VISION THREAD (other than colour vision)
 

Hey Guys

been trying to see what I can do about my prescription - its around +6.00.

I cant get lasik as the prescription is too high so an alternative is a perspex insertion (intra ocular lens IOL) into the eye on top of my own lens - they dont remove my own lens.

The procedure is pricey - looking at £2400 per eye!

First and foremost, has anyone done it?

Secondly - has your class 1 been re issued/approved after a check up with the medical people?

I'm aware that you need to be within limits pre-surgery blah blah but I'd still like to know.

Thanks a lot

As with most questions on this forum the answer is talk to the CAA Medical Division at Gatwick (01293 567171). They are very helpfull and will be able to give you an answer.

I had mine done in Brussels by a world-class opthal... eye guy and it didn't cost a fraction of that. I could check it out for you.

Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

Hello to all you !

Like many of you, I've got a big passion for aviation since my childhood. Unfortunately, not gifted by Mother Nature with my eyes, I've always heard that I could never a pilot with my vision.
I'm a 30 year old pilot, with a glider pilot licence and 200 flight hours and working as a dispatcher on an airport. But my passion is flying.
I hoped a few years ago that I could go on a CPL training in the USA, my myopia was in the US standards ( - 4.25 both eyes ) even if hadn't gone on a US medical. I was not with french standards either.
And at 20, I discovered that I had a small strabismus ( unvisible when people look at me ).
I considered unnecessary to go on a US medical, spending my money just to hear the doctor at the end telling that I'm unfit because i can't see all the pictures in relief. ( stereoscopic ), just a few ones.
I discovered that since 1996, there is no longer limits for diopters. Just be corrected 20/20.

My problems are :
Myopia ( not small )
Right eye ( -5.75 ( + 0.50 of astigmatism )
Left eye ( -5.50 ( +0.25 of astigmatism )

Too much for European Class 1 admission.

Strabismus:

3 diopters prisms beside my correction. ( FAA standards have a limit at 6 diopters prisms for esophoria ).

I have already read some people concerned with a problem of strabismus.
I know that medical standards are going in a better way with vision.
Would it be possible to get a FAA Class 1, in my case. Because it shouldn't be possible to get a JAA Class 1. ( In England or in France ). They're very strict in France ( I'm French ).
I'm sorry to be so long with my story, but I would be very happy to have comments from people in the same case as me, who could get a Class 1 in the USA or in Europe.
Thank you very much for answering me.

I am not totally sure I understand exactly what is the main problem with your eyes. Do you meet the renewal requirements for the JAA medical? If so then the UK will issue you a class 1 deviation and will allow you to train and gain your licence.

I don't think you will have any problem with your strabismus as long as you do not have double vision. They do not test your stereoscopic vision.

My main problem blinkz is the my stereoscopic vision which is not perfect.
For JAA, of course my myopia is within renewal standards ( - 8 diopters if I'm right ) but not within admission standards ( - 5 diopters, I don't know if deviation is possible in that case ), but is OK for FAA.
This year I met a colleague of mine, operated in childhood for esophoria as well, ( but with 24/20 vision )who succeded to get a canadian and a FAA Class 1. ( Sometimes Miss Luck comes by your side !)

Do you confirm Jimmy ? If I'm right , I remember that you're concerned , aren't you ?

There is no stereoscopic vision requirement.
Don't do your medical France. France thinks they are better that the rest of europe and therefore they have their own requirements.

And by the way. you do not have esophoria you have esotropia.

ah ok, talk to the UK CAA and they will give you some good advice. If you can meet the renewal limits then the CAA will most likely issue you with an intial class 1.

Ok i'm going to give a call to the CAA in order to know what could be my chances.
Yes in France, they always think they know about things better than the others but things are changing with new rules
since June in accordance with JAA.
( - 8 / + 5 diopters for renewal).
Hope that a deviation is possible.
Otherwise, stays the US option.

Excuse me Jimmy but as a friend told me, he was tested by FAA doctor for stereoscopic vision.

Other comments are welcome.

I know for sure that the FAA does not require stereopsis tests.
Maybe some doctors test it just to see the quality of the binoccular vision.

I think that you will not have any problems with JAA medical. Maybe for the FAA you will need to do a SODA since they are a bit stricter with strabismus.

Anyway, best thing to do is to take a medical and see what they say.

Ok Jimmy. Let's try with CAA how things can go.
I'm surprised that FAA is stricter than JAA.
I thought that it was the contrary.
Anyway, as you read in my previous post I'm in the limits for FAA and CAA for my esophoria prisms ( 3 diopters prisms ) . It just remains that i won't be able to see all the 3 D pictures for JAA Class 1.
The only way to know is trying.

Merry Christmas, everybody !

eyes...
 

hey chaps,

just wondering if anybody could help me out in figuring out whether i would pass a class 1 medical with the condition of my eyes. i already have a class 2... so perhaps i may pass?

here are the details:

Sph Cyl Axis
-3.25 -0.25 165
-3.25 -0.50 15

I wear both glasses as well as contacts. Any body know anything about the requirements?

any feedback wud be great.

cheers.

You should be fine with that, class 1 limit is -5

oh good deal...

don't want to get to -5 ... im assuming it gets worse with age. jeez.

probably shud start dosing up on the vitamin A eh? :)

thanks for the input Blinkz

you should be fine mate, the -5 limit is only for inital issue of the class 1, after that it goes up to -8 :ok: and I think that when you get older your eyes tend to go longsighted.

Re: eyes...
 

Check google for either natural vision or vision improvement. I have cut my nearsightedness in half. It is a matter of being able to relax the muscles in the eye when you are nearsighted.

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

Just to clarify a previous post, esophoria is a hidden or latent extra-ocular muscle imbalance. In other words it is a condition for a tendency for the eyes to either move inwards (esophoria) or outwards (exophoria). The presence of an eso- or exo-phoria is not noticeable when simply looking at someone, it can only be detected under certain test conditions. However, a tropia (esotropia or exotropia) is a visible "squint" and is obviously noticeable to anyone who would see an eye squinting either inwards or outwards.

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

Hello Capetonian.

Abslolutely, in my case it is clear , it is about esophoria. Hidden squint. It can be detected by tests done by an orthoptist ( among them , ball and stereocopic pictures ). It is not noticeable when looking at me .

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

FAA does require Eso/Exophoria test for class 1 and 2.

Rest of Jimmy tG's posts is correct.

If you fall within renewal criteria but are outside initial criteria CAA can issue class 2 which can be converted to a class one when you get your CPL.

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

I had an extended opthalmological (sp) examination in February at Gatwick. I was under the impression that LASIK was allowable but that ICL (implantable contact lens) were not. The optician there pointed out that this is not true - they treat each case on an individual basis, implication being that ICL's may be acceptable.

You could write to them/phone, or even book an extended opthalmology. Don't expect them to offer any encouragement though.

If you haven't done so already, I'd run your prescription past all of the LASIK providers. They all seem to have different treatment ranges.

Good luck.

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

I think that when this was discussed a few months ago, it was mentioned that the lens implant was reversible. This is a major factor in making a decision I would think.

Surely, +- 6 is just outside the range for the CAA to accept the correction with LASIC? Yes or no, I would not make that bigger change to my eyesight by merely altering the front of the eye. It's never the same again.

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

Alex/Loose Rivets

Yep I'm too far gone for Lasik and even if I met a clinic who stretched to offer me a solution I woundnt take it. Most seem to say that anything over +4.00 is not an option.

ICL (implantable contact lenses) are reversible so its more appealing to me. Having said that, I'm outside the preop limits anyway so I could go through the pain of the op (in my pocket!) and still get turned down. I'm still considering it though as flying is all I want to do.

Thanks for the continued info.:ok:

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

Beware that even with the best ophthamologic surgeons and best materials and techniques there are complications possible. Some of which may mean that your vision deteriorates.

Reversible is not the same as popping a contact lens in and out.

Bear all of this in mind when you decide to go down this route. You don't want to get in a worse position than you are in now.

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

Ok . FAA DOES require eso/exophoria tests for Class 1 and Class 2.
I should try to contact one FAA doctor in France and the CAA.

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

If it is only 3 diopters of esophoria there is nothing to worry about.
Your freind that had surgery did not have the same condition as yours.
The only thing is your prescription is a bit high but that will not be a problem for FAA medical and I don't think for JAA. I strongly recommend that you take an FAA medical exam in France and a JAA medical in the UK.
If I where you I would not worry so much about the medical instead I would worry much more about the following.
1) How are you going to finance your training without getting bankrupt.
2) How are you going to get a job.
Just to give you a taste. I graduated in 1998 with an ATPL and I have about 1600 hours of that 500 hours Multi-engine PIC.
Since then I have sent out about 2000 CV's (no kidding) and got only one interview. All my savings goes to flying and books in order to keep current and up to date.
I am 30 years old and I would really like to start a family but I need to wait for that job to come.....If I ever will get one.
Ín the situation I am right now I am not even able to have a girlfreind.
Last time I got laid was 4 years ago :{
If you ask me if I regret that I became a pilot the answere is....YES but it is vey hard to accept the fact that I may never get that job. All the money and effort I have put down on this, it is vey hard to just throw it away and say that I will do something else.
I would rather be a medical doctor and keep flying as a hobby.
These two problems are far more serious than your 3 diopters of esophoria or the lack of seeing stereoscopic images.

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

I had "new lenses" put in both eyes just about a year ago primarily to repair cataract damage (years of sun abuse). I had mine done here in Singapore and although my licence still has a use of glasses clause, I have not had to wear them since my op.
I am very happy with the results but you must get "good" advice first.

Laser Eye Surgery
 

Hi there,

Is there anyone who had laser eye surgery and flies commercially? Just a bit curious as more and more one can see TV Ads showing all different clinics offering this option.
Is there any restriction when it come to Med Class 1, or are there only designated clinincs that meet CAA/JAA approval?

Is it possible at all?

Thanks
;)

Re: Laser Eye Surgery
 

Hi

Not an expert on this subject but have a friend who had this done. After the surgery he then experianced vision problems in the simulater (Dark background and bright lights). This was obviously a scare for him and had to stop flying.

He was them refered to another laser Surgeon who specialises in flight crew and after more surgery the problem was fixed fortunately for him.

Good Luck

Re: Laser Eye Surgery
 

I'm no eye surgeon but...

One of the after effects of LASIK is that your eye has to readjust to the 'new' lens and so the pupil and controlling muscles have to recalibrate for want of a better word.

This means that in the dark (or in any high contrast environment - e.g. office lighting) your pupil, at it's most extensive, may be larger / smaller than necessary to allow the 'new' lens to focus all the light on the retina and so a blurring effect can occur.

I was told this would last for about 2 weeks. At first I accepted it. I had the op in the summer so night driving was limited - and I wouldn't recommend it. For me the blurring lasted six weeks or so and I did start to get concerned that this may be permenant, then the focus at night became pin-sharp as my eye finally adjusted.

Again, not as an expert, I would expect this could be fixed if the eye was re-scanned and LASIK'd. I recall during my scanning and pre-op there was great care taken to measure the pupil at maximum dilation. I was told not to drive for 24hours after the initial eye scans as drops are put in to relax the iris. Go outside in daytime after that and everything is blindingly bright, a look in the mirror shows the iris fully open.

With regards Class I or other medicals. There are certain aspects of your prescription which are taken into consideration BEFORE your LASIK treatment so it is best to check with an AME first before proceeding as the treatment may leave you with fantastic vision but you could still fail to meet the grade due to your pre-op prescription.

Re: Myopia, binocular vision and Class 1
 

Question to all -- Has anyone had any experience/issues with the above topic and airline requirements/exam tolerances? Cathay or other majors?? Does anyone know of their di-opter limits etc??

Re: CAA and lens implants
 

Remember that the intra-ocular lenses (IOL's) implanted in the eyes after cataract surgery (removal of the lens nucleus and cortex) are placed into the "empty" original lens capsule that surrounded the original crystaline lens in the eye.

The implantable lenses referred to in terms of refractive surgery are very different. The original crystalline lens in the eye is not removed and the implantable lens is placed inside the eye, in addition to the original lens.

The procedure and results for operations to implant IOL's for cataract surgery are well established with very good and prectable success rates. However, the procedure for lens implants for refractive surgery is still developing, and as pointed out correctly in a previous post "reversible is not the same as popping a contact lens in and out". As with any form of eye surgery, the possibility of some complications does exist.

Snellen charts difference?
 

Every year I go to the optrician to check my vision.
I have come to the conclusion that the charts are different depending on what kind of chart they use.

In my experience the wall mounted charts have generally more light than the mirror projected charts.
I am very sure that on the wall mounted charts I see about 1-2 lines better than the mirror projected.

Has anyone had similar experience?

Re: Snellen charts difference?
 

hahah..... my case..

Opthalmologist official report
R: 6/24
L: 6/18
Electrically-Illuminated Chart reflected through mirror

Aviation Doctor Official Report in my Class-1
R: 6/60
L: 6/60

hahah using Snell chart pasted on wall illuminated by Daylight

Re: Snellen charts difference?
 

UUUUH if that is your eyesight.........your blind.

I think you got the numbers mixed up.

Re: Snellen charts difference?
 

ok, It is you uncorrected vision that is 6/60.

Re: Snellen charts difference?
 

haha.. well i'm just surprised...

how come both doctor mark my Uncorrected vision so differently?

Dominant eye turns Tyrannical
 

Have had my Class 1 since '97. On the last time out my AME told me I'd need glasses to pass the next one.

The problem is; my left eye can split a hair at 200 yards but the right has, over the years, become a somewhat poorer country cousin.

Should I consult an optician prior to my next renewal, and if so do i now need two pairs of glasses and two sets of prescription sunglasses to be legal on a commercial flight deck?:confused:

On a different tangent, please would someone enlighten me as to what causes this type of offset decline?

Un qualified comments only I'm afraid, but....

Age and nature of the defect would help. Are you getting more long sighted or short sighted? Is there any astigmatism?

Was there always a tendency for the poorer eye to be a little lazy? So that what is happening now is just a worsening of a long term condition.

A precise assessment of the reason that your brain is causing the other eye to be ‘dominant' is needed. Can you improve the bad eye by spending time with the good one covered up. It only takes a few moments for you visual processing to start to ‘re-map'.

There has been some good help on eyesight just lately, but anyone will need plenty of information.

I'm early thirties.

The vision is not so much long or short as just blurry.

Afraid I have no idea what an astigmatism is, but the eye has never been described as lazy previously.