What happened to the EK FEB roster??
Join Date: Jan 2008
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What would be wrong with informing the pilots about the new "policy," so we're all in the loop? Why should something like this, if it absolutely must be instigated by some petty, small-minded individual, then be kept a BIG SECRET??? It speaks volumes of the opinion of the pilots by management that they do not even bother to let the news out in advance of the action. It also says something of of a certain lack of integrity that they obviously know it will be unpopular and therefore slip in the new "policy" duing the SNEAKY cover of darkness and without anyone taking credit for it. Gutless and without balls.
Join Date: Sep 1999
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Oh dear this looks really bad doesn't it. If W1 is right and 6 days off is the new black, then anyone commuting farther than Europe or Africa are scr3w3d.
Is this a cunning plan taking into account the possible global recession and the full use of factoring?
Or is it Ol' Blue reacting after a long night of being wound up in the tent?
Either way we have to fight it guys. Even if it does not affect your life personally, even though writing into the FM probably won't change anything, we have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. The proverbial frog in hot water comes to mind again.
Is this a cunning plan taking into account the possible global recession and the full use of factoring?
Or is it Ol' Blue reacting after a long night of being wound up in the tent?
Either way we have to fight it guys. Even if it does not affect your life personally, even though writing into the FM probably won't change anything, we have to draw a line in the sand somewhere. The proverbial frog in hot water comes to mind again.
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Sorry not to reply earlier. Without clearly identifying myself to the obviously reading management I can confirm that the information in my previous post is correct for sure. Sad indeed and another terrible misjudgement by in my opinion AAR
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Interesting how this manual intervention policy has affected the rosters of those in the top bid group this month. A number of guys bid for ULR flights and a decent string of days off. CRS gave them what they wanted (that's what it was designed for). It allocated the hours within the bracket, which worked out just slightly into productivity.
Then, our friend came along, and inserted a couple of extra flights to ensure those strings were broken. Result; top bid guys doing 90-95 hrs (purely to screw up the days off), and others in lower bid groups with rosters around 70-75hrs.
What an example of biting off your nose to spite your face. Spend money out of the productivity budget just to ensure that nobody can commute, or indeed simply have a reasonable rest between ULR flying)
This also shows management's immaturity in operating a safe ULR operation. They want ULR flying with minimum rest, but refuse to accept that once someone has done their share of hours, that they should then have time off to recover.
During the dark days of the Airbus "factoring", ULR flights were mixed with night turnarounds, leading eventually to a large increase in fatigue related illnesses. I thought the company had learnt their lesson that this was counter-productive in the long or even medium term, but it seems management here has a very short memory.
Best thing we could do right now is help those who have manual insertions..take their turnaround flights if you're able, and let them have their days off strings. That will negate this ridiculous "unofficial" policy, at least for this month, and force them to publish the policy if they want to stop swaps that create a long string. I for one am happy to help out this month if I can, because I'm not just not interested in doing ULR-night turn-ULR patterns when it's my turn to bid for a decent roster. )Ironically I'm bottom bid this month and have an easy, mid 70's roster..amazing)
Anybody have any other suggestions how we can put up some passive resistance to this short of bulls**t?
Then, our friend came along, and inserted a couple of extra flights to ensure those strings were broken. Result; top bid guys doing 90-95 hrs (purely to screw up the days off), and others in lower bid groups with rosters around 70-75hrs.
What an example of biting off your nose to spite your face. Spend money out of the productivity budget just to ensure that nobody can commute, or indeed simply have a reasonable rest between ULR flying)
This also shows management's immaturity in operating a safe ULR operation. They want ULR flying with minimum rest, but refuse to accept that once someone has done their share of hours, that they should then have time off to recover.
During the dark days of the Airbus "factoring", ULR flights were mixed with night turnarounds, leading eventually to a large increase in fatigue related illnesses. I thought the company had learnt their lesson that this was counter-productive in the long or even medium term, but it seems management here has a very short memory.
Best thing we could do right now is help those who have manual insertions..take their turnaround flights if you're able, and let them have their days off strings. That will negate this ridiculous "unofficial" policy, at least for this month, and force them to publish the policy if they want to stop swaps that create a long string. I for one am happy to help out this month if I can, because I'm not just not interested in doing ULR-night turn-ULR patterns when it's my turn to bid for a decent roster. )Ironically I'm bottom bid this month and have an easy, mid 70's roster..amazing)
Anybody have any other suggestions how we can put up some passive resistance to this short of bulls**t?
Join Date: Jun 2001
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During the dark days of the Airbus "factoring", ULR flights were mixed with night turnarounds, leading eventually to a large increase in fatigue related illnesses. I thought the company had learnt their lesson that this was counter-productive in the long or even medium term, but it seems management here has a very short memory.
Of course I could be wrong. Everything is just fine and we just don't know how good we have it. It will all be better when us whingers just leave.
(Hey, I made the century mark. Do I qualify for a Golden 411 award?)
Join Date: Oct 2004
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True FM, but doesn't solve the manual insertion problem for the guys who have strings of days off and want to go away somewhere. Not a good idea to press 2 from overseas. Otherwise we'll get to the point of having our passports checked like Cabin Services do with the cabin crew.
Better to organise a swap, and get your days off anyway. Until AAR is forced to admit and announce his over the top policy officially, there should be no valid reason for rostering to deny a swap.
Better to organise a swap, and get your days off anyway. Until AAR is forced to admit and announce his over the top policy officially, there should be no valid reason for rostering to deny a swap.
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Did my bid as every month (standing bid), second from top in February. You guess it? 10 days off in a row (as requested), then nicely interrupted by a f
g turnaround. Last month (third from top) it worked, the month before it worked. So the higher you go, the sh..tier your roster? WHAT IS WRONG WITH THESE GUYS??? They wanna retain and lure pilots...not like that, my friends! Scw you! These strings were my only reason for swapping ships, now I am in the same hell again as on the Bus before! So there it is: Swapping airline soon. Scw you again!
g turnaround. Last month (third from top) it worked, the month before it worked. So the higher you go, the sh..tier your roster? WHAT IS WRONG WITH THESE GUYS??? They wanna retain and lure pilots...not like that, my friends! Scw you! These strings were my only reason for swapping ships, now I am in the same hell again as on the Bus before! So there it is: Swapping airline soon. Scw you again!
Join Date: Aug 2002
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Like most guys I have been following this thread with disbelief and like most guys I am digusted and disappointed by this new policy that Ek mis-managment seem to have implemented.
Has anybody e-mailed/talked to managment about this? Might be a silly question but as im not in Dubai at the mo was wondering if its officially official??
Over and out
Has anybody e-mailed/talked to managment about this? Might be a silly question but as im not in Dubai at the mo was wondering if its officially official??
Over and out
Join Date: Mar 2004
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As usual the moaning on Pprune but I doubt anyone has put in any formal complaint which would require an explanation.
Simply put, someone in the top bid group who was disadvantaged should take it through whatever formal grievance channels the company has and demand explanation. This will elicit a formal reply and from this reply the matter can be escallated again. I.e. If there has been a policy change it should be promulgated and if the system is being deliberately corrupted for no good reason, the culprit should be brought forward for explanation.
Anyone who has been here for an appreciable amount of time should know that writing emails, making phone calls etc. is a complete waste of time. The matter will be passed around until everyone gets bored or something else distracts them. Standard management technique.
Pprune is a great forum for raising awareness and sharing viewpoints but as a method for challenging the system it is largely ineffective. Hence the pilots generally have a good moan and then get steamrolled.
Simply put, someone in the top bid group who was disadvantaged should take it through whatever formal grievance channels the company has and demand explanation. This will elicit a formal reply and from this reply the matter can be escallated again. I.e. If there has been a policy change it should be promulgated and if the system is being deliberately corrupted for no good reason, the culprit should be brought forward for explanation.
Anyone who has been here for an appreciable amount of time should know that writing emails, making phone calls etc. is a complete waste of time. The matter will be passed around until everyone gets bored or something else distracts them. Standard management technique.
Pprune is a great forum for raising awareness and sharing viewpoints but as a method for challenging the system it is largely ineffective. Hence the pilots generally have a good moan and then get steamrolled.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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i still dont believe this until its officially published ....or it just for FEB month (i know it sad for you guys) ....i only enjoy my rosters only in the two top months which is twice a year (10 months to be accurate) and the rest i spend 1 minute putting my standing bid ....shame on you 
Join Date: Mar 2004
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I heard today that something "official" had been put out limiting days off in a row to 6. Nothing on the crew portal though.
Does anyone know anything about it? Was it released in some other forum?
Does anyone know anything about it? Was it released in some other forum?
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This is NOT good news to those of us who are deciding to join in the near future.
Although you cannot use EK as a commuting type job, it seems ridiculous that guys on their top bid groups are being penalized for..... absolutely nothing!
Not good...
Kapitanleutnant
Although you cannot use EK as a commuting type job, it seems ridiculous that guys on their top bid groups are being penalized for..... absolutely nothing!
Not good...
Kapitanleutnant
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Bottom line is if EK has an idea that the flight crew are happy about something, such as strings of days off, then there must be a cost-saving in getting rid of it, even if there isn't.
This philosophy came to a head with TCK who couldn't sleep if he thought that crew were getting away with something such as, for example, being paid whilst on leave.
AAR would say "Happy pilots are lazy pilots".
I would say "Happy pilots are productive pilots".
EK might be wise to appreciate this.
This philosophy came to a head with TCK who couldn't sleep if he thought that crew were getting away with something such as, for example, being paid whilst on leave.
AAR would say "Happy pilots are lazy pilots".
I would say "Happy pilots are productive pilots".
EK might be wise to appreciate this.
TC
Join Date: Oct 2007
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All of this talk on pprune won't solve anything.
Reading about the problems that we have on other threads, rosters, ERP, inflight rest on IAH, pay and so on will not be resolved if we only talk about it.
so...........
Reading about the problems that we have on other threads, rosters, ERP, inflight rest on IAH, pay and so on will not be resolved if we only talk about it.
so...........
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Chaps
Read between the lines. The training department is critically short, line guys have a great lifestyle so why not make the line rosters crap to get the chaps to join the training department.......very short sighted, but that's the way do business, even if we are expanding at the great rate ever. It's cost neutral, this way the trainers won't leave to go to the line and we don't have to increase the appointment allowance.
Bunch of tw@ts
Read between the lines. The training department is critically short, line guys have a great lifestyle so why not make the line rosters crap to get the chaps to join the training department.......very short sighted, but that's the way do business, even if we are expanding at the great rate ever. It's cost neutral, this way the trainers won't leave to go to the line and we don't have to increase the appointment allowance.
Bunch of tw@ts