Aksai Oiler

I'm looking at a project in the Shaybah field; could anyone advise me how frequent are the Saudi Aramco flights to OESB ? Either by replying to this message or PM

Thanks

Oiler

Panama Jack

I believe OESB flights are at least daily.

jackx123

it's all on the aramco web. as far as pilots there is a shortage of helicopter jocks

Plzbegood

Hi all. I have embr 170 and 737 experiance. I was looking at applying at ARAMCO but heard through a friend that used to work there that the aviation departments, fixed wing and heli are going to be out sourced in the next few years. Does anyone that works there currently know anything about this? Would it be worth while to come across even for a short period of time?

Thanks in advance.

CaptainProp

No idea about outsourcing but they are recruiting for "fixed wing" pilots now.

Mach Speed

I'm new to the forum. Can any Aramco Aviation guy answer the following questions for me please?

1. What is the interview process like?
2. What is their hiring criteria for new FOs?
3. How long after the interview do they inform you of their decision?

Thanks a lot..

jackx123

What is the interview process like?
You need to complete the online application. After that there is a very rigorous background check as if you apply for the agency. Trust me they check everything, medical record from birth onwards, including all jabs needed etc..

What is their hiring criteria for new FOs?
As stated on the web. Unless you match the criteria. Don't bother applying

How long after the interview do they inform you of their decision?
Depends but usually 2-3 months and another 2-3 for work permits etc to be sorted. However, it's taken 6-8 months to be called for the interview in some cases. If successful you will be given an assistant to guide you through the whole process.

aallie007

hi

i want to do a CPL course

do u know of any companies that hire fresh CPL holders?

what are other ways of building hours?

anyone know what are the minimum requirements for Saudia airlines?

thanks

jackx123

http://www.pprune.org/middle-east/41...o-program.html

Mach Speed

Thanks Jackx...appreciate it. Are you flying for Aramco? What capacity and what aircraft?

Sattyrant

Good day guys, Can anyone give me details about Saudi Aramco pilot interview? I have a scheduled interview for the end of the month. Any info that can be helpful! Thanks.

Cair117

Gentleman good day, current Nas air 190 capt from the US looking to jump ship to aramco. Can any current guy pm me about QOL, pay and bennies. Much appreciated.

M8ndy

Hi I currently do cabin crew & love my job it has always been my dream. I'm now looking to work on a private jet for families ideally 1 month on 1 month off i have searched the Internet & what iv found is it's based on luck been found on the job.if anyone has any info that would be lovely thank you.

Hivibegirl

Hi I can give you only what I know and I will be truthful. I worked for saudi aramco and it has taken a long 7 years to get my life sorted out again. I am also looking for more people with the same experiences. Please think carefully before you work for them. I am a private flight attendant and an honest one with good work ethics. I was bullied endlessly to date the passengers and accept money from them.. all different people with different bullying techniques. I was threatened with the sack if I didnt take illegal money and tell lies to the pilots. I said I wouldnt do this as it is not team work. I was told I might lose my job. My supervisors never once backed me up. They also saw me being molested by a pax. I ended up drugged and questioned a military technique by some marines, who also work for aramco... In hospital having a near death experience... Drugged and questioned again which is actually and scarily a recognised form of torture. All because I spoke up and asked questions. I also told the lawyer that as our contracts were illegal if all the girls were prostitutes then this company might be in trouble.. They are the most corrupt company with no respect for human life.. This is true and there are many false rumours you might here about the story.. Its taken me 7 years to feel safe, hundreds of letter liasing with MP s in the UK, newspapers, saudi government and washington.. I know I can sue but they very nearly destroyed my life.. This was just the beginning by the way.. No health care and bullying techniques and even telling untrue stories about what happened to me... Even in hospital the denials have been incredible but it has been hard work for 7 years to get my story out there.. Please dont work for them... If I tell my true story others will come forward and I think we will all see the truth of this company. Yours Sincerely Maxine x

Hivibegirl

Please dont work for them they have no respect for human life at all... I am hoping more people will come forward with there stories.. Probably all cabin crew but possibly others... Please think carefully before you go to work with saudi aramco, I am lucky to be alive and had no health care no support as it was easier to deny my story than deal with the fact that I was somehow drugged and questioned. They worried more about an insurance pay out, and pretty much tried to get rid of me. Literally.. Please dont work for them... Yours Sincerely Maxine x

Riggwelter

I'm almost embarrassed to dignify the previous post with a response. "Maxine's" claims about working conditions in Aramco defy belief. I can only surmise that someone is trolling, or very bored.
Anyone who does even a cursory search will see that this story falls into a category of its own.
I've already wasted enough of my time any everyone else reading this by addressing the claim with a response.

FuelLeak

7 years! I left after 1 month. Even the chief pilot at that time was diagnose as bipolar and he was in charge!

aramcawy

I read this whole thread and can safely say that it does contain a lot of accurate information especially for expats.

Having working for 15 years as Aramco employee ( 5 of them in aviation ) I can also confirm the statement " Saudi F/O's" are the least paid pilots. US expat are those most paid. We have a US pilot currently flying as a PIC in the NG 737 who was previously in the ERJ fleet that is paid 25000$+ a month!! The most in the world u could argue!!

It is very difficult to work in an environment where you absolutely now that the person sitting next to you, who is not doing anything extra or even or than what you are doing and still get paid 3 or 4 times your salary!! The only difference is the passport color.

I had a talk with one of the pilots ( an expat of course) saying that his salary pays for his mortgage back home, his bills, and still pocket some!! While the locals are barely can pay the cars installments and the double loans ( company and bank) just for one house!!!! Let's not forget kids school and other monthly expenses!!! By the way the company does not provide any education allowance for locals!!! Nor family allowance!! Those extra salaries we get every year over the other payrolls?!!! Barely cover the expenses I mentioned above!! So I don't want anyone jumping on my case about them.

Local pilot pay (F/O) = 4500$ total package!! ( 15 salaries + 15% vac annually)
Expat pilot = ??????? ( dare to say it's not at least double the local)

SO,.......

The company pays you a basic salary, pays for your taxes, pays for your wife, pays for your kids education, pays for medical, pays for your sick leaves, pays for your visit home, and after all that are still bitching about small stuff like Iqama and work schedule?!!!! Give a break!! What else do you want?!!

This company is a heaven for US expat. Come enjoy it while it lasts. Just don't question our attitudes toward you cuz now you know the truth.

mutt

OK, I will bite, what will your salary raise to once you get into the left seat and get seniority? What amount of your final salary will you get as a monthly pension? If you don't like it, go join the airline across at the main terminal, $25-30,000 per month is extremely common for expats and locals with seniority.

Riggwelter

Hey Mutt,

Its a valid question, however, Aramco, being an Oil company has a unique answer.

Basically all employees salaries/benefit packages are based on nationality, and vary greatly, these are called payrolls. For example, UK nationals receive a lot of "cash on the barrelhead" but no medical benefits, whereas a Saudi does not receive as generous a cash outlay but instead has medical retirement as well as an interest free loan for a home, and free land. He (excuse the pronoun, but all the pilots are male) also gets medical treatment for his parents, neat huh?

American payroll is probably is the best, cash, benefits etc. I won't go into the details but I've never heard an American pilot complain about renumeration, and us being pilots, thats saying a lot!

Now, getting back to your question, what happens when you make Captain? Well, amazingly, not a whole lot. Our salary structure is based on grade codes (pay grades) similar to the US military; each pay grade has a range and based on performance (very subjective, i might add) you get a performance category, the better the category, the more the annual merit increase. There is a lot of overlap between pay grades, so a lower pay grade with more years of service may actually make more than a new hire with a higher pay grade but less years of service, and hence, less merit increases.

So, when that magic day comes that you assume command, and shoulder all the responsibility inherent to command, what happens pay wise? Nothing. Typically you will make the exact same amount you made the month before as an F/O.

As we are an oil company and not an airline all company employee merit increases are are awarded once a year in July. They range between 2.5-10.0% based on performance (subjectively evaluated) as well as payroll (If a Saudi and an American both received a "Superior" rating, all things being equal (theres formulas) the American payroll typically pays out about 30-40% more (i.e the saudi would get a 7.0% increase vs. 10% for the American). Also, the company does not differentiate between being an engineer, lawyer, or pilot per se, everyone uses the same grade code salary structure.

So, for example, a junior copilot is grade code 11, the same as a junior engineer, and both of their salaries are equal on day one. By the time you make senior captain (grade code (GC) 16) an engineer will have maxed out as "just an engineer" at grade code 14, and would have to move into management to keep up GC wise, or specialize in his field to the point he became a Consultant or Principle Professional (the petroleum engineering Doctorate that invents new ways of finding oil for the company, publishes, creates patents, etc). GC 16 effectively puts you in the top 5% of the company, and is a decent place to be.

But I digress. Basically when you become a Captain you are "eligible" to move up a grade code, but in principle it might take 1-3 years. It certainly, almost never happens in a few months. When you do get grade code promotion they add another 5% to your normal merit increase. Thats it. Every time I moved up through the fleets my salary didn't change 1 riyal until merit increase time, which could be many months away. Typical merit increases range in the 3-8% range, annually, with the lions share in the middle of that range.

As someone who's been here a while, I can say with confidence I do not know of a single Saudi who was making more than $8,000 base salary when they made Boeing Captain. A fresh, off the boat American Co-pilot in the Dash-8 (GC-11) will make $8,500 base salary. Hence, some of the tension.

Having said that, this is only a snapshot of the situation.

Almost all of the Saudi's got full ride scholarships for flight school, graduated with 250 hours, and moved into a guaranteed position in the right seat of a jet, with a decent base salary (about $2,500). To be sure, they are the bright, motivated young men, and they were able to capitalize on the circumstances afforded them, worked hard and made it. There aren't any freebies in Aramco.

Compare that to the westerner who paid for his own training, flew as a CFI for 3 years for food, worked at a commuter and shared a flop house with other pilots while earning servants wages while working very hard, as well as enduring the vagaries of our industry. And you could argue they had a tougher time making it into an Aramco cockpit. To me, there is a significant dollar value that could be correlated to those two situations.

As a Saudi/American(I'm a Mutt, too!), I have enjoyed the benefit of my country and the company's support. It would be truthful to say they made me the man I am, and I'm grateful for the opportunity to pursue my dream. At the same time, I could go to the States, get on with an airline, and try my luck, and make the "real bucks".

No thanks.

While the pay isn't amazing, the benefits are, good medical, good housing, good retirement, SECURITY etc. Aramco is the long game.

A saudi's salary is like an inverse bell curve. At 250 hours, your flying in a jet making $2,500. Thats really good. At 3,000 hours your a captain on an ERJ making $5,000, that kinda stinks. At 10,000 hours you've been flying for 15 years and now your making $10,000 cash on top of all the benefits, and thats pretty darn good. If you put in 35 years with Aramco, as a Saudi, as of today, max salary for a GC 16 is north of $15,000, and retirement with 35 years of service will give you almost full pay for the rest of you AND your wives (fruedian slip, there?) lives, as well as full medical, and a very, very generous housing program.

I've compared renumeration between a US airline and Saudi Aramco (as a Saudi) and I could not do better than staying here, in the long run.

Mutt, I appreciate you calling the topic out, its a valid question.

But not getting anything extra(money wise) for moving from the right seat to the left seat stinks.