Does Emirates ban their pilots from sitting in the cabin during ULR flights?
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This original post I think was started by a disgruntled Etihader. I can't blame him I am disgruntled to.
Our BCRC is the most basic they could install. No IFE, No bedding just the aforementioned bussiness blankett which reaches my knees and an economy pillow. No sleep suits. I am curious as to what standard other so called National Airlines apoint this. I think it is terribly inadequate and demenostrates the incredibly inept leadership from EY management.
The bunks are slept in on average 12 to 18 hours per day without basic bedding. Would we accept a hotel that provided a towel over a bare mattress for rest. We all fart slobber and expell various bodily fluids in the bunk and our management at EY think it is fit for rest, and deny a break in an empty FC seat. Shame on them.
Our BCRC is the most basic they could install. No IFE, No bedding just the aforementioned bussiness blankett which reaches my knees and an economy pillow. No sleep suits. I am curious as to what standard other so called National Airlines apoint this. I think it is terribly inadequate and demenostrates the incredibly inept leadership from EY management.
The bunks are slept in on average 12 to 18 hours per day without basic bedding. Would we accept a hotel that provided a towel over a bare mattress for rest. We all fart slobber and expell various bodily fluids in the bunk and our management at EY think it is fit for rest, and deny a break in an empty FC seat. Shame on them.
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Farting , slobbering and expelling bodily fluids are not acceptable behaviour in first.
Maybe with the 380 they can prvide a staff tunnel to access and egress from the bcrc. Then it will be just like a country house with the staff ever present but never seen.
Maybe with the 380 they can prvide a staff tunnel to access and egress from the bcrc. Then it will be just like a country house with the staff ever present but never seen.
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A passenger view
How about looking at it another way...ie from the point of view the the FC passenger..yes, the guy that pays your wages! All airlines spend millions building up the image of their brand, and the pinnacle of that effort is the First Class cabin. Guess what people buy when they go for FC (as opposed to Business)..nope, it is not just a comfy seat and a better brand of champagne.. It is two things: exclusivity and privacy. So, these people pay thousands of dollars for that and then, ah ha, they suddenly find themselves in the company of the hired help.
I'm sorry, but if I pay to dine in a swanky restaurant I don't expect to end up eating with the chef or the head waiter.
Yes, yes, yes, you guys are important and need to be well rested etc etc, but at the end of the day you are 'working' and the passenger is the customer.
Get over it, and if you want horizontal rest go to the rest area.
I'm sorry, but if I pay to dine in a swanky restaurant I don't expect to end up eating with the chef or the head waiter.
Yes, yes, yes, you guys are important and need to be well rested etc etc, but at the end of the day you are 'working' and the passenger is the customer.
Get over it, and if you want horizontal rest go to the rest area.
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I am amazed. You are the commanders of that ship. You should be able to sit ANYWHERE you fcuking please. You guys are weak. Stand up for yourselves and stop being such wimps. Show them who is boss. Enough of this pussyfooting around management etc.
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Manuel; when you travel on a five star luxury cruise liner all the guests clamour to get invited to sit at the Captains table at least once on the cruise.
We are not the hired help, we are the Master and Commander of the ship. when we travel home we travel in FC, not steerage. What we are talking about is resting properly in a comfortable environement so that everyone on board is safe.
Talking a break in first class does not diminish it's service, it enhances the airlines safety.
We are not the hired help, we are the Master and Commander of the ship. when we travel home we travel in FC, not steerage. What we are talking about is resting properly in a comfortable environement so that everyone on board is safe.
Talking a break in first class does not diminish it's service, it enhances the airlines safety.
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I can't believe the detour this debate has taken. Surely the real question is one posed way back on page 1 and not followed up by anyone since - the question of a crew made up of one captain and two FOs and the very real possibility that in he event of a really serious emergency, (e.g., depressurisation, cabin smoke/fire), the captain might not be able to get back to the flight deck from the aft "cheap seats" crew rest areas our "eyes-always-on-the-bottom-line" management have decided is appropriate? (Or should I replace "is appropriate" with "will do"?)
. Above all, don't forget to smile while you're doing it
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There is no regulation preventing rest in any seat on the aircraft. In fact on aircraft without bulk crew rest we have 1 j/k kept for us just for that purpose. Anything to the contrary is rumour and nothing more.
That said, I would never inconvenience a customer whilst getting [U]required[U] rest. If a seat had been allocated which potentially could inconvenience a customer, I always went and spoke to them to explain the situation. I never had a problem. Sadly, we do have some idiots that feel the world revolves around them and do not display simple common decency. If a seat has not been allocated, discretion is the word of the day.
The vitriol expressed to Manuel is sad, he has a point. That said most people that eat in swanky restaurants are always trying to get on the good side of the maitre 'd so that they get a table in the first place.
That said, I would never inconvenience a customer whilst getting [U]required[U] rest. If a seat had been allocated which potentially could inconvenience a customer, I always went and spoke to them to explain the situation. I never had a problem. Sadly, we do have some idiots that feel the world revolves around them and do not display simple common decency. If a seat has not been allocated, discretion is the word of the day.
The vitriol expressed to Manuel is sad, he has a point. That said most people that eat in swanky restaurants are always trying to get on the good side of the maitre 'd so that they get a table in the first place.
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Masters and Commanders
OK, OK, I get your point guys. Next time I have open heart surgery I'll ask the doc to lie down beside me to get some kip and make me feel that little bit safer.
But, thanks Ghostflyer for your balance wisdom, your commonsense approach is appreciated.
But, thanks Ghostflyer for your balance wisdom, your commonsense approach is appreciated.
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open heart surgery
Doors to Manuel
The main difference is if you are having open heart surgery means that you are close to the other side of the fence , but a commander of an acft is in charge of 300 + passengers in perfect good health enjoying their meal/drinks and who are confident that they will be landed safely.
The main difference is if you are having open heart surgery means that you are close to the other side of the fence , but a commander of an acft is in charge of 300 + passengers in perfect good health enjoying their meal/drinks and who are confident that they will be landed safely.
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Farting, slobbering etc in First not acceptable? Well in the real world may be but what about the savages that pay to be there? They do far worse! By the way what sort of Pilot allows a junior member of the crew to impose rules on them. Sure, they can have an opinion but you are in charge or 2IC - harden up and show some leadership.
DIRECTOR
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Perhaps it should be pointed out that passengers in whatever area of the aircraft they are sitting in only pay for the seat that they occupy.What the airline does with other seats is up to them within good marketing reasons.
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For "privacy" just shut the door of the suite.
For another "good marketing reason" provide the customer with well rested pilots for a safe operation.
If anyone insists that for beeing well rested one may be confined to lie in a tube and refraimed from sitting in a comfortable chair, they're either airline management or desperately in need of some education about human physical nature. Probably both.
GMDS
For another "good marketing reason" provide the customer with well rested pilots for a safe operation.
If anyone insists that for beeing well rested one may be confined to lie in a tube and refraimed from sitting in a comfortable chair, they're either airline management or desperately in need of some education about human physical nature. Probably both.
GMDS
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Unfortunately in the eyes of the elite first class, pilots are just workers , slaves for the cause.
These people dont want to sit next to a stinking worker. Pilots stink, and you are being paid accordingly If another airline goes broke with the high oil prices or merger activity (delta/united) flood the market wath your t & C s go down again. The companies have many rabbits they pull from their hats , there will be no big payrise....................and a total ban on FC travel will probably eventuate , and they will use the excuse of some pilot abusing it on duty.... Watch................
These people dont want to sit next to a stinking worker. Pilots stink, and you are being paid accordingly If another airline goes broke with the high oil prices or merger activity (delta/united) flood the market wath your t & C s go down again. The companies have many rabbits they pull from their hats , there will be no big payrise....................and a total ban on FC travel will probably eventuate , and they will use the excuse of some pilot abusing it on duty.... Watch................
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I thought the FC pax only paid the seat that he/she is sitting on not the whole cabin, so what right does he/she has with regard to other seats in the cabin???
Just take out your uniform, wear civy's and walk confidently into the cabin and sit quietly, people might not notice it....
Just take out your uniform, wear civy's and walk confidently into the cabin and sit quietly, people might not notice it....
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Door to Manual and Trashed Aviator
You might see yourself as hired help and smelly. I use soap and know how to behave in first or in the company of the elite. The fact remains they buy a seat not the aircraft. For the life of me I can’t see how supplying a seat in the front will reduce the exclusivety. If you regard yourself as hired help, then you regard your line of work as degrading and your position in the company as cheap and meaningless. I, and I think the rest of the pilot community, don’t. For the informed few know; what it entails to become a successful and professional aviator! If the company, whoever they might be, don’t want to supply a bunk in the front for the flight deck crew, a seat must be available. For safety, being close to the flight deck, in the unlikely event of an emergency, makes commonsense!!! No other reason. It’s for the same reason they don’t want you wondering down the back with a normal(less than 8 hours) leg. Is to be close to the flight deck, just in case. Not saying that two F/Os can’t do the job as a team. I would imagine that the Captain’s, you know what, that has to be accountable for everything that happens, once released, would like some input! Not stuck in a bunk 50m to the back, or fighting pax off, wanting to give there two cents worth, while the sh..t is hitting the Fan.
You might see yourself as hired help and smelly. I use soap and know how to behave in first or in the company of the elite. The fact remains they buy a seat not the aircraft. For the life of me I can’t see how supplying a seat in the front will reduce the exclusivety. If you regard yourself as hired help, then you regard your line of work as degrading and your position in the company as cheap and meaningless. I, and I think the rest of the pilot community, don’t. For the informed few know; what it entails to become a successful and professional aviator! If the company, whoever they might be, don’t want to supply a bunk in the front for the flight deck crew, a seat must be available. For safety, being close to the flight deck, in the unlikely event of an emergency, makes commonsense!!! No other reason. It’s for the same reason they don’t want you wondering down the back with a normal(less than 8 hours) leg. Is to be close to the flight deck, just in case. Not saying that two F/Os can’t do the job as a team. I would imagine that the Captain’s, you know what, that has to be accountable for everything that happens, once released, would like some input! Not stuck in a bunk 50m to the back, or fighting pax off, wanting to give there two cents worth, while the sh..t is hitting the Fan.