the pilot-union of Kuwait (which consist of Kuwait Airways Pilots only). It might be right, but the list is total wrong. And of course to make it easier for Kuwait Airways Pilots they put their direct competitor on a higher value than themselves. The number of vacation-days is also wrong, many airlines changed to have 45 days instead of 42 and so on.

And Jazeera does not pay any education allowance and is not willing to pay in future. I had a lot of talking to the new COO, who is a German, with non-family. His opinion is, that family is a personal matter and all of the pilots should earn the same. Therefore he will not pay any education allowance. And he was also informed that there is only one pilot in the company with children at a higher age. Totally wrong and everybody keeps lying. There are many expats with children and one of the expat-F/Os he earns less money than he spends in Kuwait for his family!

You pay for immigration totally yourself. If you have a family this will be horrible expensive, only for the third child for a 2 year VISA it is 2000US$ and Jazeera is paying NOTHING NIL NONE.

Each of their promises are not fulfilled and since a month the new management is ignoring them at all, saying this was done by persons who are not in the company any more. They terminated the COO and VPO in December. Now, anything they promise you (and they do a lot) will not be fulfilled including any upgrade. Why should they ??? If so they just terminate their people and that's it. This is the experience of the past and not a single matter has been done to change this behavior.

And even more, as Commander you are not allowed to upgrade any pax from economy to their called Jazeera+ class (where you can eat without paying). If you are scheduled for SIM in DXB you go in economy-class. Also the COO does not want the pilots and cabin crew to have an advantage of their life on board. Although promised at the beginning to jump on any plane in uniform and get a free ride, now you have to pay for it. The COO said this would be unfair to the Ground-Crew. But they simply like to take money from the employees.

This is low cost - but not only for pay - it is low cost for Cockpit-Crew! The COO also told us, you have to work for the company in average 8-10h daily. He compares the job to a job on ground.

Also you are not entitled to have any leave in the first year of service. They also denied people to leave the country for having their divorce in their home-country. It is very sad how they behave to employees.

Furthermore they don't pay salaries. I was sick for a while and they did not pay me as well they did not pay totally another European pilot!
And even worse although written in the contract - you are not health insured by Jazeera Airways. I had myself two doctors visits, I asked for a reimbursement, nothing is paid and the answer from the secretary of VPO was we don not have this. The answer of the financial manager was we do not pay anything concerning this.

Make your own picture but do not believe anything what they are saying. I know that some Captain who just joined from Kuwait Airways are trying to make some F/Os from Gulf Air coming. These Captains are new with Jazeera, they started also wondering about many things themselves and starting to complain regarding the salary and so on. And they say it cannot continue like this. But the management is ignoring them as they ignored anything but pressing money out of crews. It is low cost!

I think it is very unfair to bring people into this company not giving them the complete picture.

Why should anybody leave his old job to join them??? Remember also this: At the beginning we had been 20 pilots, 10 Cpt + 10 FOs. All of us left the old company. But after the start-up, after all checks, we had only been 9!! 3 Capt + 7 FOs. And now, F/O side, we are only 4!!! 10 pilots from the beginning left their jobs and were kicked out by Jazeera. Why do you think if planning to go there, that you are better than these 10?? Why do you want to risk your job now for such an adventure? I don't understand that F/O with 6.000h total time and being Cpt before want to join Jazeera?! You are not better than those who were there and who are there. And none of them is going to be upgraded - NONE and NOBODY. They are all stuck!!

Sorry for these clear words - but do not make the same mistake as all of us did. Meanwhile 3 F/Os left Jazeera recently, including me. And I tell you, I made a surprising-action since Jazeera put a travel-ban of a lot of their ground-stuff who left or planned to leave. They make your live bad and keep you in the country!

You realize that I am talking very bad of them, but this is the truth. If you do not like what I am writing, ignore it. But since I heard this lie and got a proof that they continue lying on everybody (Egyptians, people from Gulf Air, also From Kuwait Airways, and so on) I have just to offer you what I know.

Any more questions? Post it, I will answer...

jazeera slavage
 

yes
i have heard the story from other people who are currently working for jazeera and some who escape as you .....because they wanted to take theirs passport to keep them in K8..

they did not pay people when you are on leave at home andthey do not want to give you ticket to go back home for a leave

i heard one guy from ground staff escape a morning because they were lying to hime since too much time...and it seems that there is as well some funny captain over there who it is not really safe to fly with...
and the worht seems the operations director who harrass copilot in the cockpit telling theme they are on assessment for captain seat ..for how long we donot know but we assess you each flight ..nice slavage guy specially when you know that this guy was retired from k8 airways and came back for flying because he had money problem...imagine the guy who is unable to run his life finacially talking and is in charge of a company ..what a joke as well he has no experience on A320 but he asses them from what i heard from all the jazeera people it is **** over there
and now captain are flyiong together nice and safe and the new CO he takes him self as a godfather...from germany...but for him the ticket to go back in germany are fre of course he is the boss no?
i recently have news from captain over theresas well who are unable to leave easily....defintitely a place to go for holidays...

not trying to be too negative, but i predict a simlar report from when the saudi lowcost airline gets up and swingin.

Trust me! No problem...Join us first and we'll review upwards your contract...Bla!...
 

They all have top class managers... The misery is widespread. Can you really single out anyone who keeps his/her word including the majors? EK and GF might well be still the ones to be in despite all the less favourable threads lately.
Don't think the sand is finer in the neighbour's backyard...
Keep discovering until you find better!!!:ok:

Well ,just to be fair about my previous pal in JZR, which by the way I am still a pilot in, I must say he has the right to be quite pissed off ,which I truly understand, but to be totally honest, he did fail to mention some acts he did in the company which led him to find him self fired at the end of the day, and believe me, when a company like ours fire a co-pilot nowadays ,when we don’t have enough co-pilots to barely operate our schedule, then he must have done something major.
I will not say that every thing is dandy in JZR now, but IT IS a start-up after all, we just had a meeting with our COO and we are getting a pay rise effective 1st of April, it will include school fees, extra flying sector incentive, an increase in housing allowance, and an increase in basic pay, totalling in a 20% increase overall.
Although we still have a long way to go before I myself am convinced that all is fine, I had to reply on my colleague’s post because I know he wrote this post out of revenge rather than sharing facts about JZR.
One more advise to anyone wanting to join JZR, if you are not willing to bear with a start up company with all its chaos in the beginning, I recommend you wait a year or so before this move, if you want to come and do an extra bit of effort and reap any potential this company DOES have to offer, please do...

continously lying
 

@Maxmeldo

Fine that you are still there, but by the way, you did not join JZR from the beginning as I and many of the other 12 of 20 Captains/Copilots did, who are meanwhile fired, not paid or just "pissed of" their behaviour.

You said: "I know he wrote this post out of revenge rather than sharing facts about JZR..."

I am not writing this in the meaning of a revenge and what I posted ARE FACTS, hard to believe, but everything I wrote was 100% true. Now, you are talking about an average total increase of 20% in their payments. Really? Can you post details, how much US$ do you get? For what? And what about other benefits or how you call it "facilities"? What do you get there? Is there meanwhile any airline-agreement to fly on other airlines for reduced fare? I doubt, but you can tell me, how the situation changed!

You came from Kuwait Airways and you still have a lot of benefits from your previous company, of which you actualy profit from. If you like to share the situation as a new expat would have, do not take any advantage out of your previous airline, only take those benefits which you have in JZR (which is just a single one).

- It is easy to come after the start-up has been made by other pilots.

- It is easy to come to JZR to accept a lower salary there, but together with the only for you paid pension (because being retired in Kuwait Airways) you have a higher income than you had in Kuwait Airways and a higher salary as the an expat-Cpt would have. This applies only for Cpt like you, who finally blocked our upgrades. I really do not want to say this is your fault, it was JZR managment, who offered you our promised and writtenly confirmed upgrades. If I were you, I would have done the same, most probably.

- It is easy to come to JZR and knowing to leave JZR when WATANIYA-Airline starts and to suffer from the situation only a few months.

- It is easy to join JZR as a Kuwaiti, not paying anything for immegration. Do you know, how much this Expat-Copilot paid to have his wife and three kids with him? Do you know how much of his JZR-salary left after paying the school-fees? All of you who came to JZR after the ex-VPO left do not have those problems and those costs.

- It is easy to join JZR and then after a few weeks saying that there should be some changes. And while you are waiting only 2 or three months, there are others waiting 6 or more months to get a little bit of those things, which made all of them coming to JZR and bringing this airline into the air. And while not having anything of those things promised or even those benefits of the contract - it is not easy to enjoy life in Kuwait.

- It is easy to join JZR while having another health-insurance and not need to take care about this. Can you deny that also a Kuwaiti-Trainings-Captain reminded JZR of the none-insured-condition in 2005 as helath-insurance is a part of the contract? And what happend? Nothing, except this Captain did not further accept the respectless behaviour of JZR-Managment and left!

But if I were you, I would have to check the situation from a different point of view, the point of view of an expat, who left a nice job in order to get an upgrade within 6 months after the start-up. To show you the written confirmation, it says "to be upgraded in March or April 2006"!

I really cannot stand the way JZR tries to get Copilots from somewhere else. I already posted, that I was in the VPO-office when a Copilot called and he told to the Copilot that JZR is presenty looking for at least 10 Copilots to be upgraded within this year, which is - in fact - a big lie.

And this is not a revenge, this is sharing facts - true facts! Everybody must decicde himself to jon JZR or not. But they should have the correct picture of the airline before deciding.

So as it seems, you have failed once again to mention some other facts, which both you and I know that if you did mention them, they would have not served your cause. If you’re taking about facts, which I doubt, then these are the facts I know;

Fact 1:

You do NOT pay for uniform, although it is mentioned in the contract, you clearly know that they never collected its cost and it was disregarded as an item in our contracts.

Fact 2:

As mentioned before salaries were increased, too bad for you, details are not your concerns now are they?:hmm:

Fact 3:

I don’t come from Kuwait Airways, I am an expat just as you are, and I played a major role in the start up, I’d say that you cant compare both our roles by far, since you forgot to mention that you had disappeared in your home country in the midst of heavy operations on the lame excuse of being sick for one whole month, putting all your fellow pilots on overdrive to cover your unplanned absence, and before you dared to show up again, you called VP-OPS and YOU were afraid that if you came back, that you passport will be seized and he assured you that no such things happen so you came back!!! After you came back, the incident you did in Beirut (which I will not go into its detail to save you some face water) was the reason you got fired, you don’t threat airlines to ground their planes at offshore destinations to fulfill you needs and get away with it, or do you??
If you did this in Germany, you’d be in jail now.:yuk:

Fact 4:

If it’s so easy to join the new company opening in Kuwait, Watanya, why didn’t you wait to join it? No training pilot left this company as you assumed, the captain your talking about is here and is here to stay.

Fact 5:

Its no surprise that you pay for your residencies, it is mentioned in the contract you signed! Schools are covered now in the new pay scheme, I haven’t heard the father of 3 complaining, it seems that you care for his kids more than he does.:hmm:

Fact 6:

Both you and I know for sure that there was no written item in the contract stating that you will be upgraded in March or April 2006; this is a load of crap, even YOU used to mention all the time that it was a verbal promise of the former VP-OPS, that’s your side of the story, and I really don’t give you that much credibility after all. Even if what you say it’s true, you should have some common sense to know that in order to upgrade, there must be substitute pilots do fill your seat on the right, which in March were not available, little bit self centered are we?:hmm:

Fact 7:

I don’t think it’s decent of a pilot to eaves drop on phone calls, especially when his fellow German national is the one speaking!!!! I thought both of you were dear friends.:yuk:

Fact 8:

Upgrade is due in September this year, I know you don’t believe me, but time will tell, and come September, you’ll feel sorry you did not have enough patience and foresight.

I would just like to note that it’s a pity I have to lay out the facts I did in a manner that might hurt an ex colleague, but once again there is no intent of revenge in the way I am offering my point of view.

One thing you mentioned I must agree on, every one must decide for him self after having a CORRECT picture of JZR, not your own version of what to expect, it’s not our fault you don’t know where your best interest is, and you should be responsible enough to bear the results of your own mistakes.

MAX :cool:

Well.....at least we are witnessing both sides of the picture...no middle road guys here....:}

sheryas777
 

I am a regular reader of this page, what I do not understand and wish to know is why you the expat, once you are in a secured job you start looking for other. Have had meetings and discussions with many pilots and others, who came to the Gulf and mainly to Gulf air and then they find themselves joining other airlines,EK,QR,EY and those small ones. It's their right of course to move for better opportunities, but they must understand, that Gulf air is the institute of the aviation not only in the Arabian Gulf but in whole the Middle East.
I agree that Gulf air is not growing like others but, it's a reliable and organized, with secured and clean working environment.
Best of wishes for all: cool:

News flash

Our dear ex pal seemed to have forgotten to return the car that our bad company gave to him in good faith for his own personal use, you insist on stating that your post was not for revenge but for fact sharing, but yet you don’t return the car to the company and no one knows its where abouts? If this is not an act of vengeance then you seem to not know the meaning of the word, get a life, and oh, buy a dictionary.:yuk:

I am starting to feel ashamed of even calling you an ex colleague. :yuk: :yuk: :yuk:

MAX

Where's a pair of boxing gloves when you need one .......................
:E

No boxing gloves - but:
http://www.forums.gamerskrew.com/ima...ing_smiley.gif
http://www.forums.gamerskrew.com/images/smilies/305.gif

Not taking sides here but it's funny that we have a guy here telling someone to buy a dictionary and then keeps referring to him as an "ex college"??? Did you go to school in him or something? I think the word you are looking for is "colleague", which is "a fellow member of a profession".:ok:

also looking to get a job from the region so I find this kind of truths very interesting.We have heard stories from the both sides and I think it is your call now, survivedJZR

Thanks AirNo, no wonder I thought it looked funny.I'll by a dickshonary wright away;)

MAX:ok:

Reading this post with humour I had to comment....I don't get it... SurvivedJZR says it's all lies at Jazeera but everything he is complaining about seems to be just that, complaints and not lies. Education allowances, uniforms, staff travel, etc, etc, etc - if the company doesn't want to give them, then why fault them. Yeah it might not be ideal or in some cases fair but if you don't like it, leave then.

Anyway, that's my two cents worth!

SurvivedJZR...
 

...And why should a pilot as you, with wife and three kids, be entitled to more benefits [or pay] than a single pilot...? Needless to say, the amount of "baggage" that you bring along isn't the airline's responsibility. :{

truth is not what was posted
 

Sure, I will do. But since I am enjoying presently some vacations, I really do not want to waste too much time on this.

All what I said was true for my time being there AND since there are no details from MAX about salary-increasement, it looks like there is not any. It is easy to write down all those facts putting me in a bad shape. But most of them are not like I experienced them. Furthermore all the time it is easy to talk about upgrades which might come down the road FROM A CAPTAINs POINT OF VIEW. But I mentioned to have those upgrade-promise writtenly confirmed, so please MAX, if you post something, stay with the truth.

Just as an example, it is nice, that you say something about a car - if this matter belongs to the company, could you tell me, why nobody asked me from the company for it?

I guess, they do not like to face the problem of paying me for the last month and to pay a 3months notice and to reimburse my costs of some doctors visits in KUWAIT. By the way, are you health-insured by the company and got a reimbursement of your costs? I guess not but if so why do they not reimburse others docots bills?

I still wait for any investigation of that what is said "happened in BEIRUT". You were not with us, but it seamed, you got a briefing, what the company is saying, what has happened. FAIRNESS is something which does not take place in JZR and of course, for the company: it is more easy to invent some happenings for the company point of view instead of just showing a professional behaviour and pay a 3months notice.

By the way, which fact did you mention for those people being with JZR at the beginning? Meanwhile only 6 of 20 PILOTS are with JZR - what is YOUR STATEMENT about the fact that only 6 remained?

I do not want to give any "friendly advice" but those PILOT-colleagues outside JZR may vary their dicission on the comments in this FORUM. I am a very honest person and not a SHOWMAN - but I cannot understand why people can post lies while aming for other PILOTS to join this airline. Of course I am very sad for all my Ex-FO-colleagues, which can only get any upgrade, after enough (more than 21) FOs has joine the airline. YES it is bad for my ex-colleagues to post this, but it is the truth. And it is the decission of my ex-FO-colleagues to accept this situation, not mine.

For me a job does not mean only something - it has a lot of influence in many directions and I am not only talking for family reasons.

Sorry, but I (and ALL First Officer colleagues) cannot lie on their friends - or how would you comment the FACT that all of us First Officers had friends in other arlines who just waited to join JZR as we did and then to be in the line for the upgrade. But they waited for a proof ...... can you deny that nobody joined?

I could continue with a lot of others items - but I realized to spend more time than I wanted. Sure I will continue from home, to give others an idea of the situation ......

"ex college" is almost german , we call that mixing 'denglisch'(deutsch-englisch).
"Ex-Kollege" would be the german expression.:}

...it's a reliable and organized, with secured and clean working environment. :bored:

Say again please!

Ok pal,

You do keep insisting on knowing the salary increment, it’s of no use to you now, or are you having second thoughts? its quite childish to think I am only pulling your leg, after all a salary increment is not some thing you can imagine, and unlike you, I don’t have the nerve of making facts up and posting them on a public forum,

It is quite bold of you on the other hand to confess on a public forum that you did actually conceal the car the company gave you, so the lesson your teaching us is that as long as people don’t miss there stuff, its okay to assume they don’t require it? Talk about decency:yuk:

I think you have an issue of reading and understanding contract phraseology, it is clearly stated in your contract that “IF YOUR EMPLOYMENT SHOULD BE TERMINATED BY THE COMPANY FOR ANY REASON OTHER THEN UNWILLFULL CONDUCT, YOU WIIL RECEIVE THREE MONTHS NOTICE”, and I reckon taking an aircraft hostage in an offshore destination can be regarded as unwillfull conduct, not to mention a crime, regardless of the fine details you assume I don’t have.

Mean while, both of us know that JZR is very selective in its pilot standards, only a handful made it through the sim check, you were one of them, so the fact that we are only a few is in your favor, the fact that you left is in our favor.

Credibility is a big part of a pilot’s character, in my point of view, you have no such asset, as for the people reading this thread, I cannot decide for them, these are the facts I am certain of, I have nothing to hide.

MAX:ok:

"Did you go to school in him or something"
airnoservicesaustralia, i think we all need to buy a dictionary and or take english grammar lessons.
:{

Well - as for Dictionaries - you don't have to buy them - you find them online! :)
Alpha-Dictionary:
http://www.alphadictionary.com/langdir.html
The Free Dictionary:
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/
And there are many others out!
Now you know where to find out how to spell the words! Now go and use it as well! :eek: I don't want to see any wrong spellings anymore! :*
If Dany would get a cent for a dozen spelling mistake on all the forums - he'd be a rich man now! :ok:

[quote=MAXMEDLO]Ok pal,




UNWILLFULL CONDUCT
What is that? Is it something that one does unwillingly? No joke, I really don't know.

What to say, to a stupid person, who does not understand

facts
 

facts are from infos we have from the 3 guys who escaped :
no one of them were paid for their month before they left !:\
no one of them have the yearly ticket to come back!:eek:
no one of them were upgrade as initially promised within few months!!:E

and the rise of salary happen because people were escaping from there if thsi would not happen all would have remain the same specially form the mother ****er on the ground who is saying that pilots are doing a routine job...:sad: :ok: :ok: :ok:
nice jazeera :p and thank you for the kake expat captin who now kisssing the ass of the management who is he ?

"captain Ramadan" or "captain wind in the noze"
:E :E :E

upgrade
 

upgrade is due ????
no the assesment will start in september ..for how long .. looooooong :cool: winter of sweating from the k8 training captains..they know how to make "ascetic ideal " GGOOOD they wil do it the way they do it in k8 airways...
enjoy :eek: :eek: :eek:
so yes upgrade is DUE:8 :E
tank GOD for that !!! wich one who ever you want want to prey... :p

And you are saying???????:confused: :confused:

I hope you dont express your self in that way when you are talking to a controller,I dont have a f:mad: king clue what your getting at.

MAX

I agree with MaxM, this thread is a load of cr@p.

read my message
 

Please, be so kind to wait for a few days more, then I am back from vacation and surely reply on your posts.

I am enjoying my vacation, why should I spend too much time for this? I will spend the time when I have returned home...

And it is so nice, to see all your smileys - my ex-colleague :)

Just sounds like the growing pains experienced by all new airlines....agreed one needs a special kind of patience to see it all through...one reason I stay away from new start ups..did it once, never again:(

JAZEERA AIRWAYS
 

First Officer Posted 20 Apr 06 Close date18 May 06 Location Middle East Apply for this Job
Job Description PILOT THE FREEDOM MOVEMENT
FIRST OFFICERS WANTED FOR JAZEERA AIRWAYS
Jazeera Airways is on a mission – to spread the wings of freedom across the region. Freedom of choice, freedom from overpricing, freedom to fly on your own terms. Join the freedom movement and spread joy and happiness in people’s lives… and yours.
Requirements:
• ICAO ATPL
• 45 years of age or younger
• 3,000 total flying hours on jets, 1,500 of which must be logged on turbine engine aircraft with a maximum weight of 30,000kgs or more
• Minimum 500 hours on an A320
What does this freedom mean to YOU?
• First Officer Upgrade Programme
• Opportunity to move into Management and Training
• Heavily subsidized travel on Jazeera Airways
• Attractive, tax-free salary
• Housing, children’s education, car allowance
• Incremental sector payment scheme (amounting to US$ 8,400/- approx.)
• End of service benefits
Want to know exactly what it feels like to fly for Jazeera Airways? Talk to one of our First Officers (Kuwaiti, Algerian, Canadian, and Egyptian). Call us on 965 4333304, xtn 215.
Otherwise, you can send your CV to [email protected]
Fly for Jazeera Airways. It’s an uplifting experience.
******************************************************
Has anyone shed any feelings on this company?

They certainly have..... check out and decide for yourself..

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=219377

Mutt

Glued
 

Who gives a rats Ar*e about the spelling and gramma... I am rivited by this thread.

Way better than anything on TV.

Actually would make a good script!

:} :} :}

The only freedom you don't have is to leave Kuwait at your own discretion