Ek Airbus upgrades delays
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It logical that the commands are slipping.
When we had 10 aircraft the youngest FO would be captain then the fleet doubled. 10 to 20 aircraft is quickly done i the gulf.
Now with 100 aircraft they need 200 for the same guy to make captain (baring no retirements and V Australia resignations). That could take some time, no?
When we had 10 aircraft the youngest FO would be captain then the fleet doubled. 10 to 20 aircraft is quickly done i the gulf.
Now with 100 aircraft they need 200 for the same guy to make captain (baring no retirements and V Australia resignations). That could take some time, no?
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Nothing is logical Payscale.
When your course date has been displayed on the portal for several months, and you have a personal letter from 'Fleet Management' on your dining room table stating your course date and telling you to get all your pre command bits done such as Psyc, Tech test and Interview (hope that answers your question B Bonga?), only to have a crappy XL spreadsheet suddenly appear on the portal saying your course is delayed indefinately (with little or no logical reason) and not a personal letter from the same person----now thats illogical and piss poor man management and basically unprofessional and 'kin rude------now that would be bad enough right? Then to find out that DEC's are gonna take your command spot???? Just think about it guys, its one big kick in the balls! (not to mention the fact that people had actually planned the rest of the year accordingly ie leave/family commitments etc).
Pitoss, FYO the guys who went accross to the B777 from the 'Bus (of which there were about half a dozen -- WOW!) had to do 6 months in the RHS first which still meant they were at least 4 years to command, so what's your point? (BTW guys who came from the B777 to the Airbus about 5 years ago didn't have to do the RHS bit). And mate if you think any part of this crapfest makes me happy, then you are a much bigger Tw@t than I originally had you down for -- and that's saying something!
When your course date has been displayed on the portal for several months, and you have a personal letter from 'Fleet Management' on your dining room table stating your course date and telling you to get all your pre command bits done such as Psyc, Tech test and Interview (hope that answers your question B Bonga?), only to have a crappy XL spreadsheet suddenly appear on the portal saying your course is delayed indefinately (with little or no logical reason) and not a personal letter from the same person----now thats illogical and piss poor man management and basically unprofessional and 'kin rude------now that would be bad enough right? Then to find out that DEC's are gonna take your command spot???? Just think about it guys, its one big kick in the balls! (not to mention the fact that people had actually planned the rest of the year accordingly ie leave/family commitments etc).
Pitoss, FYO the guys who went accross to the B777 from the 'Bus (of which there were about half a dozen -- WOW!) had to do 6 months in the RHS first which still meant they were at least 4 years to command, so what's your point? (BTW guys who came from the B777 to the Airbus about 5 years ago didn't have to do the RHS bit). And mate if you think any part of this crapfest makes me happy, then you are a much bigger Tw@t than I originally had you down for -- and that's saying something!
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Oblasspop,
I think I made myself clear about what I think: No DEC's until all the F/Os and accelerate commands are upgraded. This is in all fleets. It is clearly not fair with the airbus and Boeing guys and the letter you received is a real shame and I understand your frustration; however I believe that if you read your previous post you'll see that is totally contradictory your suggestion of hiring DEC's for the B777, especially because they are already doing it!
I won't continue with this pointless discussion.
I wish you all the best when your time finally comes.
Pitoss
I think I made myself clear about what I think: No DEC's until all the F/Os and accelerate commands are upgraded. This is in all fleets. It is clearly not fair with the airbus and Boeing guys and the letter you received is a real shame and I understand your frustration; however I believe that if you read your previous post you'll see that is totally contradictory your suggestion of hiring DEC's for the B777, especially because they are already doing it!
I won't continue with this pointless discussion.
I wish you all the best when your time finally comes.
Pitoss
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Oblasspop
are junior F/O s on the boeing less experienced than junior F/O on the airbus in EK????or is that the entitlement thing again?or maybe 3 years on the AB is worth more to you in experience than the Boeing...just ani inocent question ....moaner
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another
I feel sorry for the Bus guys being shafted once again.
As many said it before : this comes as no surprise....
EK is a M-E company.... They will do whatever suits them the best and they don't give a damn about YOU....
Promises, emails, letters, other stuff in written is worth NOTHING over here... Please bend over.... it won't hurt...
Wonder when they will start harressing the B fleet. It's a matter of months...
One last thing....
Maybe they might slow down upgrades with their new low-cost startup in the making. Where do you think they will find the skippers for that 737 or 320 operation? Yes, exactly...(check what is happening over at EY)....
In the mean time they could recruit another couple of hundred of DECs....
I hope it is nothing more than a bad dream.....
As many said it before : this comes as no surprise....
EK is a M-E company.... They will do whatever suits them the best and they don't give a damn about YOU....
Promises, emails, letters, other stuff in written is worth NOTHING over here... Please bend over.... it won't hurt...
Wonder when they will start harressing the B fleet. It's a matter of months...
One last thing....
Maybe they might slow down upgrades with their new low-cost startup in the making. Where do you think they will find the skippers for that 737 or 320 operation? Yes, exactly...(check what is happening over at EY)....
In the mean time they could recruit another couple of hundred of DECs....
I hope it is nothing more than a bad dream.....
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Well if things get any worse in europe you will have a flood of DEC and FO that will change the landscape there for a while recruitmentwise. Just think ryr laying of lots of ex cadet 738 skippers all of 23 yo . Endless supply of dec for you. They wouldnt lower the requirements to fit would the...nah surely not.
.
The bubble is bursting and noone will escape the shockwave.
At least we can eat , dont depend on handout rice to survive which is the result of the current trends for many. So maybe it isnt that bad ...relatively speaking.
.
The bubble is bursting and noone will escape the shockwave.
At least we can eat , dont depend on handout rice to survive which is the result of the current trends for many. So maybe it isnt that bad ...relatively speaking.
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This place is certainly divided, and to no fault of any pilot group, but that's all we need; more 25 year old Ryan air types que jumping with their vast "command" experience. Such as RF perhaps...joke.
I feel for the guys disadvantaged, there is two separate companies at EK currently....however, there is something to be said about job security these days. Maybe a big pay raise will lift some spirits.
I feel for the guys disadvantaged, there is two separate companies at EK currently....however, there is something to be said about job security these days. Maybe a big pay raise will lift some spirits.
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But guys why don't you go to the girls at the fleet office and ask rather than spoiling your eyesight in front of a laptop? They know already and they will tell you what the 'delay' is going to be for your staff number... still a pretty good deal to be eligible for command so quickly..
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Poxy
Far Kinars I wonder who is working for the poxy Airline. Well your handle says it all! I am an Airmalta driver and should you need to give some advise next time be advised that we do not accept DEC and it is stated in our ALPA contract. Stick your head out of that sand pit and get your facts right. We are an ALL Airbus fleet.
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What a statement Far kinarss.. so guys from 3rd world airlines dont know much about international flying huh... and have never handled a big jet... wow!!I wonder who the hell are flying those widebodies out from kul to europe,the middle east,the far east,the west and east coast of the us,oz,za,south america...etc... gremlins i guess..
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Fac 2;
are you sure you work for Air Malta?
Your website says you operate B737s and you sure as heck used to even if you dont now so I guess you must be a newbie. Not that I give a
are you sure you work for Air Malta?
Your website says you operate B737s and you sure as heck used to even if you dont now so I guess you must be a newbie. Not that I give a
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Far Kinars you really enjoy digging yourself in the brown stuff do you!! Check my joining date. Are EK employing your level of IQ? Somming is wrong there. Eh lets say 8000 hrs + !!
But there again i am sure you are one of those that slipped the EK net. I don't think your CFI would like to hear you opinion of Airmalta or poxy airline as you put it being an Ex Airmalta himself.
But there again i am sure you are one of those that slipped the EK net. I don't think your CFI would like to hear you opinion of Airmalta or poxy airline as you put it being an Ex Airmalta himself.
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Fcuked again
Bottom line is there are two airlines within Emirates, Airbus gets treated one way and Boeing another, your luck of the draw which one you're on!
Airbus F/O''s are being shafted because there are 16 DEC's coming on to the A330 and there are some very quiet transfers from the 777 for a select few over to the Bus so that some senior locals can go to the 380 later on.....
The company does'nt give a **** that your upgrade will come a year and 9 months after the 777 guys!!
Take the FOM and use it as toilet paper, it is all it is good for.
Airbus F/O''s are being shafted because there are 16 DEC's coming on to the A330 and there are some very quiet transfers from the 777 for a select few over to the Bus so that some senior locals can go to the 380 later on.....
The company does'nt give a **** that your upgrade will come a year and 9 months after the 777 guys!!
Take the FOM and use it as toilet paper, it is all it is good for.
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Dont worry the upgrades will become longer on the 777as well, think they are already starting to. When the 380's start showing up the bus will get back on track a bit, work down towards 3.5 years but only for a short time than both fleets will slow down. WHY? Short of F/O's in the door, the short term fix DEC's ... on both fleets
Have fun
I am out of here
Have fun
I am out of here
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Ladies 'n Gents,
I've skimmed through this whole thread twice and it is sure lookin' like tough luck for several A332/340 FOs.
I agree with the problems faced by all FOs who have been given indications (promises is too strong a word I reckon) that time to command would be 'round 3 years. Sentiment bein' what it is I looked at the EK Flight Crew portal and tried to make sense of what fleet manglement has scribed there in way of explanation on the career managment link and the Airbus upgrades for '08... it's typical mealy-mouthed EK doublespeak... long on words, short on clarity and there's a dearth of truth.
I have also heard from a reliable source about a sudden injection of DECs on the Airbus fleet which is the real source of the delay to the upgrade training. I jus' passed over the seniority list and I don't see any DECs on the Airbus yet, but they may well be comin'.
I reckon there may be valuable and valid commercial reasons for grabbin' some more DECs... this does make business sense occassionally, even though it hurts loyal competent FOs recruited under the guise of a different path to command. FOs affected by DECs take note: they are all junior to you! Relax. Most of y'all are young enough to absorb a few months more crappy FO pay before y'all get yer commands.
But wouldn't it be nice if manglement just quit playin' ****ty games and told the truth fer a change? Gawd I'm sick of this stupid back steppin', power trippin' bull****tin'. Like an FO I flew with recently said to a perty young gal who was bringin' us a coffee and sat 'n the jumpseat fer a chat: (I do think she liked that young FO!) "You know how to tell when management is lyin'?" (She was young and took the bait
"How"
"Their lips are moving!".
BTW, if that young FO played his cards right, I reckon he's become that gal's newest best friend...
I've skimmed through this whole thread twice and it is sure lookin' like tough luck for several A332/340 FOs.
I agree with the problems faced by all FOs who have been given indications (promises is too strong a word I reckon) that time to command would be 'round 3 years. Sentiment bein' what it is I looked at the EK Flight Crew portal and tried to make sense of what fleet manglement has scribed there in way of explanation on the career managment link and the Airbus upgrades for '08... it's typical mealy-mouthed EK doublespeak... long on words, short on clarity and there's a dearth of truth.
I have also heard from a reliable source about a sudden injection of DECs on the Airbus fleet which is the real source of the delay to the upgrade training. I jus' passed over the seniority list and I don't see any DECs on the Airbus yet, but they may well be comin'.
I reckon there may be valuable and valid commercial reasons for grabbin' some more DECs... this does make business sense occassionally, even though it hurts loyal competent FOs recruited under the guise of a different path to command. FOs affected by DECs take note: they are all junior to you! Relax. Most of y'all are young enough to absorb a few months more crappy FO pay before y'all get yer commands.
But wouldn't it be nice if manglement just quit playin' ****ty games and told the truth fer a change? Gawd I'm sick of this stupid back steppin', power trippin' bull****tin'. Like an FO I flew with recently said to a perty young gal who was bringin' us a coffee and sat 'n the jumpseat fer a chat: (I do think she liked that young FO!) "You know how to tell when management is lyin'?" (She was young and took the bait
"How""Their lips are moving!".
BTW, if that young FO played his cards right, I reckon he's become that gal's newest best friend...
