United pilots welcome return of furloughed aviators
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Laker:
Geebz,
I think your FO was blowing smoke up your as$. 6 year narrowbody FO pay at UAL is 118/hour. Lets pretend he flew 100 hours for the month. In addition instead of getting 9 hours credit for two turns he got 18 on each. So that puts him at 118 credit hours for the month. I'm not even sure UAL will build a line to 100 hours credit. But lets say he somehow reached this 118 value then his gross pay would be $13,924.
Not even in the same neighborhood as what you quoted. To reach 23k/month at $118/hour your buddy would have to be approaching 195 credit hours per month. Never going to happen at UAL. Not even SWA...
Laker,
My friend credited over 200 hours in 1 month when displaced and picking up trips for 2x and averages 120 credit hours per in a normal month on 5 year 737 FO pay with night override etc. Saw the pay details to prove it. Quite impressive.
Geebz,
I think your FO was blowing smoke up your as$. 6 year narrowbody FO pay at UAL is 118/hour. Lets pretend he flew 100 hours for the month. In addition instead of getting 9 hours credit for two turns he got 18 on each. So that puts him at 118 credit hours for the month. I'm not even sure UAL will build a line to 100 hours credit. But lets say he somehow reached this 118 value then his gross pay would be $13,924.
Not even in the same neighborhood as what you quoted. To reach 23k/month at $118/hour your buddy would have to be approaching 195 credit hours per month. Never going to happen at UAL. Not even SWA...
Laker,
My friend credited over 200 hours in 1 month when displaced and picking up trips for 2x and averages 120 credit hours per in a normal month on 5 year 737 FO pay with night override etc. Saw the pay details to prove it. Quite impressive.
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Yes, UA does offer trips at 200% pay when they are facing a crew shortage. These trips are assigned in seniority order for pilots who request to be put on the list. It is referred as 'Senior Manning' or 'SRM'. It happened pretty frequently this summer on weekends, but it is definitely challenging to pick these trips up. In regards to having the seniority to get called and having the days off to fit a SRM trip in, I would be very surprised if you could pull this off more than a few times a year.
Unless you really need or want to be back home in the US, leaving a WB CA position at EK to become a NB FO at UA does not seem like a good move in terms of lifestyle or pay; but again, I have no idea what it is like to work for EK. Good luck with your decision.
Unless you really need or want to be back home in the US, leaving a WB CA position at EK to become a NB FO at UA does not seem like a good move in terms of lifestyle or pay; but again, I have no idea what it is like to work for EK. Good luck with your decision.
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Falcon,
I stand corrected. I saw a UAL 787 First Officer payslip online that showed 29k for the month. That's nearly 120,000AED! Maybe there will be a lot of americans leaving EK. It will be interesting to see what happens in 2014.
I stand corrected. I saw a UAL 787 First Officer payslip online that showed 29k for the month. That's nearly 120,000AED! Maybe there will be a lot of americans leaving EK. It will be interesting to see what happens in 2014.
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JuniorMan...
You have NO idea what its like to fly here at EK. We are all guilty until we can prove or convince those in power we are innocent.... unless they've already made up their minds, which does happen here!
Chief pilots saying things like, "You do this again and I'll bury you in the sand"
Flying 90-92 hours every month with trips to North and South America one week and then China/Japan the next week messing up circadium rhythm.
Contract changes with each email from HR we get a few times per year...
Bidding restrictions increased to allow for the company to fly all of us to right up to max without having the ability to "avoid" like we used to.
Waking up one morning to find the over time threshold had been unilaterally changed from 78 hours to 92 hours.
No more overtime pay at all as not allowed to either trip trade nor be assigned over 92 hours for any reason any month..... not that you'd want to!!
The list goes on and on and on......
K
You have NO idea what its like to fly here at EK. We are all guilty until we can prove or convince those in power we are innocent.... unless they've already made up their minds, which does happen here!
Chief pilots saying things like, "You do this again and I'll bury you in the sand"
Flying 90-92 hours every month with trips to North and South America one week and then China/Japan the next week messing up circadium rhythm.
Contract changes with each email from HR we get a few times per year...
Bidding restrictions increased to allow for the company to fly all of us to right up to max without having the ability to "avoid" like we used to.
Waking up one morning to find the over time threshold had been unilaterally changed from 78 hours to 92 hours.
No more overtime pay at all as not allowed to either trip trade nor be assigned over 92 hours for any reason any month..... not that you'd want to!!
The list goes on and on and on......
K
Last edited by Kapitanleutnant; 19th Sep 2013 at 08:58.
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Reading about all these big pay cheques/checks (spell it how you want) at United does make me salivate, BUT like anything, I would go out on a whim and say that it'd only be a very small group of pilots who'd be in the position to make this sort of cash.
People in years gone by would always point at what a US Major widebody Captain makes an hour (whatever it was $400-500 an hour back then etc), but that would only be made after 25 years at a company at the top of the seniority list, eg a very small group of people. The general pilot community at the majors do not make this sort of cash. And the amount of years it'd take to become a widebody captain in order to make that sort of cash would still take many, many years.
Quality of life is subjective (though personally I would go back to the US in a heartbeat) - BUT I will say, I don't think I can afford to. I've looked at all the Major airline pay scales and I can say it'd take many, many years for me to make anywhere close to the sort of sums being spoken about on here. So many years, that I hope by that time I'll have been done and dusted with this industry. I hope I'm wrong, but numbers do not lie. Just go on to APC and check out the hourly rates and you can have a rough idea of what you'll make. And those rates and nowhere near any of the figures being spoken about on here (unfortunately).
BTW - I am NOT a United furloughee.
People in years gone by would always point at what a US Major widebody Captain makes an hour (whatever it was $400-500 an hour back then etc), but that would only be made after 25 years at a company at the top of the seniority list, eg a very small group of people. The general pilot community at the majors do not make this sort of cash. And the amount of years it'd take to become a widebody captain in order to make that sort of cash would still take many, many years.
Quality of life is subjective (though personally I would go back to the US in a heartbeat) - BUT I will say, I don't think I can afford to. I've looked at all the Major airline pay scales and I can say it'd take many, many years for me to make anywhere close to the sort of sums being spoken about on here. So many years, that I hope by that time I'll have been done and dusted with this industry. I hope I'm wrong, but numbers do not lie. Just go on to APC and check out the hourly rates and you can have a rough idea of what you'll make. And those rates and nowhere near any of the figures being spoken about on here (unfortunately).
BTW - I am NOT a United furloughee.
Last edited by BritishGuy; 19th Sep 2013 at 09:34.
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Filipino is right, more leave the more demand . It's all about supply and demand.If every American went back it would not change my work load, but the end result may be an increase in the package.
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Dont forget that AA reaches pay parity to Delta and United in 2016, so these numbers are way off.
Also, trip and duty rigs, night and international overrides bring monthly compensation much higher than just looking at the hourly rate.
Also, trip and duty rigs, night and international overrides bring monthly compensation much higher than just looking at the hourly rate.
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Burnable, if that is your only goal in life is command, other places are better suited than legacies in the US. In the late 70's, early 80's there were many who spent YEARS on the engineer's seat before senior enough to make it to f/o. Then maybe a decade more to the left seat. My point, many stayed senior, fully enjoyed their life with fantastic rosters, sometimes made more money in a wide body right seat than counterparts in narrow left seats and moved to the left when the time was right.
Yes, there may be a few not so enjoyable years in the beginning on reserve, but I will take reserve at any US legacy over what one experiences here in the ME.
And finally, I will take any 80 hour month with duty rigs over 92 hours of mind numbing hard hours with ULR augmenting time not counting towards monthly credit when not in an operating seat, no matter what seat I would happen to be in. In my opinion only, having done both sides of the equation, rejecting a recall from any US carrier, even leaving a wide body left seat, would be utterly foolish, from a long term career perspective. And I won't even get into the long term health effects of the flying required of one, with regard to ME carriers.
Yes, there may be a few not so enjoyable years in the beginning on reserve, but I will take reserve at any US legacy over what one experiences here in the ME.
And finally, I will take any 80 hour month with duty rigs over 92 hours of mind numbing hard hours with ULR augmenting time not counting towards monthly credit when not in an operating seat, no matter what seat I would happen to be in. In my opinion only, having done both sides of the equation, rejecting a recall from any US carrier, even leaving a wide body left seat, would be utterly foolish, from a long term career perspective. And I won't even get into the long term health effects of the flying required of one, with regard to ME carriers.
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Don't forget one thing - Even if a fairly large group of US pilots packs up and leaves the ME I am guessing that absolutely NOTHING will happen with the T&Cs for those that stay behind. Too many South American and Asian pilots willing to come and work in the ME for that to happen.
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Burnable Gomi : "American: 9079 out of 9600 will retire by the end of 2033 (20 years from now). So that makes you number 521 on the list in 20 years. 620 airframes makes 15.5 pilots/airframe or 7.75 captains. So the highest paid position you can get at number 521 in 20 years is 767 captain at $181/hr (+ a variable rise of the next 3 years). "
Not sure how you figure seniority 521 would be a 767 Captain in 20 years.
Right now the bottom 777 Captain at American is seniority 1223 and the bottom 767 Captain is seniority 4169.
Not sure how you figure seniority 521 would be a 767 Captain in 20 years.
Right now the bottom 777 Captain at American is seniority 1223 and the bottom 767 Captain is seniority 4169.
Last edited by viking767; 20th Sep 2013 at 04:05.
