Pilot suffers cardiac arrest in flight
 

Apologies if this has been covered here already. I searched but did not find it. Austrian newssite (news.ORF.at) reported United Airlines Flight 1603 (737) en route from Houston to Seattle diverted to Boise, Idaho after one of the pilots suffered a cardiac arrest. CPR performed by two physicians travelling on the plane. Negative final outcome, it appears. Very sad and unfortunate.
CBS has something now, too: Pilot suffers heart attack in mid air, plane diverts to Boise - CBS 5 - KPHO

I heard it this morning on the TV news (in Seattle). One of the passengers interviewed said they got down to Boise pretty fast (20 minutes) after the incident began.

What is the policy of airlines carrying AEDs (automated defibrillators) onboard?

Copied and pasted from another news outlet..

Passenger Ken Martin says a woman sitting next to him volunteered to help perform CPR because she is a first year resident doctor. She told Martin the pilot was a heavy man, weighing more than 300 pounds, and they had to move him out of the cockpit and into the first class cabin to perform CPR.

Perhaps with some pilots electing to fly past 60 and others "obese" perhaps it's time the likes of FAA, TC, JAA actually take these medicals seriously... A 300 lbs pilot should not be at control of an airplane in my mind. Give them a gym membership and a few months off, get below a threshold and have the company Docs continue to monitor his condition and progress. Overweight is one thing but 300 lbs (unless he is 8 foot tall) is not good at all.

It is very sad that this gentleman had to lose his life over it, and I know not everyone is into fitness and proper diet with the same interest as others but there really should be a minimum acceptable level and once surpassed you have to get yourself back to that minimum healthy (ish) standard in order to fly... With the sedentary lifestyle that pilots are at risk of falling into I think everyone should do a better job from us as pilots, to our unions/pilot associations and the companies in order to promote better health.

Some guys take the Age 65 Fly 'til you die approach a little too seriously.

The assumption that because he, was overweight, gave him a heart attack is nonsense. In the past 35-45 year old pilots have had attacks and in a more or less a fit conditions. You can come out of a medical, walk up some stairs and have a stroke. Not very usual but, it can happen and has in the past. At the moment of your medical and if deemed fit, pass all the checks, you are legally ok to fly. In this case, 300lbs. seems a bit on the heavy side but, there again, how tall, fit etc. was this individual? In any case sad and terrible for his family, friends and colleagues.

In contrast, Arnold Schwarzenegger, at his heaviest back in 1974' weighed in at around 245lbs.

It's not like we didn't already know this but just in case....

Quote from a paper called "Obesity and Cardiovascular DiseaseRisk Factor, Paradox, and Impact of Weight Loss" from JACC Journals.

Still a very sad story for the involved people and family.

If you guys start going after the heavier folks, you will have to go after the smokers too

This is exactly why they should get rid of the medical requirements completely. They can't predict it even in the most stringent class - the class 1 medical holders!

Pilot suffers cardiac arrest in flight
 

It is unfortunate, maybe a pilot that was lighter and easier to get out of the cockpit would have stood a better chance with CPR being administered sooner.

In other words: in 50% of the cases of coronary heart disease, the first symptom is sudden death.

Adam

Correct. An ECG can detect heart irregularities, etc. It cannot predict HF. You can pass an ECG at a class 1 medical and drop dead an hour later.


Una

I don't think smokers should be allowed near an aircraft. They not only have physiological issues, they have psychological issues also. If they don't take their own well being seriously, then how the hell can I expect them to have a passengers' well being in mind. Addicts should be treated and cured before being allowed to have a class 1.

Well this coming from the airline that didn't hire a former space shuttle commander(too much of an ego) but packed the cockpits with all the affirmative action 200 hrs they could find off the bottom of the resume pile.

It's criminally unproffessional and irresponsible to have obese pilots in the cockpit. Not only is it a statement on the pilot who was unhealthy, possibly in denial about his health problems, an addiction to food, but an organization that supports stuffing anyone into the cockpit that will play ball and fit their socially engineered concept of 'getting along'.

Well, he does have an ego but at least he went to a profitable airline and avoided bankrupt UAL. And, as Walt Whitman, Dizzy Dean, George Jones and others have observed, 'if you done it, it ain't bragging'. ;)

See: The Man Who?s Flown Everything | Flight Today | Air & Space Magazine

Well he was former Continental, an Air Force guy close to retirement, does that make it clearer for you ?

Awesome job on the assumptions !

Exactly the same logic applies to the Obese, of course

Local news is reporting he was 63.

I'll get my popcorn....

Yup, you may as well Huck, they will be along soon!

Being aviation it is high profile and got appropriate publicity because it happened 'in the saddle', what got a lot less publicity was the legacy carrier SFO who, on the same day, at the age of forty two, dropped dead on the golf course! (also cardiac arrest).

This from the great journalistic site, "Huffington Post:"

The captain was piloting United Flight 1603 from Houston to Seattle when the emergency occurred Thursday forcing an off-duty pilot to take over control of the plane.

Yeah, right.

AdamFrisch:

It can be predicted but not with a resting EKG.

A stress EKG on this poor chap would have undoubtedly found him in the cath lab having an angiogram. Not much doubt remaining when it's done right.

The assumptions and inappropriate statements in this thread are unbecoming of any human being and completely unacceptable from this poor man's colleagues. We have no idea of his lot in life and the 300 lb comment came from an unconfirmed source, making it specious at best and unworthy of consideration at this early stage. As for his age, people should remember that a good portion of the airline pilot population in the US had their pensions decimated in the post 9/11 meltdown. He may have had no choice and if so, he was not alone.

FFS people have some compassion. Often in times like these, family members will look to the internet to see what's been said. How would you like it if your family was reading such insensitive things about YOU!

I am sure the FO would have handled the landing just fine because he had experience. Not so sure about the 200 hr wonders. Having a qualified pilot in back non reving was a nice advantage but I am sure he would have been fine.

With all the speculation about obesity, other than a single post (unless I missed one) do we have any confirmation of his weight?

According to what I've heard from various sources
300lbs appears to be correct.

Slightly off topic but in Japan the highest permitted
BMI by JCAB is 30. I used to laugh it off as being
far too conservative but lately I think they're pretty
much on the mark. Over the 30 is definitely risky if
visceral fat is also taken into consideration.

boy...some great thoughts..>NOT

Jim Fixx, the author of the book on running was in great health and died at 40 of cardiac arrest or something like it

mikedreamer:


Really not off topic at all.

If it weren't for ALPA and the cheap airline companies, BMI would be a big deal, as it should be.

" Jim Fixx, the author of the book on running was in great health and died at 40 of cardiac arrest or something like it "

Actually, if I remember correctly, the reason Jim Fixx began runnng is that early cardiac death was very prevelant in his family. Though he still passed away at a young age, he lived longer than his father and other relatives did.

Well I agree that big fat smokers and 150hr captains shouldn't just be allowed to fly planes, we should screen for them!

I mean as long as we are hiring off the bottom of the resume pile, lets see if we can really scrape the bottom of the barrel. Lets get some handicapped people in there...more people on meds, since that's ok now, and why not someone with epilepsy...how about a former Guantano prisoner? Fully reformed I am sure. We can lower the age from 23 as well down to say 16? I mean if they can drive a car...why not an Airbus!

Aterpster - I have to admit I was always nudging
28 until the wife said unless I lost weight there're
gonna be some... things... she won't do anymore.

Suffice to say I went on a rabbit food diet and
went to a BMI of 25 in a matter of weeks! :}

Had that happen to me on an AA flight DFW-DCA a few years back. FO had the attack as soon as we hit level flight and we dropped like a stone to get into Kansas City. Capt said FO was able to man comms until the final approach. Made for a real sporty ride in an MD-80 dropping from 32k' to WOW in less than 15 minutes tops!

We were in first row that biz class that flight so I got a chance to chat with Capt as we waited on the deck for the relief crew to land and take us on to DCA. He said the saving grace was that this was this guys 3rd or 4th attack so he knew the early signs and allowed them to declare emergency and begin decent before it got too far. (So my next question is why a guy with prev heart attacks was behind the sticks and not manning the sims or the flight manual desk!)

WOW!
 

Firstly lets try to remember that this man most likely had a family that loved him and will miss him terribly. Can we stop the personal attacks until maybe he is in his grave.

For the rest of us who are lucky enough to still be with the living maybe we should look at our own health and life style choices before we judge some one we never knew.

Take a look at the you tube video forks over knives.:=

Occasionally, a pilot will die in the cockpit, that's why we need 2 qualified and trained pilots in front. Get over it.

I started aviation as a 200-hour ab initio in a 150-pax airliner: difference with today was that I got a proper line training (150 hours with a safety pilot!), and my trainers made damn sure I knew how to get the plane safely to the ground on my own before even thinking about releasing me for normal ops.

Don't expect pilots to be fit like astronauts if you're going to pay them like gas-station attendants. Also don't expect them to retire at 60: they can't afford it!

So the way to safety is to make sure at least 1 trained and reasonably rested pilot remains in an airliner if his colleague dies.

As for not letting smokers near an airplane: bollocks. OTOH, i feel the same about people who believe God is their co-pilot, so who am I to judge )))

ECG while resting is not a garuntee of good health. Stress ECG whie on trade mil is a good indicator of cardio vascular conditions. Internal inflamation is now recognised as major factor for heart attack. C reactive protine is an indicator of that. Some other biochemical tests like Cholestarol, triglycerides, GTT also non invasive MRI is now available for the heart. Age alone is not a factor. Anyone beyond 45 years life style and general fitness plays a large part in longivity. Exceptions will always be thhere. Those are not the criteria. Indian medical requires lot many tests beyond 60 years.

It's about obesity, smoking and a diet full of toxins, not a calendar.
 

I did a little Internet search tonight and found that just since the U.S adopted the age 65 restriction for Part 121, two doctors performing surgery (one was doing heart surgery and the other was doing brain surgery) had heart attacks. But I don't see the same hue-and-cry about that.

People can smoke if they wish, but I don't think they should be allowed a Class 1 medical. Smoking increases risk of cardiac arrest, and reduces time to LOC in a decompression.

When I started flying............. I would occasionally be working in the Nav. seat at the back of the flight deck behind two PIPE smoking pilots, it was IFR INSIDE the aircraft.

Fortunately I could lift the curtains that blocked the nav desk light for night flying, and wear an oxygen mask. Made it a bit difficult to use the sextant tho' so occasionally I had to take a deep breath for each 2 minute star shot.

I renewed my Class 1 at the ripe old age of 75 ( not for commercial pax carrying ops. I might add ) but then, for no reason other than age, the CAA insisted that I take a treadmill ECG. The Cardio. expressed concern that I might be driving home, and 2 weeks later I was the proud possessor of 2 arterial stents.

What p***es me off tho' is that for maybe a full 6 months before presenting myself for a Class 1 renewal again, I could have legally flown a 747 - from a medical point of view - with the undiagnosed problem that ultimately resulted in my two stents, but a problem was detected, fixed, and now I'm physically better than I was in that preceeding 6 months, but they won't even allow me a Class 2.

I've beaten the buggers tho', they can't get their sticky fingers on my microlight ticket, that's a different protocol.

Mustn't grumble, they probably saved my life, but what is of real concern is that only because I wanted to continue flying was my problem even detected - how many of those cars hurtling towards you on the other side of the road, at a closing speed in excess of 120 mph, are being driven by guys who have NEVER seen a doctor ?

I've seen some terrible posts here. Just awful.

I read that a 51 year old DC10 captain had a heart attack on landing rollout, the copilot had to take the plane.

age 51.

people talking about weight factors have not fully researched other problems too.

how about use of drugs, I mean ILLEGAL drugs like pot or cocaine? shall we ban pilots who have ever used these? I'm for that. Let's also ban people from running for the US presidency who smoke, or have used drugs....fine with me.

as to age...;my copilot, age 28 fell asleep in cruise...during his probation year. He can be fired for that...age 28.


I truly believe there should be no upper age limit for pilots...just individual health.

And NO one can truly predict a heart attack...while there are indicators, and more coming each year, no one can predict it with 100 percent certainty.

I would think taking an aspirin daily should be considered by many...sitting from other things...I recall a very slender, wealthy medium age man just walking the streets of New York just keeled over(cardiac arrest)...that man directed and wrote many famous films including, "PLANES,Trains and automobiles"

healthy practices for sure...but the sadness of so many of these posts is disturbing, esp from flyboyike.

we should and must retain at LEAST 2 qualified pilots in the cockpit in case one gets sick. I even know of one case in which a pregnant captain ended up in great distress due to her pregnancy...she was flying on the day before her grounding date due to pregnancy was to happen

Actually, I agree with you. It's sad that people become so desperately dependent on this job that they would rather literally die doing it than consider any kind of an alternative. Capt Skillern clearly had some pretty serious health issues that he likely could have done more to address had he not been busy flying that one more trip. Then another. Then another. Just to make that extra few bucks. Really sad state of affairs we're in.

He lived (or at least crashpadded) in Humble, TX outside of Houston. He died in Boise. His loved ones didn't get to say good-bye to him. What they did get was that terrible phone call. I bet his family would have gladly traded whatever he made in these past three years just to see him again.

At the end of the day, it's really a matter of priorities, isn't it? Do you want to be a big (in this case literally), bad Airline Captain until they carry you out feet first or do you want to be a human being at some point? The fact that so many people seem to choose the former is indeed very sad.

That's the problem...what if your safety pilot had a fatal heart attack? Suddenly the wisdom of using very low time pilots, with no real life experience beyond the training environment, is suspect.