EK New Trainers
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2000
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EK New Trainers
Having previously touched on the subject I would like to offer a topic of conversation.
Why are trainers paid more than line pilots?
1. Line pilots generate revenue for the company
2.Trainers do not
3. We have some (experienced within Emirates) trainers who have something to offer to the rest of us; and in this case fine
4. The new ones do not
5. If you are a newbie put the time in; then apply for trainer. We dont want DEC or 6 month Captains (even if your dad owns a little airline).
Why are trainers paid more than line pilots?
1. Line pilots generate revenue for the company
2.Trainers do not
3. We have some (experienced within Emirates) trainers who have something to offer to the rest of us; and in this case fine
4. The new ones do not
5. If you are a newbie put the time in; then apply for trainer. We dont want DEC or 6 month Captains (even if your dad owns a little airline).
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,118
Likes: 140
From: overthere
Lets see. There are 1500ish pilots. Less than 450 of which have been with the airline for 6yrs (well thats what the seniors list on the wall in the CBC shows!). Taking the past 3, and now 4yrs to get a command, where exactly are all these long timers you are looking for to go training going to come from MT?
Seems a bit unfair to blame all trainers for the failings of a few.
Don
Seems a bit unfair to blame all trainers for the failings of a few.
Don
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 123
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From: charleroi
Because the best job in aviation is Line Captain, consequently nobody with any sense would be a TC without some pocket lining. Bar the odd ones who do it for self interest and kudos, and they're the worst trainers of the lot.
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 37
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From: Earth
I thought that after 3 days of interviewing, psycho. testing, and group excercises etc etc EK 'should' employ the best of the best.
However after reading so many posts against DEC's, 3rd world country pilots, now trainers I am thinking differently. Are the recruiters now after immature people?
However after reading so many posts against DEC's, 3rd world country pilots, now trainers I am thinking differently. Are the recruiters now after immature people?
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 357
Likes: 1
From: The Pilot Grinder
Mack you do come out with some funny stuff sometimes....like that one you started about "not fair that those that have bought a house shouldn't get utility increases so they can pay the mortgage off".... lol
I wait with anxious anticipation for the next hilarious topic my friend.
I wait with anxious anticipation for the next hilarious topic my friend.
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
From: Narnia
Mack Tuck,
God (or Allah) forbid you ever try to, or ever attempted to get into BA. How would you have slotted in with a lower life form (read First Officer) doing your PPC's for you, regardless of which seat you occupy?
Yep, good old BA and some other major carriers utilise training F/O's........................now what would they know about anything!
The question has to be asked that if it works with that level of experience, with the correct selection and training for the trainer, why do you think that a trainer has to have been in the left seat for a millenium before being able to train?
I have occasionally flown with guys who have been in the left seat a long time, who I wouldn't trust with a bicycle, let alone a huge pile of French or American tin.
I don't really see your argument on this one. With proper career development and reasonable/relevant experience along with aptitude and motivation, a trainer could really be anyone from within the pilot ranks.
God (or Allah) forbid you ever try to, or ever attempted to get into BA. How would you have slotted in with a lower life form (read First Officer) doing your PPC's for you, regardless of which seat you occupy?
Yep, good old BA and some other major carriers utilise training F/O's........................now what would they know about anything!
The question has to be asked that if it works with that level of experience, with the correct selection and training for the trainer, why do you think that a trainer has to have been in the left seat for a millenium before being able to train?
I have occasionally flown with guys who have been in the left seat a long time, who I wouldn't trust with a bicycle, let alone a huge pile of French or American tin.
I don't really see your argument on this one. With proper career development and reasonable/relevant experience along with aptitude and motivation, a trainer could really be anyone from within the pilot ranks.
Last edited by Jolly Foreigner; 29th September 2006 at 04:37.
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 123
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From: charleroi
Some years ago Emirates introduced Training First Officers. The program died an early death for several reasons, one minor one being the poor performance shown by one of the TFO's on his own command course.
Not sure if PPRuNe really needs three Emirates Training threads this week but the message coming through on all threads is that there are some good trainers and some bad ones and probably some average ones.
How different does this sound to many other airlines?
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 277
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From: Australia
I think that the big problem with training F/Os in EK is that by the time the guy has been around long enough to take on the job, get trained and starts training he will be due for his upgrade and lost to the training department.
So why bother?
So why bother?
Joined: Oct 1998
Posts: 29
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From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
No wonder Max Tug has a dicky ticker when he continues to post about his 'distress at FO upgrade delays' and how he 'fully supports the concept of seniority' (but obviously not the practice, while he applies for DEC jobs), the woeful standard of new hires, (before he joined, surely!), how he doesn't like the yanks, the brits, the ozzies, Dubai, the NZ 'scabs', etc (must be running out of friends). And he'll moan about the fact he didn't buy property, (better investment than a Harley though!), can't get another job, blah blah blah........All very contentious, stressful issues when you are such a hypocrite!
You support all the FO's at EK with such conviction on this forum, but do you still insist that the transport drops you home before the FO regardless of where he lives, and continue to treat them with contempt in the cockpit?
Don't big note yourself here, w@nker.
You have been on about trainers for ages; become one and solve all he worlds problems or shut up and go back to whining about your 'dispute'.
Oops, being suckered in again.
End of rant for another 8 years.
You support all the FO's at EK with such conviction on this forum, but do you still insist that the transport drops you home before the FO regardless of where he lives, and continue to treat them with contempt in the cockpit?
Don't big note yourself here, w@nker.
You have been on about trainers for ages; become one and solve all he worlds problems or shut up and go back to whining about your 'dispute'.
Oops, being suckered in again.
End of rant for another 8 years.
Last edited by flyonthewall; 28th September 2006 at 17:17. Reason: Update!
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 435
Likes: 5
From: Bolivia
Having being involved in EK threads on Prune for many years, the common thread amongst whingers goes something like this.
When they are F/O's, all captains and trainers are incompetent. When they get upgraded, the standard of New Hires has fallen to appalling levels. And when they become trainers, it is how much better the training department is now that they are taking in new fresh blood.
In truth the problem is that we are all trying to work within the framework that our appalling management provides us. That accounts for the stress recruiting are under, the lower standard of new hires, the lack of respect for seniority, the crap conditions trainers get and therefore the lack of interest from senior guys.
Dont blame the people who are trying to do a job. Blame the management for creating the environment which has cause all this to occur.
V
When they are F/O's, all captains and trainers are incompetent. When they get upgraded, the standard of New Hires has fallen to appalling levels. And when they become trainers, it is how much better the training department is now that they are taking in new fresh blood.
In truth the problem is that we are all trying to work within the framework that our appalling management provides us. That accounts for the stress recruiting are under, the lower standard of new hires, the lack of respect for seniority, the crap conditions trainers get and therefore the lack of interest from senior guys.
Dont blame the people who are trying to do a job. Blame the management for creating the environment which has cause all this to occur.
V
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,140
Likes: 0
From: Gulf playing Golf
Everybody hates someone around here... MAD TRUCKER hates most! But then he is a superiour aviator.
All this is good for management...keep the boys and girls slightly off balance!
Managements duties are not to make friends with the employees, just to make money for the owners, and support the evolution of Dubai.
Just accept it. So next time someone, who has never been to Khartoum wants you to bring minimum fuel and be a good boy if they call you, remember YOU are the last line of defense. Noone else..YOU
All this is good for management...keep the boys and girls slightly off balance!
Managements duties are not to make friends with the employees, just to make money for the owners, and support the evolution of Dubai.
Just accept it. So next time someone, who has never been to Khartoum wants you to bring minimum fuel and be a good boy if they call you, remember YOU are the last line of defense. Noone else..YOU
