EK Overseas Basings.
Thread Starter
Overseas Bases in Emirates....
Due to the shortage of secondary school places in DXB, have Emirates considered basing crews down-route .
I have been considering applying however, the school issue is a major concern to many.
I have been considering applying however, the school issue is a major concern to many.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There have been a couple of "basing" proposals put forward over the years. The most recent one was 2-3 years ago, and the company response, in writing, was a resounding "no". Wouldn't hold your breath on that one.
Anybody considering coming to Dubai must make the decision based on what conditions are at their time of joining. DO NOT expect anything to change for the better. This has all been discussed extensively on the "Ek pilot's meeting" thread if you want more info.
Cheers!
Anybody considering coming to Dubai must make the decision based on what conditions are at their time of joining. DO NOT expect anything to change for the better. This has all been discussed extensively on the "Ek pilot's meeting" thread if you want more info.
Cheers!
Thread Starter
What exactly was their opposition to overseas basings. will their hand be forced by the overcrowding in Dubai.
CX have had crews based down-route for years,seems to work for them ?...
CX have had crews based down-route for years,seems to work for them ?...
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 120
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Emirates and DXB is all about bringing people and money to the UAE. Emirates is by far the biggest employer in DXB and as such contributes a massive amount of money, indirectly, to the local economy, by way of its staff living here. By moving staff overseas, all that money is lost.
So, yes it is arguably operationally better to have staff based (like Cathay), but it doesn't meet the requirements of the government to bring money to DXB. The operating profit of the company comes a distant second to this overiding philosophy. As a case in point, Ek could easily base much of its cabin crew workforce and save millions of dirhams in salaries and accomodation. But they choose to keep them here regardless of the cost impact on the company's bottom line.
I suggest that the only reason that basings will ever be offered is if reasonable jobs are offered O/S that allow people to live in their home coutries, and we start to lose large numbers of drivers.
dmf
So, yes it is arguably operationally better to have staff based (like Cathay), but it doesn't meet the requirements of the government to bring money to DXB. The operating profit of the company comes a distant second to this overiding philosophy. As a case in point, Ek could easily base much of its cabin crew workforce and save millions of dirhams in salaries and accomodation. But they choose to keep them here regardless of the cost impact on the company's bottom line.
I suggest that the only reason that basings will ever be offered is if reasonable jobs are offered O/S that allow people to live in their home coutries, and we start to lose large numbers of drivers.
dmf
Thread Starter
Dmf,
Thanks for that, It's just wishful thinking on my behalf..you don't think the tides are turning then ? DXB isn't the holy grail it once was. I suppose if and when EK have problems recruiting the right quality of pilots they may well reconsider an o/seas base and try and attract some locals.
cheers, Propaganda.
Thanks for that, It's just wishful thinking on my behalf..you don't think the tides are turning then ? DXB isn't the holy grail it once was. I suppose if and when EK have problems recruiting the right quality of pilots they may well reconsider an o/seas base and try and attract some locals.
cheers, Propaganda.
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 846
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seaman Staynes
So you do need any more locals eh??
Judging by the JNB incident EK as sure as hell needs something.Can you inform us as to what EK does need rather than telling us what it does not.?
So you do need any more locals eh??
Judging by the JNB incident EK as sure as hell needs something.Can you inform us as to what EK does need rather than telling us what it does not.?
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 846
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Seaman Staynes Thanks for your reply. We need all that you need as well in SQ!!
Back to overseas basings.
SQ were slow to realise the perceived benefits to their bottom line by employing ex BA 55ers on 744 based London especially when exchange rate was around $2.6 =£stg as they were paid in Sterling and none of them were prepared to join if it meant sitting in Singapore ,so that is what happened. Now with $3.15= £stg it is costing them more to employ them also no one thought about how much Singapore Inc would lose out by them not paying Singapore Tax or spending money in Singapore because they are based overseas.
SQ also like to have control of their Pilots as do EK and others I am sure so they were very reluctant to go down the overseas basing route but money was the deciding factor at the time.
Carry on with your dreams!
Back to overseas basings.
SQ were slow to realise the perceived benefits to their bottom line by employing ex BA 55ers on 744 based London especially when exchange rate was around $2.6 =£stg as they were paid in Sterling and none of them were prepared to join if it meant sitting in Singapore ,so that is what happened. Now with $3.15= £stg it is costing them more to employ them also no one thought about how much Singapore Inc would lose out by them not paying Singapore Tax or spending money in Singapore because they are based overseas.
SQ also like to have control of their Pilots as do EK and others I am sure so they were very reluctant to go down the overseas basing route but money was the deciding factor at the time.
Carry on with your dreams!
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: manchester
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tax is the key issue.
Emirates pay rates are very low I'm afraid.
No one could afford to pay tax and living expenses outside Dubai on those rates - so you have to live in DXB. (School issues amy not matter to some.)
Emirates pay rates are very low I'm afraid.
No one could afford to pay tax and living expenses outside Dubai on those rates - so you have to live in DXB. (School issues amy not matter to some.)
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: sandpit
Posts: 135
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There is no tax here, petrol is cheaper than bottled water: it's a great place, the sun shines for 364 and a half days a year. Schooling is expensive, and because of the heat, sport for kids, out-doors is not good. Boarding schools inOZ/ SA are approx one 3rd of Dubai day schools, and just as good if not better. The money saved can be spent on ID 90's to visit. I'd rather be on Jumeira Beach than Brighton Beach anytime. No comparison.
tic
tic
Tic,
Is life so bad in the UK that a bit of sunshine in Dubai justifies crap schooling, split families and poor pay!!!!
There are a lot of good things with EK. Mostly work mates.....but really all this talk of sunshine and sitting on the beach does not pay the mortage!
Think of the poor fella who must be joining soon (if not already) who is going to have to survive for a long time on FO pay, as all the commands are taken!!!!!
When work mates get sacked to help cover up other issues, it proves we are all living on borrowed time.
Kids grow up way too quickly..and to have no choice (as many pilots have no choice as of this September) but to send your kids thousands of miles away to get an education...is not a good option (well its not outside of the UK anyway!).
I don't think I ever saw anything other than praise written about EK prior to a few years ago. But then its agenda changed. First with our training department, then with the rest of flight ops. And all we can do is look on as our contract is further erroded.
Wearing the rose tinted glasses does not help our plight...and is certainly not fair to those who are considering giving up good jobs to come here to work. At least try and be truthful, so they may make a fully informed decision.
There are a lot of good things about Dubai and EK. But I think you would be fibbing to mention the pay and education on that list.
Rant over...will now enjoy yet another min rest (like everyone else) before before facing yet another sun rise!
Don
Is life so bad in the UK that a bit of sunshine in Dubai justifies crap schooling, split families and poor pay!!!!
There are a lot of good things with EK. Mostly work mates.....but really all this talk of sunshine and sitting on the beach does not pay the mortage!
Think of the poor fella who must be joining soon (if not already) who is going to have to survive for a long time on FO pay, as all the commands are taken!!!!!
When work mates get sacked to help cover up other issues, it proves we are all living on borrowed time.
Kids grow up way too quickly..and to have no choice (as many pilots have no choice as of this September) but to send your kids thousands of miles away to get an education...is not a good option (well its not outside of the UK anyway!).
I don't think I ever saw anything other than praise written about EK prior to a few years ago. But then its agenda changed. First with our training department, then with the rest of flight ops. And all we can do is look on as our contract is further erroded.
Wearing the rose tinted glasses does not help our plight...and is certainly not fair to those who are considering giving up good jobs to come here to work. At least try and be truthful, so they may make a fully informed decision.
There are a lot of good things about Dubai and EK. But I think you would be fibbing to mention the pay and education on that list.
Rant over...will now enjoy yet another min rest (like everyone else) before before facing yet another sun rise!
Don
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: middle east
Posts: 101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don Maaaaaate
To help you out with your current condition I am going to prescribe you one trip back to the Great South Land for a few xxxx's, a lie on the beach, and a huge dose of cultcha.
Keep on smilin you old B*****d
The Rev
To help you out with your current condition I am going to prescribe you one trip back to the Great South Land for a few xxxx's, a lie on the beach, and a huge dose of cultcha.
Keep on smilin you old B*****d
The Rev
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Dubai
Posts: 212
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The reason why there will never be a basing is because the EK lawyers advise against it. It would make EK vulnerable to law suits outside Dubai and they don’t like that at all.
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Dubai
Posts: 768
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If you think there is no tax in Dubai, your'e dreaming
What are
Visa's
Import tax (on everything)
Booze shop tax
Extra school fees
Expats paying more for utilities
Wages not adjusted upwards over the last 10 years to match countries with a tax system.
Of course there is tax its just called something else
What are
Visa's
Import tax (on everything)
Booze shop tax
Extra school fees
Expats paying more for utilities
Wages not adjusted upwards over the last 10 years to match countries with a tax system.
Of course there is tax its just called something else
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Far Away
Posts: 158
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A few points:_If EK want to keep the money in town,then why dont Cathay keep all that money in HK??
Basings/offline basing make total sense,in many ways,but whether it will happen at EK,remains to be seen,I think the "money in Dubai" is a smokescreen,mast pilots send large amounts home,the day after pay day.
With an A340 stuck downroute,through sickness,or tech,and looking to A380,cancelling flights downroute(AKL?SYD?JFK?) will have major implications,for crew duty limits,and getting crew together.
Mr Knowles was opposed to commuters(why??),but the new system is proving so far to give decent spells of time off,and with him gone,several trainers,returning for better rosters,the number of existing commuters,is set to increase,not decrease.
To expound the problem,are issues such as lack of school places,and they dont happen overnight,housing could also be a problem.
I dont think basings are for everyone,but for EK to "offer" a basing,as an option,in your career,would be a real attraction to many prospective EK pilots.IMHO.
I for one will watch the coming months and years with interest.
QB