Is Ek the right job for you?
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 846
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It is somewhat ironic that the problems in the US Airline industry are mainly as a result of 9/11 caused by the Taliban giving sanctuary to Bin Laden. And who were the main financial backers of the Taliban? Why the UAE!!
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 846
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WK indeed why,the UAE. Don't think it should have a question mark at the end as it is a statement. What do you think? As you are barely out of school you should know!
Save me from smart a**e F/O's of 3 years and four months standing! If you are not careful I will apply for that Chief Pilot job on the 330/340!!
Save me from smart a**e F/O's of 3 years and four months standing! If you are not careful I will apply for that Chief Pilot job on the 330/340!!
Good point about the question mark - I'll edit it grandad
If you want to apply for CP 330/340 feel free, maybe you could get together with Brian and job share - cr@p job after all, for management wannabes
If you want to apply for CP 330/340 feel free, maybe you could get together with Brian and job share - cr@p job after all, for management wannabes
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: In the State of Perpetual Confusion
Posts: 185
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Kpt40
Gillegan,
Thank you for the post.
As you said the US scene is different. We all had expectations that never materialized. You pointed out in a previous post, the option of leaveing Ek and going to the states is a slim proposition since you would start at the bottom of someones list. You fail to notice that for some its that they have been on the bottom for years, wondering if in the next week they will have to update that resume for Starbucks.
I will not get into a -how much the job sucks in the states- conversation.Some are golden and will never feel pain, some will get a brick to the head at indoc. Suffice it to say that almost all of us have been impacted to some degree.
To think the majority of new joiners and perspective new joiners leave our homes, friends, famililies and the comfort of own culture because we like the weather in Dubai, or Taipei, or Goa, is a tad naive.We left because the options left for us in the States are rather limited. Very few United 777 Captains will leave UAL for Dubai. Even fewer FedEx Captains..... But the rest of us,who will end our careers in a 170/190, or 737, or a 320...for them its a completely different ball game. Same for the guys who used to be 73 captains but have been knocked back to f/o at age 50 with not enough years left to get the left hand seat back.
I too did the cost/benefit study on Ek vs my other options. As have a few other new joiners. But my career expectations are not based on flying a heavy in the states. I would end my career as a 73 captain-thats just age and corporate dynamics.The financial benefits of that are more limiting than comparing my pay to a 777 UAL captain-even after the pay cuts.
I believe the other American you are talking about is Typhoon. In all my conversations with him- either on line or in person, he has been very forthright and honest. What many people here fail to grasp is that one persons negative is not as important to someone else. We all make our own choices and live with that decision. Typhoon understands that and never sugar coated anything in our conversations.
On my first post I used it as a disclaimer- and two very quickly pointed out that they can read yet not understand-I am still new here, and I may be wearing rose colored Serengetis, but EK is a better option for me and my family than my options in the States . If that offends some of the habitual posters then so be it.
I concede that you and other senior posters are more knowledgeable about Dubai and Ek. Please accept that I have not been in your shoes....Nor you in mine.
Thank you for the post.
As you said the US scene is different. We all had expectations that never materialized. You pointed out in a previous post, the option of leaveing Ek and going to the states is a slim proposition since you would start at the bottom of someones list. You fail to notice that for some its that they have been on the bottom for years, wondering if in the next week they will have to update that resume for Starbucks.
I will not get into a -how much the job sucks in the states- conversation.Some are golden and will never feel pain, some will get a brick to the head at indoc. Suffice it to say that almost all of us have been impacted to some degree.
To think the majority of new joiners and perspective new joiners leave our homes, friends, famililies and the comfort of own culture because we like the weather in Dubai, or Taipei, or Goa, is a tad naive.We left because the options left for us in the States are rather limited. Very few United 777 Captains will leave UAL for Dubai. Even fewer FedEx Captains..... But the rest of us,who will end our careers in a 170/190, or 737, or a 320...for them its a completely different ball game. Same for the guys who used to be 73 captains but have been knocked back to f/o at age 50 with not enough years left to get the left hand seat back.
I too did the cost/benefit study on Ek vs my other options. As have a few other new joiners. But my career expectations are not based on flying a heavy in the states. I would end my career as a 73 captain-thats just age and corporate dynamics.The financial benefits of that are more limiting than comparing my pay to a 777 UAL captain-even after the pay cuts.
I believe the other American you are talking about is Typhoon. In all my conversations with him- either on line or in person, he has been very forthright and honest. What many people here fail to grasp is that one persons negative is not as important to someone else. We all make our own choices and live with that decision. Typhoon understands that and never sugar coated anything in our conversations.
On my first post I used it as a disclaimer- and two very quickly pointed out that they can read yet not understand-I am still new here, and I may be wearing rose colored Serengetis, but EK is a better option for me and my family than my options in the States . If that offends some of the habitual posters then so be it.
I concede that you and other senior posters are more knowledgeable about Dubai and Ek. Please accept that I have not been in your shoes....Nor you in mine.
I don't think that you need to apologize about coming here and I do understand the comparisons that you mentioned. I think that you understand where some of us are coming from and at least a few of us understand where you're coming from. As you said, some are golden and lead a charmed life and others don't. What I am angry about is that the pay and conditions at one of the most profitable airlines in the world are determined by the least common denominator of failed airlines in bankruptcy that are losing millions a day. I understand that Emirates has to control their costs but after arbitrarily reducing our pay a year and a half ago (and make no bones about it, that is what they did), our increases have been a fraction of the increases in the cost of living here. If you read the annual report and if you have been here a few years, the company's overall focus has been cut costs, cut costs, cut costs for a long time now. Should they be continuously looking for new and untapped efficiencies in the way we do business? Absolutely. Should they be looking for more sources of revenue? Yes, and they are. Should they also be looking for ways to improve the operation and how we do business. Yes. Unfortunately I don't feel that has been a particular area of concern. I can't remember the last change in procedures or processes that wasn't done to just cut costs. What has also happened is that a lot of their cost cutting initiatives have been borne by the employees themselves. This at a time when the cost of living in Dubai is increasing precipitously. Just look at these bizarre and ever changing policies on promotion and transfer. They are not efficient. The easy route (and it's easier here than in most places) is to simply take it out on the employees and in many cases, that's what they have done. The longer you have been here, the more you have been affected by this. It's only natural that people get fed up.
As far as which cheerleaders I was referring to, while I think that Typhoon could be a little more transparent regarding how things have worked out for him (and he and I have discussed this many times over beers - I consider him a good friend) he does make an effort to present the other side. I was actually referring to others whose wardrobe is of the plaid variety. Right now, if others are to be believed, we stand to take in a number of retired captains from DAL who have other sources of income (retirement) and in many cases a lower cost base (read grown children). Their availability and willingness to come here is skewing the market and depressing my wages. Do I expect the company to not take advantage of it? No but I don't have to be happy about it either.
Regarding whether it is a valid comparison to compare my conditions with a UAL B777 captain - I would say absolutely, to the extent that the market for pilots is the same - and since Emirates is now trolling around in the states for DEC's, I maintain that it is. What would be the straw that breaks my camels back is if the company again goes down that route where they offer incoming DEC's more than captains that already work here. That is tacit acknowledgement that they are not paying market wages. You look at it differently and I guess that is the market talking but the company should also take care of its people and I just don't feel that I have been a valued employee by this company the last few years.
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: The sinking sandpit
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
maybe I will learn to enjoy the shafting as much as you guys do, and stay as long as you have. "Thank you Sir
Yep that just about sums up the 'Keep Discovering experience'
Your mission should you choose to accept it, never go into denial that you are being shafted and more importantly try not to enjoy it
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: From a suitcase
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What I will say is that, for me and mine, its (sic) a better opportunity than was available in the states.
Even when the real situation was pointed out to them in not to be misunderstood terms, all they could say was “I just want to work.” So did the people they were replacing.
I know the situation in Dubai isn’t the same as Australia in 1989, but what is common is the incredible arrogance of American pilots who think that THEIR problems should take precedence over all others’.
Many who take up the EK offer will find that the vast majority of their new colleagues share the sentiments of the poster who said earlier in this thread
It's just I am getting a bit fed up of the Yanks telling us why we should be so happy...
They whine about the US aviation industry, how poorly paid they are ,demotions etc
They whine about the US aviation industry, how poorly paid they are ,demotions etc
